Posted on 01/18/2007 2:13:50 PM PST by alienken
For me they are telling the truth about what goes down in a war zone. This is the fatal flaw in your thinking. The Mexican border is a war zone where we are being invaded by Hispanic people and drug pushers. This is not a normal police situation with all the la di da niceties you prefer. You would have handled the situation much worse than those two Border Patrol men.
Rush Limbaugh just said the White House might pardon them. If that happens it shoots you down. If Bush pardons them this means there is such a thing as justice on the Border.
Rep. Dana Rohrabacher of California said Agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Alonso Compean are scheduled to begin serving 11- and 12-year prison terms, respectively, in January and called on Mr. Bush to "do the right thing and not allow the lives and families of these fine men to be destroyed this holiday."
Mr. Rohrabacher made the request during a press conference, joined by Republican Reps. Walter B. Jones of North Carolina, Ted Poe of Texas and Marsha Blackburn of Tennessee, to announce that more than 50 members of Congress have signed on to a pardon request letter to Mr. Bush.
"These Border Patrol agents are heroes," said Mr. Rohrabacher. "Because of their actions, over a million dollars in illegal drugs were stopped from being sold to our children. Bringing felony charges against them is a travesty of justice beyond description.
"The president needs to send the right message by showing they are on the side of law enforcement, not drug traffickers," he said.
Compean, 28, and Ramos, 37, were sentenced Oct. 19 by U.S. District Court Judge Kathleen Cardone in El Paso, Texas, to prison for causing serious bodily injury, assault with a deadly weapon, discharge of a firearm in relation to a crime of violence and a civil rights violation. A federal jury convicted the two men in March after a two-week trial, and Judge Cardone ordered them to report to prison Jan. 17.
The government brought the charges after Osbaldo Aldrete-Davila, a Mexican national, agreed to testify against the agents in exchange for immunity after an investigation by the Department of Homeland Security's Office of Inspector General. The immunity deal protected Mr. Aldrete-Davila from being charged in this country as a drug smuggler. Ramos and Compean found 743 pounds of marijuana in the van he abandoned near the border.
Mr. Aldrete-Davila was shot after he illegally entered the United States near Fabens, Texas, and refused efforts by the agents to stop the van. Court records show he jumped from the vehicle and ran south to the Rio Grande, where he was confronted by Compean, who was knocked to the ground.
Although wounded, Mr. Aldrete-Davila managed to cross the border and escape in a waiting van.
"The U.S. Attorney wrongly focused on the minor mistakes of the officers instead of on the illegal drug trafficker," Mr. Rohrabacher said.
"When American citizens see an illegal alien narcotics trafficker being given immunity and free health care while the officers who risked their lives to stop him are going to prison, they must believe we in Washington either do not care about the uncontrolled flow of criminals or illegals or they just think we have lost our minds," he said.
The government's prosecution began after an investigator from the Office of Inspector General located Mr. Aldrete-Davila in Mexico. The investigator had been dispatched after Mr. Aldrete-Davila's mother complained to a Border Patrol agent in Arizona that her son had been shot. That agent notified Homeland Security.
True. I sure hope I never get caught in a fox hole with one of 'em.
Back in the day, the types that did not get it had a saying: "better red than dead"
See, I would say "in spite of their actions". Certainly the shooting did nothing to help seize the drugs, they guy abandon the drugs and ran away.
If the guy had been smarter, he would have had an accomplice who would come and get the drugs while these officers were off chasing after the first guy.
The fact there were drugs in the van was itself simply a fortunate coincidence for them, as they had no suspicion of drug activity when they started the chase.
I'm pretty sure it was "better dead than red", but I didn't hang out with the other crows so maybe you know better than me.
So where's your Christian charity? You smugly give zero credit to these two BP agents who prevented a million dollars worth of pot from entering the sovereign nation that you live in
Earlier in the thread, someone brought up Berger, who stole from the national archives, put evidence in his socks, lost it forever. Well, he's running around free.
Compare that with two border patrol agents, who risk their lives everyday, hide a few bullets (knowing our government sides with illegals more often than not) and they get 12 years?
As soon as the goose is punished like the gander, then I'll say the law is just.
I don't see how Bush issuing a pardon "shoots me down". I'm not writing to him asking him NOT to do so. Criminals are pardoned all the time, for many reasons.
You might for example pardon them because the sentence is just too harsh. I guess Bush could pardon them for the crime that gave them the mandatory 10-year sentence, which would then leave them with the 1-2 years for the other charges.
