Posted on 09/28/2007 11:02:01 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
That’s what I was thinking, otherwise, why the abortion? She must have been desperate, poor girl.
“Its more of a slow fade. Soon we find ourselves doing and thinking things we never thought we would do and say ever again.”
I’ve been there. Gotten out of my studies, away from church for a little while and first the negative thoughts start coming, followed by the negative language which is accompanied by anger issues. Solution? Went back to church. Things are looking and feeling a lot better.
God is a pro at wake-up calls.
"But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." Romans 5:8.
No one can minimize the need for repentance, because one is expected to "go forth and sin no more," as a evidence of repentance, even as Jesus instructed the woman caught in adultery.
Is it your position that if you are killed in the commission of a sin you lose your eternal salvation, because no time is accorded you for repentance?
If so, please consider the following example:
God sets up rulers and takes down rulers (Daniel 2:21). Christ expects compliance with civil authority where he commands that we are to render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's, and unto God that which is God's. (Matthew 22:21)
Further to this point Paul writes in 1Timothy 2: 1-3: "I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; 2For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. 3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;"
Civil authority proscribes against j-walking in a jurisdiction. By extension then, since Christ expects conformance with the law, he in effect proscribes against j-walking in that jurisdiction also.
Question: if you are struck by a car and killed when j-walking, are you damned to hell, even if you have already testified to your faith in Christ for salvation?
This one is even easier: will you go to hell if you die while coveting your neighbor's property, thus breaking the 10th commandment at the moment of death?
I just offered an illustration to Mr. Lucky that sets up the question: can you, as a confessed believer in Christ for one's personal salvation, still go to heaven if sinning at the moment of death? Please check it out.
Your question "is murdering your child the will of God?" misses the salient point that God Himself appoints our time to die. Psalm 139:16 states: " Your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be." (NIV)
It was the appointed time for that unborn child to die; it was also the appointed time for that mother-to-be to die. The 10 commandments proscribe against murder. God cannot contradict Himself.
Therefore, the answer to your question is: it was the will of God that both these persons die at that time. It was in the course of man's disobedience to God's law that death happened to occur during the commission of murder, thus breaking God's law. Murder is sin, and sin is engaged in by man in the disobedience to God's perfect will.
I am so encouraged by many of your posts on this awful story. We are wrestling with important matters. Life and death matters.
I don’t think it is a good, honest, truthful, biblical testimony to the world to put forth that Laura was born-again. The Bible teaches that the only people who are truly born-again and are saved from their sin by Jesus Christ are those who endure to the end. I’m afraid that as both a known fornicator & murderer Laura did not exhibit the fruit of saving faith & genuine repentance.We must feel sincere pity for her soul. It is public knowlege that her last days were spent in sinning against her conscience, against her maternal instinct, against the Law of God that was written in her heart, against her little baby & most importantly, in deadly earnest defiance against God Himself.
Jesus taught us:
Those who obey My commandments are the ones who love me.
John 14:21
The Bible continues to affirm that obedience to the moral Law is to follow those who believe.
If someone says, “I belong to God,” but doesn’t obey God’s commandments, that person is a liar and does not live in the truth.
I Jo 2:4
We know we love God’s children if we love God and obey His commandments.
I Jo 5:2
In addition, it is a grave mistake & I would go so far as to say, falsehood, to call Laura a victim. Laura was an aborting mother, who, with malice & forethought & against the enlightenment of her God-given conscience, acknowledged risk of harm & even death, signed a consent form for elective surgery & paid money to murder her baby. She was not a ‘victim’, she was a perpetrator. Still, we must have a measure of heartfelt grief over this lost woman’s soul & mourn with her family over her death.
One of the saddest things of all is that the Bible (which was read in Laura’s church & perhaps even read by Laura herself) speaks the horror of curse over those who shed inncoent blood.
Cursed is (s)he who takes a reward to slay an innocent person.
Deuteronomy 27:25
(The ‘reward’ for aborting moms & dads is financial & freedom to continue to live as they would like.)
A man (or woman) that does violence to the blood of any person & is tormented by the guilt of murder will flee to the pit & be a fugitive til death; let no one support him (or her).
