Posted on 07/09/2008 12:15:52 PM PDT by jazusamo
Ok, just remember that if you ever need the Coast Guard to pull you out of the water using one of their HH-65’s
Or the Army National Guard rescuing you off the roof of your house or MEDEVACing you to the nearest hospital in one of their UH-72’s.
Because it’s EADS “junk” and you don’t fly in it if it aint Boeing.
But I’m sure that those brave Coast or National Guardsmen will be nice enough to let you swim or walk though.
No problem as i would prefer a Blackhawk that the coasties use or the US Army uses. or any other helicopter made in the USA. Just like the Tankers/Airlift and Bombers i have worked on for many years. Made by Boeing, MADE IN THE USA. Built to last.
“No problem as i would prefer a Blackhawk that the coasties use or the US Army uses.”
Well you’re going to be SOL if a ‘hawk isn’t available then arnt you?
The only ones who have made it ugly was Boeing and their congressional pitbulls.
In fact, Boeing was singing praises about how fair, and transparent the whole process was......Until it was announced that they lost.
Right.. it puts the EADS lotion on. EADS/NG spent more money than Boeing massaging congress. Put out more BS adds with there phony general add. that they later had to retract.
Well you’re going to be SOL if a ‘hawk isn’t available then arnt you?
Not at all, got plenty of Hawk close by. And Bells..
The big problem with the EADS KC-45 is it cannot do what the RFP called for. It will cost the taxpayers alot more than what it should. Would you want to go into battle with a substandard tank don’t think so. read Gen Foglemans or Gen Handy’s report on this subject then ask us tanker folks what plane is better suited for the tanker mission.
You wanted the manufacturers?
Here they are:
Here is a list of the companies that are onboard with Northrop-Grumman:
Alabama
Airbus
EADS North America
Engelhard Specialty Chemicals (BASF)
GKN - Westland Aerospace Inc.
Goodrich
KBR
PPG Industries
Thompson Engineering
Alaska
Northrop Grumman Technical Services
Arizona
American Aerospace Tech Castings
Goodrich
Honeywell
Intec EDM
L3 Communications
Parker Seal
Arkansas
Triumph Fabrications
California
ACRA Aerospace
Air Master Prod Corp
Alcoa
Ametek Aero
Argo Tech
Avibank Mfg, Inc.v Barry Controls
Carlton Forge Works
Cast Parts Inc.
Circle Seal Controls
City Wire Cloth
Dowkey
Easterline Mason
Eaton Aerospace Corp
Fischer Custom Communication
GKN Aerospace Chem-Tronics
Goodrich Aerostructures Group
Hartwell Corp
Hexcel Composites
Hi-temp Insulation
Honeywell
Independent Forge Co
ITT Aerospace Controls Division
Jet Manufacturing
KGS
Kirkhill Rubber Co.
Meggitt Safety Systems, Inc
Morton Manufacturing
Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems
Northrop Grumman Mission Systems
PAC Industry
Pacific Scientific
Parker
Pentacon Aerospace Group
Phoenix International
PSI Bearings
RBC Transport Dynamics
Schlosser Forge Co.
Stillman Seal
Synergy Microsystems
Teledyne
Thermal Structures Inc.
Transdigm Adelwiggins Group
Viasat
Colorado
GE Polymershapes
General Aluminum Forgings
Goodrich Corporation
Connecticut
AGC Inc.
Alinabal Corp.
B&F Machine
Columbia Manufacturing
Kamatics
Westport International
Delaware
GE Polymershapes
Florida
ABA Industries
BRPH Companies Inc.
EADS North America
Gables Engineering
GE
Kam Specialities
L3 Communications
Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems
Northrop Grumman Technical Services
Pall Aeropower Corp
Georgia
Millennium Solutions Inc.
Parker Hannifin
RCF Seals & Couplings
TIG Hitco
Vought
Idaho
Bamcorp
Illinois
Abrasive Form
Danville Metal Stamping
Hamilton Sundstrand
MPC
Northrop Grumman Electronic Systems
NTN Bearing Corp of America
Indiana
Alcoa
BAE Systems Controls
Honeywell
L&E Engineering
Morris Machine
Praxair Surface Technologies
Reeder & Kline Machine
Iowa
Alcoa
Rockwell Collins
Kansas
Arrow Electronics
Honeywell
Kentucky
Andrews Laser Works
Ellison Surface Technologies
GE Turbine Airfoils
Parker Seal
Parkway Products
Louisiana
Haynes International Inc.
