If all can't win none will - 4 SAISD schools choose chemistry over cash

San Antonio Express-News ^ | February 2, 2007 | Jenny LaCoste-Caputo

[Cincinatus' Wife]

This is a perfect example as to why public schools fail - there is no reward for excellence on any level.

[DB]

Amazing...

[Navy Patriot]

Well, I guess everybody's equal, and mediocre at best.

Teacher battles over who gets merit pay make me wonder if the problem for the teachers not getting the merit pay is that they spent a lot of time on PC indoctrination, and the kids were tested on the three R's for the bonus paychecks. Oops!

[JoeGar]

Teachers unions, like most unions, object to merit pay. It's just not fair to the slackers.

[Truth29]

Good little socialists teaching the kids to be more of the same.

[johniegrad]

Statewide, 54 schools rejected the money.

This doesn't happen by chance. The teachers' unions have organized an effort to prevent incentives.

[johniegrad]

This is a perfect example as to why public schools fail - there is no reward for excellence on any level

Actually, the rewards are there. They just refuse to allow merit to prevail in getting them.

[boxerblues]

Houston ISD, the largest urban district in the nation to develop its own merit pay program, handed out its first bonus checks last week and spawned a backlash from teachers who didn't make the cut.

NO merit pay but are still teaching the kids.. go figure

[BlessedBeGod]

...school leaders worried that the cash rewards would create dissention...

Another example of schools failing. The reporter can't even spell. There's no such word as "dissention."

I'm assuming she meant "dissension."

[Cincinatus' Wife]

...The teachers' unions have organized an effort to prevent incentives.

The "winners" won't say anything in the face of this object nonsense but rather will leave to teach somewhere else.

I don't want to hear any more whining about they don't get paid enough. The public school system is run by teachers' unions. Public schools get 50%+ of all state budgets and more money comes from the federal govt, etc, etc.

They have more money than they need.

Public education is an incompetent, graft-ridden socialist enterprise.

[MSSC6644]

there is no reward for excellence on any level

As a former teacher of English at the high school level, I believe excellence is its own reward. And because that particular value has been "lost," so has excellence.

[Cincinatus' Wife]

As a former teacher of English at the high school level, I believe excellence is its own reward.

This is true however you should never be forced to compare yourself with the worst. If you have ambition, drive and ability you should be rewarded.

The teachers could have set a good example by showing that excellence is rewarded. They should have posted the awards and held ceremonies at the schools. But they won't because parents would all want the good teachers for their children. Honoring those who did more (produced more) would have damaged the socialist mindset of public education, therefore quality is lost.

[DaGman]

Bonuses based on rankings destroys teamwork. I've seen it happen countless times. The greedy ones in the bunch undermine the rest. Pay 'em all or pay none of them if you want a good organization. Paying teachers bonuses is a ridiculous concept. Pay car salesmen bonuses. Not teachers.

[TXnMA]

