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A Bankrupt Superpower: The Collapse Of American Power
Intelligence Daily ^ | March 19, 2008 | By Paul Craig Roberts

Posted on 03/20/2008 2:56:09 AM PDT by Fennie

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To: WOSG

“On the contrary, it seems the welfare-recipients (and you can include college students, farmers, veterans, elderly, along with poor in that groups of folk getting federal largess) are having their way with that 10%.”

Yeah..but in return for that, the manufacturers and factory owners are moving offshore and outsourcing their employment...and choosing our presidential candidates.


141 posted on 03/20/2008 12:41:38 PM PDT by mo
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To: palmer
>>The rich generally don't do as well under free trade and the rich includes American union laborers.”

Your kidding right?

It wasn't enough that we had free trade (notice I didn't use fair trade), corporate America with the help of the bought and paid for congress accelerated free trade into hyper-globalism.

The wealthy have become even wealthier off the backs of near slave labor.

The standard of living for the middle class is shrinking.

I work for a large fortune 500 company, 100 billion a year in revenue.

Corporate elites have enjoyed lavish bonuses, stock options, salaries / perks and then the ol golden parachute that equals the GDP of a small country. It's down right shameful.

One of our former CEO’s left with a package valued over 30 million.......that was more than one of our departments made all year.

Suckin the juice of life out of America and these globalist care not one iota nor hold any allegiance to the USA.

All the while, the worker bees have seen their benefits reduced, cost skyrocketing, frozen or paltry salary increases, elimination of pensions, and every other cut imaginable down to plastic sporks.

I've been in corporate life since 1984, I've never seen such penny pinchin in all my life.

142 posted on 03/20/2008 12:52:18 PM PDT by servantboy777
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To: servantboy777
Penny pinchin at a corporation? Sacre bleu!
143 posted on 03/20/2008 1:51:23 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Paul Ross; 1rudeboy; expat_panama
And were you aware that as part of a round of GATT that set up the WTO that Boeing was forced to relinquish proprietary technology, to EADS/AIrbus for butkus?

For Butkus?


144 posted on 03/20/2008 1:53:15 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (NAFTA opponents are an odd coalition of the no-deodorant Left and the toothless-and-tinfoil right.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot; Paul Ross

Interesting. I wonder what Ronald Reagan forced Boeing to give up?


145 posted on 03/20/2008 2:01:31 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy
Walter Payton and a 3rd round draft pick.
146 posted on 03/20/2008 2:07:02 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (NAFTA opponents are an odd coalition of the no-deodorant Left and the toothless-and-tinfoil right.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

And the Bears still suck.


147 posted on 03/20/2008 2:09:54 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Fennie
By definition, he is right. We are using the kindness of strangers to fund our lifestyles and government. That can't last.

If we aren't financially independent, then we are not politically independent. Long term, those who hold the cash make the rules, and we are living on credit.

148 posted on 03/20/2008 3:27:36 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: Carry_Okie
Arnold brought us an increase in the growth of spending, more regulation, more corruption, more gun grabbing, and more enviro hooey. He has driven jobs out of state at an accelerated rate and put us $70 billion deeper in debt for "projects" that mostly constitute malfeasance.

The point was that Arnold was elected to save the fiscal crisis of the state of Kalifornia. How he managed the situation has no bearing on how those who voted for him thought he would manage the situation. Same could be said for those of us who supported the removal of Saddam. How GWB managed the situation has no bearing on how those who supported the removal of Saddam thought the situation would be managed. The problem is thinking there is a difference between tweedle dee and tweedle dumb. In the end, GWB was no better then his father in handling the Saddam problem. His father took the Kuwait Oil Fields back from Saddam, but left Saddam in power. GWB at least took Saddam out of power, but the post management was a disaster that even GWB admits now. Somehow I do not think Arnold will ever admit that bankrupting the state of Kalifornia was a mistake, but that seems to be the only difference between the Rino and the Dino. The Rino admits their mistakes, while the Dino takes them to their grave.

149 posted on 03/20/2008 3:29:11 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: servantboy777
Blasphemy! Get the stake!/sarcasm
150 posted on 03/20/2008 3:31:27 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: jlasoon
Was it worth $500 billion dollars or maybe we should spend $1 trillion dollars? Listen shmuck, the world is compromised of how many dictators and despots? Your telling me that America needs to risk economic collapse because some tyrant in a robe decides he’s going to say bad things about us. Grow a pair and brush it off, more then half of the planet wants you dead. How anyone can defend the economic practices of this current administration is mind boggling.

The excessive Billions have been primarily spent in the post war environment. The initial war, when the M1 tanks went in and took down Saddam, was a magnificent accomplishment that did not cost that much. It ended in one of the worlds only living Tyrants, who used WMD on his own citizens, being hung by his citizens. That is something every American should be proud of. The money the author is whining about was primarily spent trying to rebuild and manage the post Saddam Iraq. Could less have been spent, definitely. Could the situation have been better managed, definitely. But to state that nothing was accomplished by removing Saddam is naive and juvenile. Come on. Saddam was a threat to the region. He had invaded Kuwait and taken the Kuwaiti Oil Fields, he had fought a long war with Iran and he treated the Kurds as if they were not even human. He was hung and is gone. That was an amazing accomplishment. Managing the Post War Iraq however is a completely different story.

With your rational this country should be invading half the planet because bad people are doing bad things to their citizens. It’s a historical fact of life, this has been going on for thousands of years, your not changing anything, America will not change anything, and the world will never change. Society is programmed in such a way that is to complex for you to understand.

Saddam was initially our ally against the Iranian mullahs. You know, the guys who caused the Iranian hostage crisis. In the end, we owed it to the world to destroy the monster we and Europe had helped to create. The real question now is will the Russians help to destroy the Iranian Persian Monster that they created ? You know the monster that is about to acquire Nuclear WMD ?