Maine
Prescott Metal
Stewards Fire Extinguisher Svc.
Maryland
Middle River Aircraft Systems
Northrop Grumman Electronic Systems
PerkinElmer Fluid Sciences
Massachusetts
Ametek Aerospace
B&E Tool
Berkshire Manufactured Products
Bomco Inc.
Fenwal Safety System Inc.
Hansen Engineering & Machinery
Northrop Grumman Information Technology
Palmer Manufacturing
Titeflex
Turbine Component Services Goodrich
Wyman-Gordon Forgings
Michigan
Barnes Aerospace
Eaton Aeroquip
Eaton Aerospace
Flexfab LLC
GE
Howmet Corp
Moeller Manufacturing
Parker
Rolled Alloys
Minnesota
Goodrich
Honeywell
Mississippi
Eaton Aeroquip
Missouri
Essex Industries
Montana
General Distributor Co.
Nebraska
Royal Plastic Mfg, Inc.
Nevada
PCC-Structurals
New Hampshire
GE Airfoils
Luminescent (LSI)
New Hampshire Ball Bearing
Smiths Tubular System
New Jersey
Avionic Instruments
Breeze Eastern
Groupe H.T. M. ( Fortech)
Kulite Semiconductor Products, Inc.
Meca Electronics
RS Microwave Co Inc.
New Mexico
GE Fan Cases
Honeywell
Sun Country Industries
New York
Ametek Thermal Systems Inc
Avox Systems
Chromalloy New York
Cox & Co.
Gray Syracuse
Moog Inc.
Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems
Orkal Industries
Telephonics
W S Wilson Corp
North Carolina
AAR Cargo
Allvac Titanium
Allvac Engine Assemblies
Cincinnati Thermal Spray
GE Assemblies
GE Disks
Goodrich
North Dakota
Kildeer Mountain Mfg.
Ohio
Barnes Aerospace
Byron Products
Cincinnati Thermal Spray
Ferco Tech
GE Engines
GE Frames & Shafts
GE Tubes
Goodrich
Goodrich-Ice Protection System Division
Graphel Corp.
Honeywell
Metal Improvement Co.
Northrop Grumman Information Technology
Ohio Gasket & Shim
Parker
PCC-Airfoils Co.
QC Labs
RTI International Inc.
Tool Sales & Service
TW Metals
US Aeroteam
US Chrome Corp.
Oklahoma
Northrop Grumman Technical Service
Oregon
Planar Systems
Precision Castparts Corp.
Pennsylvania
Carpenter Technology
SPS Technologies
Timet
Rhode Island
Tri-Mack Plastics
South Carolina
Phoenix Specialty Mfg
South Dakota
MJ Specialities
Tennessee
Aircraft Safety
Vought Aircraft Industries
Texas
Chelton
Honeywell
Knight Aerospace
Texas Almet
Wyman-Gordon Forgings
Utah
Barnes Aerospace
Hexcel
Klune Precision Casting
Parker
Vermont
GE Airfoils
Goodrich
Virginia
EADS North America
Euro-Composites Corp.
Mecaero Products
Washingtion
Accra Mfg
ELDEC Corp
Exotic Metals Forming Co.
Honeywell
Kaiser Aluminum
West Virginia
Alcan
EADS-CASA
Sargent Fletcher
Star Technologies
Wisconsin
Ladish
Metaltek International
Wyoming
Aviat Aircraft, Inc.
Oh and so nice of you to post Boeings propaganda word for word without a single link to it.
“EADS KC-45 is it cannot do what the RFP called for.”
Says who? Boeing?
Obviously it wasn’t the Air Force who said it, or they wouldn’t have picked the KC-45 now would they?
Fogleman is a paid hack for Boeing, so of course he’s going to be a big cheerleader for the people who write his paycheck.
Not Boeing propaganda not even taken from there web pages.
Now which of those sub contractors are going to building the wings, fuselage ect. those are mainly electronic, engine, tires. wheres the big producers of the plane. FRANCE.
Now the big question
How many years experiance on USAF Airplanes did you say you had. I got over 25 years
How many years Airlift/Tanker experiance. I have over 20 years.
I am not a Boeing PR person I work on there airplanes as i have worked on Lockheed’s, Fairchild republic, Cessna, Northrups’s, MD’s. and have had to help fix a P.O.S. Airbus of course it took almost a month to get the parts.
“EADS/NG spent more money than Boeing massaging congress.”
Proof?
“Put out more BS adds with there phony general add. that they later had to retract.”
