Abortions: Lawmaker touts death certificates

AP via KnoxNews ^ | 2/13/7 | ERIK SCHELZIG

[skr]

He counts for those of us who know how precious life is. I'm very sorry for your loss.

[maryz]

Is there an exception for "spontaneous abortions" in this bill?

Don't death certificates normally include a cause of death? There's no reason these should be any different, i.e., "spontaneous abortion due to (fill in the blank)" or "induced abortion."

[Nevernow]

I don't understand the point of it. If abortions already need to be reported somewhere...what would it do besides finger women who had abortions, prompting them to seek abortions elsewhere or bribing doctors not to file a certificate? More money for abortionists, abortions still under-reported, a lot of money spent.

If he wants to keep track of how many are done in TN, why not just require doctors to report how many patients they have? They're not going to skew the numbers lower, because that would indicate there's less of a market for abortion than there really is and would make lawmakers more likely to consider abortion restrictions. If they skew the numbers higher, it works for the pro-life side.

All it would do is give pro-choice activists another reason to say we just want to punish women for having abortions, and we don't really care about the baby.

[Mr. Silverback]

Privacy issues? The woman's name wouldn't have to be on the death certificate.

Will it pass? No, but it does reveal how the Dems like to cover their ears and say "LA-LA-LA-LA-LA-LA-LA-LA-LA" whenever the difference between scinece and their agenda is brought up.

[nmh]

"Is there an exception for "spontaneous abortions" in this bill?
That is the clinical definition of a "miscarriage".
I had five of them.
Would it make you feel better if you could "shame me" for them?"

There is a BIg DIFFERENCE between a "miscarriage" or "spontaneous" abortion ... surely even YOU know the difference between that and a PLANNED murder of an unborn baby.

Geesh! Looking for loopholes for justify abortion -

utterly disgusting.

[BritExPatInFla]

Is there an exception for "spontaneous abortions" in this bill? That is the clinical definition of a "miscarriage". I had five of them. Would it make you feel better if you could "shame me" for them?

Some would like for those who lose a baby for ANY reason to have a nice piece of paper to comemorate the event. This will do wonders to get those who are "on the fence" about abortion to get behind the pro-life movement. [/sarc]

[sarasmom]

No, I am not looking for any loopholes, but I AM looking for unintended consequences, and also protecting privacy rights.

For example,in my fifth miscarriage, my pregnancy was far enough along to require a D&C in order to stop the bleeding and prevent infection/damage to my uterus.
I most definately did not "plan the murder of my unborn child", but performing a D&C on a female still testing positive for pregnancy hormones was considered a medical abortion, and it took me a long time to get over that hump, emotionally, even though I knew I had already lost my baby.

Probably more information than you cared to hear, but still it applies in this discussion.

If there is to be a required death certificate issued for abortions identifying the "mother", will there also be a requirement that the "father" also be identified?

Pregnancy does involve both sexes, and with the advances made in DNA research, the information is obtainable...

BTW, I am an "anti-abortion/pro-life" advocate, not a "pro-abortion/pro-choice" supporter.

And your own hollow, malicious opinions, sir/madamn, are what utterly disgusts me, on this particular topic.

The Pro-Life, anti-abortion movement is gaining ground throughout the nation, in proving the obvious, through both moral and indisputable medical arguments, that abortion is in fact and practice, the murder of an unborn human being.

May I suggest that you unhitch yourself from partisan politicians for a time, and listen to the people.

[sarasmom]

Often, very sincere and honestly dedicated people refuse to comprehend that they have achieved their original goal, and they continue to fight against imaginary shadow enemies, because it has become their lifestyle, and they have learned to love "the fight" more than the actual result.

If you tell them they are now acting in a counterproductive manner to their original goal, you become their imaginary enemy.

Just try to tell a "labor union employee" that his/her "Union" are taking their membership dues, and working very hard, for the benefit of illegals, that are keeping his/her wages low.
They will never believe you, no matter how many facts you give them to prove the contrary and the obvious.

Sigh.
Lock and load.

[nmh]

"And your own hollow, malicious opinions, sir/madamn, are what utterly disgusts me, on this particular topic."

That's precisely what I think of people like you ... constantly haridplitting reasons to allow abortions. What you described doesn't fall into the category of premeditated murder that I spoke of. Maybe you have a guilty conscience and its all made up nonsense? Who knows. I put nothing past people like yourself.

"The Pro-Life, anti-abortion movement is gaining ground throughout the nation, in proving the obvious, through both moral and indisputable medical arguments, that abortion is in fact and practice, the murder of an unborn human being."

Well maybe you see the light after all!

"May I suggest that you unhitch yourself from partisan politicians for a time, and listen to the people."

You may "suggest" whatever you like.

This is NOT a "partisan" issue. You really need to THINK for a change. Perhaps even beyond your own selfish whims and understand the unborn don't have a voice. The unborn are at the mercy of people. People that believe they have a right to live too!

[nmh]

"For example,in my fifth miscarriage, my pregnancy was far enough along to require a D&C in order to stop the bleeding and prevent infection/damage to my uterus.
I most definately did not "plan the murder of my unborn child", but performing a D&C on a female still testing positive for pregnancy hormones was considered a medical abortion, and it took me a long time to get over that hump, emotionally, even though I knew I had already lost my baby."

IF, THIS is all TRUE, why would a death certificate be so offensive? It shouldn't be if the baby was already dead. Miscarriages happen. Me thinks you're being a tad ridiculous as well as extremely paranoid. If the baby is already dead, you MUST remove it otherwise it becomes toxic to your body.

BTW, it's very unlikely that people would be interested in your situation since it is very common. Your "privacy" is not at risk with a miscarriage. GEESH!

[topher]

This is something that might pass in other Southern states if brought to the floor for passage.

It needs to be argued that it is for the protection of the woman/girl that this be done.

Also, any such certificate should take a sample of the DNA of the fetus.

This would help in cases of child abuse where the father is a relative (step father/father/brother/cousin) and where the father is an older man with a young girl (12 year old girl with 19 year old man for example).

The Life Dynamics information collected from their sting of Planned Parenthood should be displayed to the members of the legislature for these laws...

[baa39]

I used to be common for parents to have funerals and cemetery burials for preemies that died or still-born children, or miscarriages. This is still done, of course. After all, it's a human being not a piece of 'biological waste'.

[Nevernow]

I didn't know the name wouldn't be on it.

I still think it's counterproductive. It's also placing the cart before the horse.

If instead of focusing on pretending these people are recognized persons by law, why not use the effort and money to push legislation that would actually make these people recognized persons by law?

I want these babies to be recognized as people, don't get me wrong. But I think that this sort of thing is going to set the prolife movement back instead of forward. It won't pass, and when it doesn't pass, people are going to point to it as one more example of a fetus not being a person who should have rights. It's already disgusting fencers on other messageboards. The aim isn't to push people away. We WILL win. But we'll win faster and save more lives if we change public opinion using scientific data and hard evidence, instead of doomed emotional tactics that are already pushing people away.