Ron Paul, the Real Republican? (Announcing the Great Ron Paul Ping List)

Fox News ^ | February 20, 2007 | Radley Balko

[billbears]

History proves that appeasing terrorists does not work. He was not arguably, but demonstrably, wrong.

LOL, and just when will this latest war on a noun be over? 40? 50? 150 years? Any plans on who's going to supply the troops for that nonsense (not to mention the funding)? And considering every 2-4 years politicians change, the focus on who is and who isn't a terrorist will eventually begin to change as well. But we'll continue the 'war' on terror shall we? It will never end. What's your best solution? Give 'em all purple fingers so they can elect convicted terrorists and known members of terrorist organizations?

Reagan was wrong, Paul is wrong, hell all limited government old school conservatives who have come out against this police action must be wrong. Because if they aren't, that means the current President's advisors were wrong and we just can't have that, can we?

[jmc813]

I'm right there with you. I'm one of the few politically libertarian people I know who... was also with Operation Rescue.

You might want to check out Murray Sabrin. He was the first person I ever voted for NJ governor who ran as a pro-life Libertarian. He is also the head of Libertarians for Life.

[George W. Bush]

I'm still trying to catch up with this thread. I notice the huge vitriol against Paul over the vote last week. Some longtime Paul supporters dropped him over this, it seems. Personally, I thought his original votes were clear enough and it would have been more politic for a presidential run to have merely voted present on such a doomed symbolic vote. His original votes to invade Afghanistan and against invading Iraq spoke to his real positions far better. That vote made the job of selling GOP rank-and-file and activists a tougher sell. It was his call but we can see the results of it here. Principles are fine but appearances make a difference. That vote didn't give him any more principle that he already had and made enemies in the GOP.

Given the hostility of partisan GOP folks on the Right here at FR, I have to wonder if Ron Paul might be considering trying to capture the nominations of the Libertarians and the Constitution Party as well while running in the GOP primary at the same time. He's the only one in either party who could pull it off and he is actually a good fit for both. Just a thought.

Has he even filed his paperwork yet or hired any new staff for a campaign?

[dcwusmc]

Neither would Dr. paul, who supports and voted for fences and a closed border, to enhance national security.

[dcwusmc]

Someone already asked, though you have yet to answer... WHAT EXACTLY IS the job that's left for our American troops in Iraq? A specific, quantifiable job, if you would, please.

[George W. Bush]

Reagan was wrong, Paul is wrong, hell all limited government old school conservatives who have come out against this police action must be wrong.

Actually, you don't have to be too good at reading tea leaves to see that Bush Senior, James Baker, Colin Powell, Henry Kissinger, Larry Eagleberger and others also opposed the Iraq invasion from day one. They didn't speak out against Junior in public at the time but they have made it clear enough publicly if you translate the CFR-speak into English. And except for Powell who was SoS, none of them publicly supported the Iraqi invasion.

I'm not suggesting they're Paul supporters and they probably don't like him much. But Paul's views are hardly isolated in the Republican foreign policy club. I suppose that doesn't matter since most FReepers hate them too with an undying passion as well since the Baker Report. There are days when you think your fellow-FReepers are mostly under 20 years old and don't know much about the party.

[AmishDude]

Neither would Dr. paul, who supports and voted for fences and a closed border, to enhance national security.

That's a lie. Unless he's not a libertarian. Libertarianism demands open borders, explicitly.

[OrthodoxPresbyterian]

That's a lie. Unless he's not a libertarian. Libertarianism demands open borders, explicitly.

Ron Paul supports and voted for fences and a closed border, to enhance national security.

The fact is, Libertarianism does NOT "demand open borders, explicitly". The libertarian Ludwig Von Mises institute, for example, has made an excellent case that "open borders" means Trespassing -- which is a definite Libertarian No-No.

Ron Paul is that sort of "libertarian" -- the Pro-Life, Secure Borders kind.

[DeaconBenjamin2]

Go ahead and add me as well. Thanks.

[OrthodoxPresbyterian]

Has he even filed his paperwork yet or hired any new staff for a campaign?

Yes, Ron Paul filed the paperwork for his Exploratory Committee on January 11, 2007. ~~ http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,243200,00.html

He seems to be hiring new staff, at least that's the impression I get -- when I called his Congressional office in Texas earlier today, they gave me a direct number for his newly-established Exploratory Committee office in Virginia. I haven't spoken to Penny in the past few days, but the Virginia office said he should have some official campaign announcement to make this coming weekend in New Hampshire.