Proverbs 28:17
This agrees with that ancient law, Whoso sheddeth mans blood, by man shall his blood be shed (Gen. 9:6), and proclaims,
1. The doom of the shedder of blood. He that has committed murder, though he flees for his life, shall be continually haunted with terrors, shall himself flee to the pit, betray himself, and torment himself, like Cain, who, when he had killed his brother, became a fugitive and a vagabond, and trembled continually.
2. The duty of the avenger of blood, whether the magistrate or the next of kin, or whoever are concerned in making inquisition for blood, let them be close and vigorous in the prosecution, and let it not be bought off. Those that acquit the murderer, or do any thing to help him off, come in sharers in the guilt of blood; nor can the land be purged from blood but by the blood of him that shed it, Num. 35:33. (Matthew Henry’s commentary on Proverbs 28:17)
No one wanted Laura or any killing mom to die ... would to God that we could have befriended her & helped her to live & choose an adoptive family for her baby. We all would have wanted Laura to go to a godly woman in her church or confide in her mom & dad so that they could have loved her & her little one through the pregnancy & birth. We all would have wanted what was BEST for Laura AND her baby: LIFE - even life eternal, which can only come thru true repentance of sin & faith in the Savior.
As to judging ... there is a lot of error regarding judgment. We must look to the Bible for clarification.
Judging is commanded by Jesus Christ Himself:
Judge righteous judgment (John 7:24)
Jesus commended Simon saying, “You have judged rightly.” Luke 7:43
“Open your mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor & needy.”Prov 31:9
Don’t you know that we will judge angels? How much more things that pertain to this life? (I Cor 6:3)
Let us do all that we can, by the grace & strength of Christ, to reach out to aborting women to offer our help & the gospel which has the power to save from the enslavement & selfishness of the sin of murder. Let us all go to the killing places near where we live to lift up our voices in the Name of the Lord of Life.
I am a sidewalk counselor at Planned Parenthood in Denver. I’ve been on the sidewalk outside one abortuary or another for 28 years. I’d say 40 percent of the girls getting abortions claim to be Christians. They tell me “God forgives me”, “I’m just giving my baby back to Jesus” or “Jesus understands my situation, Thou shall not judge”. It’s sickening to hear young girls that go to church say such abominable things.
If they are not learning that murder is wrong and their understanding of Christ is so miserably skewed, how can they be saved? They are not saved, youth groups entertain them with Christian Rock that leads them to believe that Jesus is cool rather than righteous. They believe that Christ is their servant and they know nothing of repentance or salvation. It’s shameful.
The abortuaries are open and they are leading our youth astray and it is the fault of the church. We have all the power in heaven at our fingertips, but we must live by faith and not sight to be led by the Spirit. We corporately have refused to do so, hence we are losing our children to the bloodlusts of the wicked.
The Father answered Jesus’ prayer by sending Jesus to give a Laura a chance for salvation. I am sure he came to her at the last moments of her life to save her from everlasting damnation. Jesus came to face the Accuser himself with these words:
“And the scribes and the Pharisees bring unto him a woman taken in adultery: and they set her in the midst, 4 And said to him: Master, this woman was even now taken in adultery. 5 Now Moses in the law commanded us to stone such a one. But what sayest thou?
6 And this they said tempting him, that they might accuse him. But Jesus bowing himself down, wrote with his finger on the ground. 7 When therefore they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said to them: He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. 8 And again stooping down, he wrote on the ground. 9 But they hearing this, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest. And Jesus alone remained, and the woman standing in the midst. 10 Then Jesus lifting up himself, said to her: Woman, where are they that accused thee? Hath no man condemned thee?
11 Who said: No man, Lord. And Jesus said: Neither will I condemn thee. Go, and now sin no more.”
We should pray for her immortal soul that at the last moments of her life God will give her the Grace necessary.
“O Blood and Water that gushed forth from the Heart of Jesus as a fountain of mercy for us, I trust in you.”
Offer prayer and sacrifices that this our sister may be saved.
In Christ, Through Mary, By Thine example, St. Joseph,....... Dr. Brian
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