Pennyslvania poised to follow Calif.'s stricter car pollution rules

ap on Riverside Press Enterprise ^ | 9/17/06 | Marc Levy - ap

[Gay State Conservative]

Could a PA resident get around these regs by buying in bordering states...other than NY?

[P-40]

would require new cars to be cleaner-burning a year from now

That is not going very far out on the limb. The new rules require more flex fuel vehicles next year and the new biodiesel and ethanol plants are coming online. If they set a low hurdle they will succeed by doing nothing.

[jeremiah]

They will institute emissions testing, which drivers would pay for, and if they fail, the car will not be allowed current registration.

[Gay State Conservative]

They will institute emissions testing, which drivers would pay for, and if they fail, the car will not be allowed current registration.

I think that emissions testing must allow for what the car was designed to do.So if you buy a car in Oklahoma and then move to California,all that can be expected is that it meet (or comes close to meeting) regulation in effect in OK when the car was made.

I suspect that PA could have a law that says that any car being registered for the first time must meet the stricter regs,or perhaps there's a Federal law that says the same thing.

[Malacoda]

Probably not, as we have to have a yearly emissions inspection every darn year.

[Malacoda]

We already have yearly emissions testing -- I'm guessing they'll up the regs for new cars.

[John Jorsett]

One reason people should care what happens in California is because of situations like this. California works out its own set of standards for things like vehicle emissions, textbook contents, etc. and because it's so large, businesses frequently decide to just go with the stricter CA standards for everything they sell. California ends up big-footing the entire country.

[ChildOfThe60s]

I don't see how. The cars sold anywhere in the US now have to meet CA smog rules. I don't mean by law, I mean by practical business reality.

Basically, we have CA lib kooks that have a profound economic effect on the rest of us normal people. And it's not positive. I half believe that the US would be better off if CA seceded from the Union.

[Gay State Conservative]

Probably not, as we have to have a yearly emissions inspection every darn year.

Yes,as do many states.But if PA adopts CA standards,one or more bordering states might still have the less stringent ones.And as you may know,it's not at all unusual for resident of one state to buy a new car in another.

Under these circumstances,a buyer could avoid the (substantial) added expense of buying a CA emissions car in such a neighboring state...unless PA or Federal law would forbid that.

[Gay State Conservative]

I don't see how. The cars sold anywhere in the US now have to meet CA smog rules. I don't mean by law, I mean by practical business reality.

Are you certain of that? Have the auto makers decided it's just more efficient to make all cars sold in the US comply with CA? If so,why would the PA legislature even bother passing the law cited in this thread?

[ChildOfThe60s]

Are you certain of that? Have the auto makers decided it's just more efficient to make all cars sold in the US comply with CA? If so,why would the PA legislature even bother passing the law cited in this thread?

I just bought a new car in Kentucky. Every car I looked at said on the sticker that it met emission requirements in all 50 states.

As to the reasons for PA legislature's behavior, I can only say that irrational behavior cannot be attributed to rational thought. IOW, consider the source.

[BallyBill]

"The evidence points to customers realizing a savings," McGinty said...

WOW, save money and the planet!

[WildBill2275]

Kathleen A. McGinty, said Pennsylvania needs to cut vehicle pollution to help the majority of the state's counties meet federal air quality standards.
The alternative is forcing expensive pollution cutbacks onto the state's heavy industries and power plants or losing federal highway dollars, McGinty said.
So we can see PA is willing to screw the motorist to help cover for a different problem.

For now, California's pollution standard means cars must produce less smog-forming nitrogen oxides and volatile organic compounds, as well as less cancer-causing benzene.
We stopped using lead in gas cause it messed up the catalytic converters that were there to cut “CO” (carbon monoxide). They did this by forcing us to use a richer mixture that was not burned as completely so the catalytic converter could convert the unburned fuel and “CO” to “CO2”. Then we put all of the computer crap on our cars to get the mileage we used to get with out it.
NOTE: Nitrogen oxides in exhaust gases are a product of catalytic converter and ethanol technology.
So the catalytic converter costs only about $100 extra. The stuff that compensates for that costs an extra $1500.

Is anyone surprised that this crap originated in California?

[bvw]

I know as a fact that emissions testing limits in PA (and other states) were as of 1998 set by looking at prior years stats for older vehicles and setting the next years levels so that X% of them at each year of vehicle age will fail.

It is CA BAR that sets the standards all states and even the US EPA follow, the EPA comes up with their own stuff too, they generally let CA BAR take the lead (although some states sometimes come up with novel and weird ideas that they implement as regulation before the technology is proven).

I'm not in that business anymore, but when I was most or all auto emmissions equipment had to be certified in CA by CA BAR if used in the US.

[B Knotts]

The CARB Nitrogen Oxide limits they want to adopt result in more, not less greenhouse gas emissions.

Someone should challenge them on this.

[B Knotts]

That's not accurate. There are a number of models that are sold in 45 states only.

[ChildOfThe60s]

Close enough. I'll bet that the vast majority of cars/models meet CA emission requirements.

Still, I haven't seen those that don't. So, obviously I have not been in those states. I would interested in knowing a little more.

[Tribune7]

ping

[Malacoda]

Well, they already have a system in place to collect PA tax if you buy the car out of state. I bought my car in DE (no tax), but had to register it and insure it in PA. When I filled out the registration papers, they collected the tax on the spot, and I had to get it inspected in PA within a few days of registering it.

I suppose you could fib, and register/insure it in anther state, but I'd think getting caught would suck.