Oh you mean like Boeing who’s resorting to running the same ad over and over again because they can’t think of any new lies?
EADS KC-45 is it cannot do what the RFP called for.”
Says who? Boeing?
Obviously it wasn’t the Air Force who said it, or they wouldn’t have picked the KC-45 now would they?
Fogleman is a paid hack for Boeing, so of course he’s going to be a big cheerleader for the people who write his paycheck
A paid hack, he has more credibiblity than anyone out there besides Gen Handy former AMC commander. You must not have read the GAO verdict either.
“Now which of those sub contractors are going to building the wings”
Vought Aircraft Industries in Nashville TN.
The wing skins will be made by GKN Aerospace in Alabama
Alcoa is making the alloys for the fuselage skin
How many years Airlift/Tanker experiance. I have over 20 years.”
And that proves what?
Compared side by side the KC-45 wins hands down.
When analyzed by someone with more knowledge than you and I combined who happened to be the lead airlift/tanker analyst for DOD, the KC-45 wins hands down
“A paid hack, he has more credibiblity”
HOW?
How does he have more credibility? If he doesn’t cheerlead for Boeing he doesn’t get paid. That means that EVERYTHING he says is going to be slanted to favor his paymasters.
EADS/NG spent more money than Boeing massaging congress.”
Proof?
“Put out more BS adds with there phony general add. that they later had to retract.”
Oh you mean like Boeing who’s resorting to running the same ad over and over again because they can’t think of any new lies?
No the 12 some retired generals who were on the payroll who EADS put in there 1 page add but ommitted that they all worked for NG.
Airbus/Northrup spent 7.6 Million
Boeing spent 5.6 Million
And there knowledge left a piss poor contract that was thrown out for rebid.
Find me a tanker crew who wants the EADS vs the Boeing.
HARD TO FIND.
might be for those small joining scab parts.
but the wings and the fuselage are going to be built in europe and shipped to BAMA.
And those analyst have been removed from the rebid. Because they SCREWED UP.
the KC-45 is like the French Chauchat of ww1
while the Boeing is the BAR.
which would our pilots take into the battle. I have yet to find one crew out of 3 squadrons who would want the KC-45. That sums it up pretty much.
That is BS. The GAO vindicated Boeing’s “whining”.
The Air Force changed the rules in midstream and didn’t tell Boeing. you ca slice that cake any way you wnat it, but the process stank and needs to be re-bid. IF Boeing loses, fine. But they should lose fair and square, not by hook and crook, which is what this process delivered.
Might want to go look up who is building the fuselage and wings for the KC-45 and rethink your answer.
Wings and fuselage to be built in europe and shipped.
Because your argument seems to be either driven by locale or some real beef with Boeing and not with the specifics. (I'm guessing that if Airbus is shift procurement of some parts outside of China that Boeing will do the same - but don't know)
Regardless of the past, Airbus and the AF colluded in this procurement: it's not being written up that way but that's how you come up with biased findings, agreements on expanding the specification with one bidder only, and apparent lies told to the other bidder. That's the key - only one of the bidders was in on the joke.
That they also failed to consider the added costs and limited basing options of operating the larger airframe, and assumed total cooperation from some european states that frequently don't cooperate with us too well, are almost understandable.
Finally, that they lied to the public and to Congress regarding the findings behind their decision should mark the end of some more careers.
As to the past, Ms. Druryan (sp?) was thought to be a 'Boeing advocate' long before she asked for and got favored treatment from some Boeing management - people are in jail for that and properly so.
The lease deal probably would have been more profitable to Boeing had it run over the life of the system but I doubt that was ever the plan. the UK leased a handful of C-17s and soon (as funds became available) turned that into a buy, and I think added aircraft to it. That would have taken place with US tankers as well.
Finally, you just should simply not place a critical contract, for warfighting hardware, with a bunch of countries that are always just one election away from switching sides (again). Yes, we buy support systems from the EU and we buy major systems from the UK but the hilos and base hacks can be replaced locally and the UK is sort of married to us just as we are married to them.
If you simply don't like Boeing, don't worry, neither do I. I really miss the good old days when 'we' could compete large aircraft within the USA. I suppose it was even better when a Lockheed or Douglas could do literally the whole construction job in house and only subcontract with Brewster or General Motors when someone needed too many of any single model.
On the other hand; Airbus is a multi governmental construct that really does intend to replace the USA (not just Boeing) and can call on tax euros to offset the 'loans' whenever it gets into a bind. That ain't competition as I know it. Northrop is a sock puppet hoping to make good on the scraps.
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