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A difficult choice and the follow-through [2nd trimester abortion]
Toronto Globe & Mail ^ | 7/12/06 | C. SMYTH

Posted on 07/12/2006 1:00:02 PM PDT by madprof98

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To: madprof98

I have always wanted to ask people who support abortions of babies with Downs or other birth defects because the baby isn't "perfect" what they would plan to do if their next, "perfect" babies develops autism as a infant/toddler. Would they advocate killing those children? If not, what is the difference between killing a Down's Syndrome baby in the womb and killing an 18 month old because it has autism?


41 posted on 07/12/2006 1:34:27 PM PDT by LWalk18
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To: madprof98

They're professional. They have degrees. They have financial security. They're fit. They have healthy lifestyles. They just didn't have a conscience, or a universe that contains anything other [or more important to them] than themselves. And the kid, by not being consistent with their self image, paid the price.

And, oh yeah, they have no shame. The article proves that.


42 posted on 07/12/2006 1:34:59 PM PDT by PzLdr ("The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am" - Darth Vader)
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To: madprof98

I got sick reading the article. My son does not have Down Syndrome, but there are kids with Downs who are higher functioning than he is. Doctors have never been able to tell us the why/how, but he is my wonderful treasure from God. I can't imagine a day without his laughter and love, and all that he brings to this family. But what do I know? I never went to college, don't own our own home and the only shape I'm in is round. Not the "best" parent material by this woman's standards.


43 posted on 07/12/2006 1:37:01 PM PDT by voiceinthewind
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To: madprof98
Another Season : A Coach's Story of Raising an Exceptional Son
44 posted on 07/12/2006 1:38:06 PM PDT by stinkerpot65
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To: LWalk18
f not, what is the difference between killing a Down's Syndrome baby in the womb and killing an 18 month old because it has autism?

LIBERAL ANSWER: "If I kill the defective fetus I can then go and whoop it up for a couple of months in Paris before I get pregnant again. Who the hell wants a freak baby anyway? It would be such a drag on the Upper West Side..."

45 posted on 07/12/2006 1:39:39 PM PDT by frogjerk (LIBERALISM: The perpetual insulting of common sense.)
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To: madprof98
My wife is pregnant with our fourth child. She had her second sonogram today. During the examination, the nurse very matter-of-factly asked if we wanted to run a battery of tests designed to evaluate a number of potential health issues. I asked the nurse if there was any available in-utero treatment for those possible conditions. She said, "no, the tests are for you to determine whether to discontinue the pregnancy."

My wife and I both said, in somewhat defiant voices "no way!"

I deplore that facet of our society that has dedicated brilliant minds and research dollars to conduct tests that have no purpose other than to promoting abortions.

It made this miraculous day rather somber.
46 posted on 07/12/2006 1:39:50 PM PDT by el_chupacabra (They say it's always calmest before the storm. That's not true. It isn't calm. Stuff happens.)
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To: P8riot
My wife and I would dearly love to adopt another child. We have several friends and some family that have Downs kids. Despite their learning disabilities, they are without exception the nicest, sweetest kids I have ever seen. It just burns me up when I see this wanton destruction of another innocent human life.

A couple with a Down's child sits close to us in church most Sundays.

He's about 5 years old and we have watched him grow from birth. He's a joy to his parents and everyone he meets. How some ghouls can deem such a sweet fellow unworthy of life is astonishing.

My wife and I were warned about the possibility of Down's when we discovered she was pregnant last year (my wife is pushing 40). I thought about the little guy from church. I knew I could live with that and raise such a child with all the love in the world.

Certainly, the thought of killing our baby was not even considered.

47 posted on 07/12/2006 1:40:23 PM PDT by Skooz (Chastity prays for me, piety sings...Modesty hides my thighs in her wings...)
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To: MeanWestTexan

I refused all such tests in all four of my pregnancies, because there would be no "choice" to be made.

The assumption this women made that killing a Down Syndrome baby would be fine with pro-lifers is nauseating too.


48 posted on 07/12/2006 1:41:16 PM PDT by Politicalmom (Nearly 1% of illegals are in prison for felonies. Less than 1/10 of 1% of the legal population is.)
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To: Windsong
Downs is no walk in the park.

People who love their children deal with it. Monsters who can't be bothered with less than perfect children, kill them.

49 posted on 07/12/2006 1:42:20 PM PDT by Skooz (Chastity prays for me, piety sings...Modesty hides my thighs in her wings...)
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To: PzLdr

To add some disgust, we're not talking about a gross (by which I mean "huge") problem here, just a marginal problem that every kid has of some kind.

Indeed, odd were that her daughter would have been fine, just from looking at Web MD:

"Triplo X Syndrome is a chromosomal abnormality that affects females. Females normally have two X chromosomes; however, those with Triplo X Syndrome carry three X chromosomes (trisomy X) in the nuclei of body cells. No specific pattern of symptoms and malformations (phenotype) has been found to be associated with this abnormal chromosomal make-up (i.e., 47,XXX karyotype). Many affected females appear to have no or very few associated symptoms, while others may have various abnormalities.


However, investigators indicate that Triplo X Syndrome is a relatively common cause of learning difficulties, particularly language-based disabilities (e.g., dyslexia), in females. Evidence suggests that affected females typically have normal intelligence with IQs that tend to be lower than that of their brothers and sisters (siblings). Mental retardation rarely occurs. Infants and children with Triplo X Syndrome may tend to have delayed acquisition of certain motor skills and delayed language and speech development.


