Posted on 05/14/2008 7:49:36 AM PDT by freespirited
True, but once they can end private sales ( if you need a dealer it’s nolonger private) They can work on regulations to put the dealers out of business.
At least, that's the intent. Perhaps more in the case of handguns across state lines. I'd be curious if any statistics are kept on crimes committed by firearms acquired in private sales, I suspect they're nil. Illegal dealers selling out of their trunks not being private of course, they're breaking the law now.
A gun owner and staunch defender of the 2nd Amendment, I'd like to know the same thing here in Virginia when it comes to auctions and gun show loopholes. Why don't auctions/gun shows have to abide by the same laws with instant check as gun stores do?
Absolutely not! But, what about selling it to someone you do not know...selling it to a felon, an illegal alien for instance?
Dealers at gun shows, the majority, do. And a "private" citizen showing up at multiple shows isn't a "private citizen", he's a dealer, and as I understand it violating the law if he's not running a check. Without any further legislation.
Thanks! The private sale issue was the part I was missing.
I was hearing some talking heads say that many of the RATs who beat "Republicans" ran to the right of the GOP candidate on guns and abortion.
So, nobody can blame losses by the GOP because the candidate was some "right wing extremist".
Thanks! It was the private sale part that I was missing.
Regulations and/or lawsuits.
A small time gunsmith or other minor dealer could be classified as a business for property tax purposes raising their taxes 3x or more.
Don't issue any permits for new gun shops and raise the fees for existing ones 100x.
Bottom line is the RATS see the gun show bill as a first step to banning all guns.
So how IN LAW do you differentiate between selling to friends vs. strangers?
Should the law be written along “guilty until proven innocent” lines?
Those objectionable would-be buyers are, in fact, very rare ... and can get what they want one way or another. Do we really want to hassle/penalize nearly everyone just to raise a minor hindrance to a few criminals? The price isn’t worth the cost.
Anti-gun forces have been working to reduce the number of licensed gun dealers in the US. They also want to require that all gun sales go through a licensed dealer. No tin foil hat required to see what their ultimate goal is.
BTW, CA has such a law and criminals here have zero problem getting all the guns they want.
I want to keep firearms out of the hands of felons, illegal aliens period! I see no reason to make it easy for them with gun shows and auctions not requiring a FFL for ALL vendors. I have no problem with private sales to neighbors, kin folk, etc.
Exactly! But there are a lot of "dealers" who masquerade as "private citizens" at shows. Additionally, about three or four years ago I attended an estate auction with a buddy. He purchased a .45 colt 1911, a S&W .357, and a Remington Model 70 at the event. Nothing was required except his personal checkbook for the firearms. I know that he was okay, but what about the next guy off the street?
Think about it this way: Should a car dealership be required to check the driving record of someone buying a car? It's wrong to imply that the seller should somehow be responsible for the actions of the buyer (too close to Bloomers view). How about the fact that a felon would be breaking the law by having a firearm and an illegal shouldn't be here anyway? At some point, people should be responsible for their own actions.
It's my understanding they're breaking the law. In that case the issue is enforcement, not another law. I'm not a frequent show attendee, but I'm told that most shows are pretty strict on dealers due to potential liability to the sponsors, but that might be a regional thing. An estate auction, if it's conducted by a commercial company, in my mind they should be held to the same standard as dealers. If it's an individual, like a house sale, you're right, they'd get a pass. I guess the real question is whether true private sales are a risk, my guess they're not or we'd be seeing statistics cited. Not the typical straw man of gun shows or "private" sales to gang bangers from the trunk of a car.
Serious question: Why is a background check a bad thing? ***
Serious answer ....
First of all there is no "loophole". All guns purchased from a Dealer at a Gun Show already go through the background check system.That's why it's a bad thing.What they are attempting to do with this fancy language 'Gun Show Loophole Law ' is ban the sale, or transfer, of firearms between private parties - period.
This means me buying my next door neighbor's .357 or me giving a family member, say my Son In Law, or MY WIFE, one of my guns (or all upon my death).
They want these 'checks' so there's a record of every gun transfered. And they'll push to make the check results kept permanently. It's defacto gun registration. And every where there has been gun registration the next step has been confiscation.
No, but try taking a car dealer's demo for a ride without showing your driver's license. So, essentially the dealership is checking your record because, if you had a bad one, you wouldn't have a license would you?
Do you understand what it takes to get an FFL?
How far are you really willing to go to "keep firearms out of the hands of felons, illegal aliens"? Do you understand that they CAN get them, with little difficulty, outside legal controls? Do you understand how MUCH hassle you intend to impose on how MANY upstanding citizens?
Before you say "I want X, period!", best to get a reality check on the cost of that period. In this case, you're talking about a very expensive system with great infringements on upstanding citizens, only to get a marginal improvement in an otherwise unstoppable situation.
(* - that's what ultimately backs law: go far enough in not cooperating with the law, and you face getting killed.)
(** - that's required for an FFL: a brick-and-mortar retail storefront with posted business hours.)
Thanks for the answer. Now I understand.
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