I am happy to have another pair of eyes look at all the evidence, I'm sure they won't base their decision on what they read in the newspapers.
Anyway, back to your original point. If Bush pardons them, that would in fact shoot down YOUR position, which is that the prosecuter falsely accused and railroaded these people to jail on the orders of President Bush who wants to coddle illegals.
We are NOT at war with Mexico, and the border is not a war zone, at least no literally. I suppose you could call downtown of most cities as war zones as well, with rival gangs and such. But you belittle those who are fighting in real wars when you label our border a "war zone" and suggest that the rules of war, rather than the rules of civil society, should apply.
Oh, and in war you don't shoot civilians in the back either.
The men shot at a guy, and when he ran off they acted like nothing happened, the collected the evidence, they filed a false report. Doesn't sound like people who were responding validly to a "war zone".
LOL! It was the pacifists who twisted that. Pacifists won't fight or kill under any circumstance, and condemn those that do.
You said you would not shoot osama bin laden or saddam hussein in the back, so I guess you understand pacifism.
Christian charity has NOTHING to do with "giving credit".
Good acts don't mitigate bad acts either.
Most cases of police brutality start with the police performing valid law enforcement duties that protect us.
Ol' Charlie Wayne is too far gone in his thinking to argue with him. He doesn't think the US Attorney's office is using this case to send a message to the border agents. Bush, Gonzalez and Sutton have made this case about open borders and lax security. It stinks to high heaven. I am ashamed to call Bush Mr. President (and I voted for him twice) after the way he is handling illegal immigration and border security.
That message is, "don't commit a felony or you will be punished".
Sounds Conservative and sound to me.
btw- Your habit of talking behind people's backs shows a lack of a valid position and a lack of character.
Thanks for the heads up, I've only be arguing with people who respond to me, so I missed this.
cmiller623, generally people who say it is hopeless to argue with someone do so because they have no argument to make.
I don't think the prosecuter is using the case to send a message. I also see no evidence to support such a thought, nor do I see any evidence presented by my opposition which would support the charge, for example maybe a list of 5 cases the prosecuter has filed in the past year which show a pattern of "sending messages".
Maybe though I should temper that remark. All prosecution is an attempt to send a message, namely DO NOT BREAK THE LAW.
So I would agree that the Prosecuter is sending a message to BP agents that they are not above the law, and that if they break the law they won't get off just because they are wearing a badge.
However, I don't think that's the mesage you contend they are sending. I'll let you tell us what the message is, and provide your evidence, if you have any.
You're right on the better dead than red
Stop being ridiculous. These two BP agents kept $1,000,000 worth of pot from being smuggled into America (where you live) yet get sent to prison while the drug smuggling low life gets immunity for his smuggling crime (and got immunity once again when he was caught bringing drugs in a second time!)
Plus the drug smuggling low life now has a 5 million dollar lawsuit against the US. How much do you think this shot_in_the_butt low life should be awarded? Do you have a number in mind for this "outrageous" shooting?
You can read the message, the Mexican criminals can read the message but Charlie remains oblivious. Ignorance is bliss. This maggot Johnny Sutton (US Attorney) knows George Bush from way back, one of my posts has this information
I say the prosecutor intentionally is sending a message. But let's pretend he isn't.
His prosecution of two BP agents will definitely send a message to Mexican criminals and drug smugglers that the BP will not be aggressive with them because the BP agents are intimidated by this jackass Sutton coming down on them like a ton of bricks
Johnny Sutton's prosecution will definitely be read by Border Patrol agents to play nice with low life Mexican criminals or you too can end up in prison
END RESULT -OUR BORDER IS LESS SECURE. And you don't seem to care. Not a high priority for you. Instead sending these two BP agents to prison is a must because thou shall not shoot at a Mexican drug smuggler when it appears he is shooting at you
Free Nacho!
The rumor of a 2nd drug trip has been denounced as false -- where is there any evidence? There is no reason why they would give him immunity for a 2nd trip into the country, as they didn't need his testimony about that. I don't know how the rumor got started, but were's the evidence for it, given the prosecutors blanket denial that he was given immunity for, or was arrested for, a 2nd trip.
I hope he loses his 5 million dollar lawsuit. It's a stupid one, and I also hope he doesn't get immunity from prosecution for anything he says during THAT trial. BTW, that would be interesting, wouldn't it, if he and his lawyer don't realise that "use immunity" only covers his testimony in the criminal trial, and they make the mistake of testifying in the civil trial and end up thrown in jail?
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