The "Democrat" party, TRUE Christians and the COMING PERSECUTION...

At the Second Coming of Christ (not the "third" coming that pre-trib insists you have to believe in), the earth and all of creation will be BURNED UP! And a new heavens, and a new earth come about in their place...

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2Pe 3:1 Beloved, I now write this second letter to you, in which I stir up your pure mind by reminder 2Pe 3:2 to remember the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of the Lord and Savior by us, the apostles. 2Pe 3:3 First, knowing this, that there will come in the last days scoffers walking according to their own lusts 2Pe 3:4 and saying, Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation. 2Pe 3:5 For this is hidden from them by their willing it, that the heavens were of old, and the earth out of the water, and through water, being held together by the Word of God, 2Pe 3:6 through which the world that then was, being flooded by water, perished. 2Pe 3:7 But the present heavens and the earth being kept in store by the same Word, are being kept for fire until the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men. 2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, let not this one thing be hidden from you, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slow concerning His promise, as some count slowness, but is long-suffering toward us, not purposing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a rushing noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat. And the earth and the works in it will be burned up. 2Pe 3:11 Then, all these things being about to be dissolved, what sort ought you to be in holy behavior and godliness, 2Pe 3:12 looking for and rushing the coming of the Day of God, on account of which the heavens, being on fire, will melt away, and the elements will melt, burning with heat? 2Pe 3:13 But according to His promise, we look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. 2Pe 3:14 Therefore, beloved, looking for these things, be diligent, spotless, and without blemish, to be found by Him in peace.

In the Revelation end times, Christians will be OPENLY MOCKED (as they are also put to DEATH) for believing in the Second Coming of Christ.

Read Matt 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 CAREFULLY and you will see that MANY will abandon the Christian faith in the end times because they have BOUGHT INTO THE LIES being preached from the pulpit of the "great rescue." And that LIE serves just ONE PURPOSE, TO KEEP CHRISTIANS SO "HEAVENLY MINDED" THEY ARE "NO EARTHLY GOOD" SO THAT THEY DO NOT CONFRONT THE EVIL AND THE WICKEDNESS IN OUR CULTURE TODAY! Read Proverbs 8:13...

Pro 8:13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogance, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.

So, if you PROFESS to be a Christian, and do not HATE, that's right, HATE evil, then you do not fear God and you do not Love God. You are salt with no savor, a gong with no sound. Hate my friends is ACTIVE. It REQUIRES that you stand up against evil. To the extent you are TOLERANT you are accepting evil and do not love God...

Am I advocating open "fighting?" of course not. Our war is not carnal, or with flesh and blood. But if you are not FIRST pursuing your relationship with God through prayer and seeking him, and ALSO, putting ACTION to your faith by standing AGAINST that which is wicked, ESPECIALLY within the Church, if you are not "withstanding to their face" (or confronting) those who spread these perversions just as Paul did (Galations 2:11), then what are you doing?

If more Christians were truly READING THEIR BIBLES, and holding their pastors accountable to teaching the whole counsel of God, the culture would be radically transformed!

There is already tribulation here, Christians are suffering and being killed for Jesus now.

There will be a time of intense persecution world wide under the short rule of the antiChrist THEN Jesus Christ will return and catch us who belong to Him up into the air with Him and the saints who have already gone to Him on His way down to end the rule of satan and establish His kingdom. Are you ready for what is coming? Will you endure and overcome by the blood of Lamb and the Word of your testimony and will not love your life even when faced with death?

This ‘left behind’ nonsense is heresy.

As for the new Jerusalem...we are the living stones and the bride of Christ. Spit out this nonsense about the people of God not being the bride of Jesus Christ........as already posted the Word of God makes clear we are His bride.

YOU WROTE:

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As for this one point, you and I may disagree. If you read the article that is posted, it says clearly that the CHURCH is not the “bride of Christ” as is commonly taught.

However, on a point of honest disagreement, where I may have to commit more time, effort, and energy to studying the issue and to prayer, it’s not a point that I’m willing to get into a doctrinal debate about.

The Bible says what it says. To the extent that you are reading or studying it, that is what God wants ALL of us to do. If more people who PROFESS to be “Christian” were actually studying their Bibles, and putting into action what it says, this country we live in would be a radically different place.

I am not interested a doctrinal debate on the issue either but nonetheless it is an important issue as it relates directly to our present and future relationship with Christ.

I suggest starting with these scriptures. Pretty clear to me.

2Cor 11:2 I am jealous for you with the jealousy of God
himself. For I promised you as a pure bride
to one husband, Christ.
Rev 19:7 “Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory
to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come
and His bride has made herself ready.”
Rev 19:8 It was given to her to clothe herself in fine
linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is
the righteous acts of the saints.

2 Cor 11 is talking about us His people........Paul says he promised “you” [people] as a pure bride to one husband, Christ.

Rev 19 refers to people again, “herself ready” and “her to clothe herself” ...even stating that the fine linen “we the bride” are clothed in is the our righteous acts as His saints. There is another issue here on who’s righteousness it is but that is for another discussion. [It is His righteousness by the way :-) ].