[OrthodoxPresbyterian]

I notice the huge vitriol against Paul over the vote last week. Some longtime Paul supporters dropped him over this, it seems.

It's possible, but I haven't noticed any. If anything, all the vitriol seems to be coming from about five rabidly anti-Paul Freepers, while my pro-Paul Ping List has now (more than) doubled.

[OrthodoxPresbyterian]

You got it!

[PSYCHO-FREEP]

Unfortunately right now, for some of our troops, their only job is staying alive in a land where the enemy is undefinable.

The very last thing they need is some arrogant politician in Washington, placing their principals before the welfare and moral support of our Brothers in harms way!

That idiotic self-serving group of pariahs sent a clear message to our troops, that they don't mean more than what's left of a bug on a windshield to our Congressmen and Senators.

For Me, it brought back some very horrible memories of what it feels like to be pressed tight against a wall of sandbags while bullets & tracer rounds are screaming over your head from all directions. And when mortar rounds are getting closer to your perimeter with every volley. The last thing a young troop trying to survive in a world like that, is to have indifferent Politicians play roulette with your life!

Ron Paul is one of those "Principled" Politicians who left us all hanging out to dry. Therefore the Brotherhood will return the favor. The very best Paul could hope for in the future is Dog Catcher in some small town in Canada. We'll haunt him the rest of his life for what he has done. "Where Eagles Fly!"

[jmc813]

That's a lie. Unless he's not a libertarian. Libertarianism demands open borders, explicitly.

You're mixing up the platform of the Libertarian Party with mainstream libertarianism. Pretty much all of the libertarians here on FR are disgusted with the border situation and are fans of Tom Tancredo.

[jmc813]

Nah, it's because it costs an incredible sum of money for them to say, "We don't know what causes this. Get a blood test. Here's the same prescription I've been giving you for 3 years. See you in 2 months."

Paul is an obstetrician. Regardless of what you think of the state of medial care in the US today, would you not concede that Paul brings a legitimate, experienced voice to the pro-life movement? I'd be happy to provide you with some links to some awesome, logical, pro-life arguments made by Paul over the years.

[AmishDude]

Uh huh. Cato is for open borders. Sorry. Libertarian theory demands an end to national boundaries, anything else is trying to retrofit libertarianism to the real world.

[AmishDude]

Paul is an obstetrician.

An overpriced midwife.

Sorry. Medical school is easy.

[Pistolshot]

Sorry...in your own words you went from this....

The ruling government of Iraq is dominated by the psychopathic gang of murderers known as the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq (SCIRI) and the Islamic Al Dawa Party, who are the very same Islamic Terrorist Parties which bombed the US & French Embassies in Kuwait and murdered 241 United States Marines in Beirut in 1983.

To this....

Jamal Jafaar Mohammed is not an MP who "could be" convicted, he HAS BEEN convicted and is still under a Kuwaiti death sentence.

and from this....

"Iraqi Government is now a Government dominated by convicted Islamic Terrorists"

to this....

"Iraqi Government is now a Government dominated by self-confessed Islamic Terrorists"

Whatever RP's shortcomings are in voting with the Democrats, they do not even come close to the dodging and deflection of questions put to you that you have shown here. I hope you are not helping anywhere in his campaign as your continuing change of view and distortions would only hurt the man, and he is doing a fine job on his own.

You have been asked REPEATEDLY to name names....not generalizations, of the people you say are convicted terrorists dominating the Iraqi government. You have yet to do so.

You have come up with one name. One name only.
I am sure that ONE individual can terrorize the entire Iraqi government./sarcasm

I posted the breakdown of the Iraqi Parliment in one of my posts. The Al-Dawa party is not listed ANYWHERE in the current make up of the Iraqi government.

This leads me to a few conclusions.

You are hurting your own candidate with your lack of knowledge.

You have little in the way of debate skills and cannot support your postings with actual facts other than a leftist blog.

You are not worth spending any more bandwidth or my time on this subject. Ron Paul is DOA as a candidate, I'm sorry to say.

All of which are true.

Good night.

[jmc813]

Uh huh. Cato is for open borders. Sorry. Libertarian theory demands an end to national boundaries, anything else is trying to retrofit libertarianism to the real world.

Who do you think is better on immigration, Ron Paul or President Bush?

[jmc813]

Paul is an obstetrician.

An overpriced midwife.

Sorry. Medical school is easy.

I'm trying to abide by a New Year's resolution to not personally insult any other freepers, but I'm sorry, that is a retarded comment. Doctors who deal with human life at such an early stage are our best allies in making real the horror which abortion really is.