"Pay 'em all or pay none of them if you want a good organization."

~~~~~

Bravo sierra!

Writtten as from one who is perennially at the low end of the performance distribution.

"Teamwork" is a union-promoted bunch of pap.

Children are not inspired to achieve by mediocre "teams".

Children are inspired to excellence by excellent individual teachers

"Featherbedding" by unions wishing to protect the lazy and incompetent is pure Marxist bunk.

~~

The American education system does not need a "good organization" (alias for "Union"). Take your socialist tripe to DU or KOS -- it does not belong here.

[A Strict Constructionist]

Talk to a teacher and find out how easy it is to have a bad year in a classroom. All it takes is one disruptive child who can not be controlled effects the learning atmosphere and the test scores of all the kids in the room. Public Schools have no choice in which children are in their classrooms and trying to get rid of a bad apple can take months. Learning is not a 9-4 occupation and most parents don't want to be bothered. Some parents can't help because of lack of education, others like docs, lawyers and indian chiefs, can't be bothered to help because they want to go to this or that at night. Many kid activities now are really networking activities for parents. In my experience the professional are the worst because they can't be bothered by ignorant teachers... because Johnny is my kid and I know he wouldn't do that or he's not learning but I'm bright so he must be. They run to the politicians on the school board who are only there a stepping stone to their next run for office.
Teachers are stuck with the luck of the draw for students and parents and are judged on their test scores. Sometimes they start with kids knowing less than nothing and improve them 300%, but the kid still didn't make the mean score on the test. So the teacher failed.
I have been married to a teacher for many years. She teaches in a top school district and is highly qualified. She has all these problems and more as an inclusion teacher with a classroom full of kids some "normal", some with handicaps and at least one really bad kid. For some reason she loves it. Neither she or her fellow teachers are liberals, all Republicans, as far as I know. They are not unionized, my wife hates the NEA, and this is a Public School. The people that always bash teachers should look at other professions as well. I do a lot of expert testimony and I feel the same way about lawyers. They frequently come into court unprepared to examine the expert they hired, simply because they are too busy to have a conference with the expert. They ask the wrong question and are surprised when they don't get the answer they want. It's amazing the number that get mad at the expert instead of themselves. This is the same attitude seen when Johnny doesn't get the grade they think he deserves. Remember that private schools can pick and choose but Public schools don't have that choice. Maybe we should grade all professions the same way that teachers are graded and post their scores.

[LonePalm]

If you want to really see the schools improve, institute a voucher program where the parents are given a voucher to send their child to the school of their choice.

Competition produces excellence in the market place and monopoly does not. Apply the anti-monopoly laws to the schools and you'll really see them take off.

Better people and methods will be drawn into the schools and those that can't make it will fail. The real winners will be the kids.

Garde la Foi, mes amis! Nous nous sommes les sauveurs de la République! Maintenant et Toujours!
(Keep the Faith, my friends! We are the saviors of the Republic! Now and Forever!)
LonePalm, le Républicain du verre cassé (The Broken Glass Republican)

[Cincinatus' Wife]

The great concept of learning in teams is one of the new ways to teach math.

I believe the idea is to put one smart student with three struggling students and let them teach and/or give the answers on the test.

The teachers don't have a clue, so they've learned to improvise.

[Cincinatus' Wife]

Thank you for taking the time to list all the ills of society.

I suggest you get on the side of getting rid of the current mess that passes for education instead of having to resort to such a laundry list of excuses why public education doesn't work.

Isn't that getting a bit weary? We all know the problems.

Parents are told to bake cookies (or cut carrots) and stay out of the way because the schools know best.

Schools move the bad (including criminal) teachers around.

School administrators steal from schools.

Universities have to test to know which remedial classes incoming freshmen need.

Homework is so bad parents are pulling their hair out. What the hell are they teaching in school?

Why can't students (especially boys) run off some energy?

If you can't teach because there are disruptive kids in the class, raise a stink! But then you can't, can you, because you'll be a trouble maker and the lawyers will breath down the schools neck -- and they won't fight -- they'll just buy-off the problem with all that taxpayer's money that they didn't earn.

Why do administrators make so much money?

I do not lump all teachers together but if you keep stay in the barrel filled with rotten apples, how can you tell the difference?

I could go on and on and on but you get where I'm coming from.

[lepton]

Poilitics plays a role in every organization, however when you introduce incentives like this into organizations that have long been dominated by politics, it rapidly turns into bloodsport. Part of the *legitimate* problem is that there has not been a meritocracy for a long time, wheras if things had started out that way, financial incentives would be melded and everyone would know how to act. Large incentives introduced suddenly have a tendency to create corruption before the social and moral mechanisms are in place.

[VeniVidiVici]

"The para-professionals, the cafeteria workers, they all play a big part in what we do," she said. "We understand we can not do our jobs without them"

Para-professionals. I can honestly say I haven't heard this one before.

I'm all for merit raises. Raising somebody's pay just cuz they've been there longer is an idiotic way to do things that creates lazy people. Kinda like tenure :-)