A lot of what is pictured in Revelation is not physical but spiritual or both. We are the living stones of the temple of God.

While I may see what you are saying in 2 Cor 11:2, you have taken Rev 19:7 OUT of context. And with all of the posts, disturbingly so. Please point to me in that passage of Revelations where it says "the Church" or even individual believers are the bride of Christ?

Granted, I can see the reference in 2 Cor 11:2, but THAT may be taken out of context too... I noticed you didn't post the verse RIGHT IN FRONT of that...

2Co 11:1 Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me.
2Co 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

The passages I have quoted are absolutely explicit, and they do not carry with them these "qualifiers" like Paul used, NOR do they carry with them the need to "interpret" what the words mean beyond what they are directly saying in Revelation 21:

I’d say the following passage is pretty explicit...

Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

...

Rev 21:9 [snipped, read at your liesure] Come hither, I will show thee the bride, the Lamb’s wife.
Rev 21:10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God...

These passages do NOT need to be "interpreted" from an unclear message. And they do not contain Paul's previous qualifier to "bear with me a little in my folly," the passages above say what they mean and mean what they say...

Nor is there any LACK of clarity in this passage:

2Pe 3:3 First, knowing this, that there will come in the last days scoffers walking according to their own lusts 2Pe 3:4 and saying, Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.

So your contention is that at the end of the great tribulation the earth and all the elements will be burned up? That happens at the very end, after Satan is thrown into the lake of fire, the dead are raised just before the White Throne judgment and the lost are thrown into the lake of fire, then GOD will burn up all this old stuff and make it all new!:)

This catching away called the rapture does not cause one to become lazy. On the contrary it should (and does) motivate me and others to be bold in our witness to snatch as many out of the kingdom of darkness into the Kingdom of Light. If this teaching did otherwise, it would be stopped.

I do not think that this is a new thing. Their is evidence that this was taught up to the 4th century when Epharaem the Syrian said in about 373AD “for all the saints and Elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins.” And in the 1st century didn’t Paul write the Thessalonians and reassure them that they did not miss this event?

I do not understand the harsh attacks from within the Christian community to this teaching. Jesus said that we would not know the day nor the hour of his return. That does not work with the tribulation, once it starts we know that seven years later JESUS returns:) Therefore the tribulation does not qualify as an event that we would not know when Jesus will return.

I have read the Bible from cover to cover several times. I am careful to let scripture interpet scripture, as it always does. I have studied Matt. 24, Mark 13. Luke 21, as well as the Book of Daniel, Zech. Malichi. Ezekiel, Isaiah, the Psalms, I-II Peter, I COR. esp ch 15, II Thess. Genesis, and The Revelation of Jesus Christ, to name a few. In none of these works have I found that God allows the Righteous to be judged with the wicked. Never has God allowed any of his own, who put their trust in HIM, to suffer in any judgment that HE has poured out on those who refuse HIS salvation.

The tribulation, ALL seven years of it, is GOD pouring out his WRATH on the earth. We have been covered by the blood of Jesus and are seen by our GOD as HOLY and Righteous. Being covered by his blood does not mean that we will be immune from the effects of his judgments as evadenced by the numbers of believers killed in the tribulation because of their testamony of Jesus.

As far as transforming our culture, the war we are in has been going on for most of the last century, waged by socialists who are undermining our foundation and replaceing it with humanism and marxism.
If we would pay attention to whom we vote for and what their political party endorses then we could begin that kind of transformation. But most people vote with their feelings, not with their brain. :)

YOU WROTE:
So your contention is that at the end of the great tribulation the earth and all the elements will be burned up? That happens at the very end, after Satan is thrown into the lake of fire, the dead are raised just before the White Throne judgment and the lost are thrown into the lake of fire, then GOD will burn up all this old stuff and make it all new!:)

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Okay, I’ve posted the SPECIFIC PASSAGES AND VERSES for people to read for themselves... So, how about supporting your contentions with the specific passages. Including addressing the details of what is noted in Peter:

2Pe 3:3 First, knowing this, that there will come in the last days scoffers walking according to their own lusts
2Pe 3:4 and saying, Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.

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In the end times Christians will be OPENLY MOCKED for believing in the Second Coming of Christ, BECAUSE they will be here on earth, suffering through the tribulation...

Today’s “escapism” theology is plain blasphemy. It is a theology for the “me” crowd and those who buy into the SATANIC LIE that they will not have to suffer, and that if things are going wrong, they must not be living right.

Hmmm... seems to me that Job, Joseph, and even Daniel could easily refute that. If my memory serves me correctly David even lamented in Psalms about how it appeared that the righteous suffer and the evil are rewarded.

We are FILLED to the brim with blasphemy “gospel” messages today. Messages that are self-centered and ego-centric. Messages of “I’m so blessed by and by” pie in the sky messages.

So, how about supporting your contentions with the specific Bible verses that come right out and SAY the Second Coming will occur before the Tribulation. Because the way MOST PEOPLE who actually read those passages interpret them is that we will be here for at least part if not all of it.

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