Affected females often are of tall stature. According to researchers, although sexual development and fertility are usually normal, some may have delayed puberty and/or fertility problems. In addition, in some cases, certain physical abnormalities have been reported, such as a relatively small head, vertical skin folds that may cover the eyes' inner corners (epicanthal folds), and/or other findings. Triplo X Syndrome results from errors during the division of reproductive cells in one of the parents."


50 posted on 07/12/2006 1:42:53 PM PDT by MeanWestTexan (Many at FR would respond to Christ "Darn right, I'll cast the first stone!")
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To: sockmonkey

God forbid they got a shy bookworm.


51 posted on 07/12/2006 1:43:14 PM PDT by Politicalmom (Nearly 1% of illegals are in prison for felonies. Less than 1/10 of 1% of the legal population is.)
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To: Reddy

I felt the same way - she did not have a miscarriage. This is the most selfish story I've ever seen. She wants sympathy???? she has got to be kidding herself.


52 posted on 07/12/2006 1:45:34 PM PDT by KEmom (Please send viable Republican candidates to Massachusetts!!)
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To: MEGoody

It's kind of sad that in these cases the ones whom our society would be better off without (the selfish "parents") aren't the ones who lose their lives.


53 posted on 07/12/2006 1:47:35 PM PDT by BMIC (I'm so bad...)
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To: Politicalmom

"I refused all such tests in all four of my pregnancies, because there would be no "choice" to be made."

Yep, we did it only because we had multiples (twins) before and were trying to figure out if Mrs. MWT was going to have to be on bed rest for six months again.

Today the little monkey has figured out she can grab ahold of a kitchen table (normal height), do a finger-tip pull up (tough for an adult) and flip up onto the table.

Rather impressive upper body strength for a 20 month old, but scary. We're trying to stop it.


54 posted on 07/12/2006 1:49:36 PM PDT by MeanWestTexan (Many at FR would respond to Christ "Darn right, I'll cast the first stone!")
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To: Skooz
One of my co-workers is secretary of a local support group for parents with Down's kids. He brings his daughter to work occassionally, she's thirteen, and is the sweetest girl you'd ever want to meet.

My wife and I have been trying to get pregnant since our son was born 4 yrs ago. My wife just turned 41, and I'll be 50 in September, but we feel that it is important for our son to have a sibling, and if that sibling has Down's, so-what!

Back when my wife was pregnant the OB GYN asked if we wanted to have any tests done to determine the potential for Down's and we told him that it wouldn't make any difference we were going to go through with the pregnancy regardless. Our son was 10-lbs even and scored perfect 10 on his Apgar test.

55 posted on 07/12/2006 1:51:00 PM PDT by P8riot ("You can get more with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone." - Al Capone)
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To: BMIC
It's kind of sad that in these cases the ones whom our society would be better off without (the selfish "parents") aren't the ones who lose their lives.

I agree. I've often wanted to confront the people in these kinds of article and throw a modified verison of the line from "A Christmas Carol" at them.

"The life of one of these so called 'imperfect' human beings may be worth more to God than millions like you."

56 posted on 07/12/2006 1:54:41 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: madprof98
Wasn't Hitler doing something like this?
57 posted on 07/12/2006 1:56:24 PM PDT by chapin2500
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To: madprof98

The Water Bearer

A water bearer in India had two large pots, each hung on each end of a pole which he carried across his neck. One of the pots had a crack in it, and while the other pot was perfect and always delivered a full portion of water at the end of the long walk from the stream to the master's house, the cracked pot arrived only half full. For a full two years this went on daily, with the bearer delivering only one and a half pots full of water in his master's house.

Of course, the perfect pot was proud of its accomplishments, perfect to the end for which it was made. But the poor cracked pot was ashamed of its own imperfection, and miserable that it was able to accomplish only half of what it had been made to do. After two years of what it perceived to be a bitter failure, it spoke to the water bearer one day by the stream.

"I am ashamed of myself, and I want to apologize to you."

"Why?" asked the bearer. "What are you ashamed of?"

"I have been able, for these past two years, to deliver only half my load because this crack in my side causes water to leak out all the way back to your master's house. Because of my flaws, you have to do all of this work, and you don't get full value from your efforts," the pot said.

The water bearer felt sorry for the old cracked pot, and in his compassion he said, "As we return to the master's house, I want you to notice the beautiful flowers along the path. Indeed, as they went up the hill, the old cracked pot took notice of the sun warming the beautiful wild flowers on the side of the path, and this cheered it some. But at the end of the trail, it still felt bad because had leaked out half its load, and so again it apologized to the bearer for its failure.

The bearer said to the pot, "Did you notice that there were flowers only on your side of your path, but not on the other pot's side? That's because I have always known about your flaw, and I took advantage of it. I planted flower seeds on your side of the path, and every day while we walk back from the stream, you've watered them. For two years I have been able to pick these beautiful flowers to decorate my master's table. Without you being just the way you are, he would not have this beauty to grace his house."


58 posted on 07/12/2006 2:00:11 PM PDT by Chesterbelloc
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To: luckystarmom

What a mother you must be...your little girl is so lucky to have you. May God bless you both!


59 posted on 07/12/2006 2:00:27 PM PDT by Iluvpopcrn (Karen)
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To: madprof98

I feel so sad when I hear of an abortion. I also feel sad when I hear of a couple, well past their prime, having children.


60 posted on 07/12/2006 2:02:44 PM PDT by wolfcreek
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