151 posted on 03/20/2008 3:45:53 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: Cringing Negativism Network; Toddsterpatriot
"First official checkpoint on the Nafta highway will nevertheless, be in KC."

Worse yet, it will be a joint US/Mexico Customs facility and the Mexican customs office will not be subject to US laws. Obviously there is a U.S. Sovereignty problem and that plan has not been fully approved, only proposed.

Incoming cargo, mostly from Asia, will hit North America in Mexico and be subject to Mexican Customs. Currently, the docks and facilities where the incoming cargo hits Mexico are being funded and set up by a Hong-Kong shipper.

According to press reports, there will be an inspection done at the US border by Homeland Security. Historically, they spot check and rely on Mexican Customs.

152 posted on 03/20/2008 3:49:16 PM PDT by american colleen
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To: Fennie; pissant
There's a pretty simple Biblical principle: Whoever does not work, does not eat.

Can this be applied to nations? I believe it can.

Much of our former real productive output has been shipped to China, with a "service" economy to replace it.

Like it or not, a strong industrial base with real tangible output provides the heartbeat for a sound economy. "Services" will not cut it.

153 posted on 03/20/2008 4:49:16 PM PDT by Lexinom ("Change": what's left after President Obama sends you your tax bill.)
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To: Lexinom

Cmon now. You know that insurance salesmen, accountants and lawyers are the backbone of any economy.


154 posted on 03/20/2008 5:05:40 PM PDT by pissant (THE Conservative party: www.falconparty.com)
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To: pieceofthepuzzle
Three words:

Real Productive Output

Passive investment and the associated perception/positioning will not work forever because the cost cutting used to create that perception often involves shipping more jobs overseas. Well, well well... what happens when the last job has been shipped?

It is kind of funny in a broader cosmic sense: everyone thinks everyone else is doing the actual work, when in fact no one is working! That is hyperbole of course, but you get the gist.

155 posted on 03/20/2008 5:36:27 PM PDT by Lexinom ("Change": what's left after President Obama sends you your tax bill.)
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To: justa-hairyape
The point was that Arnold was elected to save the fiscal crisis of the state of Kalifornia.

Arnold was elected to have a blast making his sponsors richer at the taxpayers' expense. He was SOLD as a way to fix a fiscal crisis.

Somehow I do not think Arnold will ever admit that bankrupting the state of Kalifornia was a mistake, but that seems to be the only difference between the Rino and the Dino. The Rino admits their mistakes, while the Dino takes them to their grave.

I think you've just contradicted yourself, since Arnold is a RINO and, as you stated, won't admit his "mistake."

Here's a clue: It's no mistake. Bankruptcy was the objective all along, with the investors feasting on the remains after profiting on creating the demise, just like they did in Russia.

156 posted on 03/20/2008 5:53:00 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (Grovelnator Schwarzenkaiser, fashionable fascism one charade at a time.)
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To: Paul Ross
Wow. What did NASA and Boeing get in return?

I am terribly afraid I know the answer.

157 posted on 03/20/2008 6:36:35 PM PDT by american colleen
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To: servantboy777
It wasn't enough that we had free trade (notice I didn't use fair trade), corporate America with the help of the bought and paid for congress accelerated free trade into hyper-globalism

The way free trade works is everyone gets a better chance to sell their labor on the world market. Overpriced labor, like American union labor, doesn't do as well. But poor people do better. The more poor they are, the better they do in terms of standards of living. As a direct result of worldwide free trade, the number of people in abject poverty has dropped from 40% in 1981 to 20% today. Protectionism in any form does worse, whether countries denying their people a choice of worldwide products, or American labor protecting their overpaid positions.

One of our former CEO’s left with a package valued over 30 million.......that was more than one of our departments made all year.

You are probably confusing our enormous credit bubble with what used to be capitalism here. We have lots of speculation, LBOs and takeovers, quick hitting executives who aim for one year or less profits. These are all effects of the credit bubble. Capitalism is still there however, and talented capitalists, entrepreneurs, inventors, etc can benefit from the easy credit also.

158 posted on 03/20/2008 6:43:22 PM PDT by palmer
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To: 1rudeboy
The deal was done long after Reagan during President George HW Bush's last year. Since 1992 direct and indirect government support to the aircraft industry in the United States and the European Union has been regulated by the bilateral EU-US Agreement on Trade in Large Civil Aircraft.

George W. Bush was beginning to undo some of the damaging self-inflicted wounds that the trade agreement imposed unilaterally against the U.S. The US purported to unilaterally withdraw from the 1992 bilateral EC-US Agreement on Trade in Large Civil Aircraft in October 2004. But of course, knowing it had a huge winning trade dvantage it would not do well without, the EU has contested even our action in withdrawing from that agreement...and made that an WTO litigated dispute which is pending.

Unfortunately the vigor of the President's defense of his decision is waning, likely with his decision to give the Air Tanker contract to EADs. He must have thought that could pave over the dispute...and make nice with whomever he is deeming expedient at the moment.

More payola to a corrupt entity and countries which don't pay for their own defense, but count our defending us...and them....as a trade subsidy.

159 posted on 03/20/2008 7:43:41 PM PDT by Paul Ross (Ronald Reagan-1987:"We are always willing to be trade partners but never trade patsies.")
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To: american colleen
Worse yet, it will be a joint US/Mexico Customs facility and the Mexican customs office will not be subject to US laws.

US exports to Mexico will be inspected by Mexican customs in KC. US imports from Mexico will be inspected in Mexico by US customs.

160 posted on 03/20/2008 8:41:51 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (NAFTA opponents are an odd coalition of the no-deodorant Left and the toothless-and-tinfoil right.)
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