Posted on 11/10/2007 8:41:48 AM PST by goldstategop
Bull.
It's way past time to remove the Islamic Bomb from the table. Either take them away by force or destroy them in place. Then we can let deal with the Islamists they way they should be dealt with.
L
Pervez Musharaff finds himself in a position similar to that of the Shah. Murderous Mullahs want power and only Musharaff's Military rule will stop them. Human Rights cannot mean the right to self-destructive Mullah totalitarianism; Society must defend itself.
Good idea. Slight problem, though. Don't you have to know exactly where they are in order to do either? Given our recent intelligence performance, I wouldn't bet on us having this information.
I recommend that everybody either read the book or attend the upcoming move “Charlie Wilson’s War” (assuming it isn’t Hollywoodized). You will learn that Pakistan played a major role in defeating the Russians in Afghanistan. They cooperated with Israeli and American agents to set up a pipeline of stinger missiles supplied to the Mujahedeen. This crippled and defeated the Russians.
This effort began under Reagan, and continued into the GHWB presidency. After the defeat of Russia, a humanitarian effort to rehab Afghanistan was substituted along the same weapons trade pipelines under GHWB. Upon the Clinton’s election, that whole deal was terminated, because Pakistan “violated human rights” or some such nonsense. This opened the door to the rise of the Taliban, who thought that since they had defeated one Superpower, they could take on the other. Naturally, many Paki’s and Afghans were furious about their loss of trade income and status with America during the Clinton years.
I want people to know that GWB made overtures to Pakistan even before being elected. His father’s good relationship was immediately restored after the election, so the 9/11 event only required a nod from Mushariff.
And finally, the big mistake we have made in Pakistan is not forcing Mushariff to throw out the Saudi-funded madrassas and provide real secular education to the youth. No wonder he is besieged. And Oh Yeah, Bhutto is corrupt as they come and up to her ears in the Oil for Food scandal.
If you cannot judge him by “Western rules”, (since those rules are far too superior for the dark skinned people of the third world), how about judging him by Eastern rules? Eastern rules .....with the example of the country thats on the Eastern border of Pakistan.
Recognizing that Musharaff's military rule is likely the only thing preventing Pakistan from descending into chaos and rule by Islamo-fascists and supporting him for it is not moral relativism it is pragmatism. No one is making any excuse for military rule. The Islamo-fascists have created a reasonable cause for it.
Not to mention that, when the left is in charge, our allies become our enemies, our enemies morph into "freedom fighters".
See Serbia and Kosovo for further detail...
You are comparing Afghanistan and Irag with Pakistan? Isn’t there one big difference?
Moral relativism is making excuses for what you personally say is wrong by creating a sliding scale of values you can apply to others thereby exonerating them for not living up to your standard.That's exactly what you're doing. You're taking something morally wrong, military rule and dictatorship, and creating "a sliding scale of values"(well military rule is okay if...) that excuses it.
Recognizing that Musharaff's military rule is likely the only thing preventing Pakistan from descending into chaos and rule by Islamo-fascists and supporting him for it is not moral relativism it is pragmatism. No one is making any excuse for military rule. The Islamo-fascists have created a reasonable cause for it.
I guess if all cultures of the world were equal then we could look at it that way. Unfortunately I don’t believe a culture that supports death to those who oppose it be equal and entitled to democratic values we believe in. The only way they could truly understand and appreciate what we have is for them to break the cycle of tyranny themselves and go through their own civil wars and growing pains. Even then I don’t see any guarantees that they would ever become democratic.
You are completely wrong. If martial law is immoral then why do we have provisions for it written into our own civil code of laws? It is not wrong or immoral in all circumstances and Pakistan is definitely in a circumstance where it is needed. No form of government should be a suicide pact. That would be immoral.
You are completely wrong. If martial law is immoral then why do we have provisions for it written into our own civil code of laws? It is not wrong or immoral in all circumstances and Pakistan is definitely in a circumstance where it is needed. No form of government should be a suicide pact. That would be immoral.You're going off on a non-sequitur. Read what I wrote. Did I say *martial law* was immoral? That's not what we were talking about.
I think you are creating the non-sequitur. Musharaff has instituted "emergency military rule" which is nothing other than martial law. So martial law is exactly what we are talking about. Just because you have changed the wording in your post, creating a straw-man, does not change that fact. If there is any moral relativism here it is in your view that it's OK for our country to have a mechanism for temporary suspension of civil law but not for Pakistan.
I think you are creating the non-sequitur. Musharaff has instituted "emergency military rule" which is nothing other than martial law. So martial law is exactly what we are talking about. Just because you have changed the wording in your post, creating a straw-man, does not change that fact. If there is any moral relativism here it is in your view that it's OK for our country to have a mechanism for temporary suspension of civil law but not for Pakistan.No, that's not what we're talking about. Reread the first post of the thread. We're talking about judging Pakistan's *dictatorship* using the same rules as the west.
There is the entire first post of the thread. It says not one word about *dictatorship.*
“not our ideal guy when it comes to democracy” sounds like dictator to me.
Now you are grabbing at straws. Apparently you make up what you can’t find.
Now you are grabbing at straws. Apparently you make up what you can’t find.Yawn... not my fault you're reading impaired.
Fact don’t matter to you. Good night, Gracie.
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