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Nation Breaking-soldier finds training the Iraqi army is an unwinnable battle [for strong stomachs]
The American Conservative ^ | 7-7-06 | Joe W. Guthrie

Posted on 07/07/2006 7:44:44 AM PDT by SJackson

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To: daybreakcoming
Can you come up with a reason that he wanted this published?

Well it's obviously something he thought strongly about. I may not agree with him but I'm not going to start questioning his motives based on this alone.

41 posted on 07/07/2006 2:50:10 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: SJackson
Sounds like another POS who was stationed at Ft. Lewis...but didn't go when deployed.

People like this arse dirty the thousands of good men and women who serve their nation and not a political agenda.

42 posted on 07/07/2006 2:55:28 PM PDT by CWOJackson (Tancredo? Wasn't he the bounty hunter in the Star Wars series?)
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To: Nathan Zachary

Mr. Zachary:

As someone who knows Joe Guthrie, the author of the article "Nation Breaking," very well (and he did write it, by the way), I feel compelled to respond to some erroneous assumptions you have made based on no information.

A) Joe is not and never has been a leftist. He was raised in a conservative family and has always maintained conservative values. This is why he wanted his article published in a CONSERVATIVE magazine, one whose agenda claims to seek out corruption in government, among other things!! Is anyone who disagrees with the Bush administration automatically branded a leftist, propagandist, pinko, etc.? Apparently this is indeed the case, and is a sad state of affairs. Try THINKING a little instead of just regurgitating what the administration wants you to believe.

B) THE ARMY DID NOT FUND ONE PENNY OF JOE'S EDUCATION!!! HE WAS IN GRADUATE SCHOOL WHEN THE RECRUITERS BEGAN TALKING TO HIM, BUT HE FINISHED A MASTER'S DEGREE IN HISTORY BEFORE HE EVER JOINED, ALL OF WHICH HE PAID FOR OUT OF HIS OWN POCKET!!! I THINK THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT FOR YOU TO KNOW, AND SHAME ON YOU FOR AUTOMATICALLY ASSUMING THAT THIS WAS HIS REASON FOR JOINING THE MILITARY. HE ACTUALLY HAD HIGH IDEALS ABOUT THE DIFFERENCE HE THOUGHT HE COULD MAKE WHEN HE MADE THE DECISION TO JOIN.

C) JOE IS A BIG, STRAPPING, 6'3" GUY WHO FOUGHT IN MANY BATTLES IN IRAQ AND WAS AWARDED SEVERAL MEDALS FOR THE JOB HE DID IN "FIREFIGHTS." HE LED HIS MEN BRAVELY AND WAS HIGHLY THOUGHT OF BY BOTH THE AMERICANS AND IRAQIS THAT HE TRAINED. THESE FACTS CAN BE VERIFIED EASILY. THERE IS NOTHING COWARDLY ABOUT THIS YOUNG MAN; HE SIMPLY HAS A DIFFERENT OPINION THAN YOU DO. CALLING PEOPLE NAMES BASED ON NO INFO MAKES YOU THE COWARD IN MY ESTIMATION.

Were you ever in the service? Have you ever been in combat? Just wondering...


43 posted on 07/09/2006 2:57:36 PM PDT by kwheeler
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To: kwheeler
Sorry but "The American Conservative" is anything but conservative. It is a publication for and by America Firster retreads who for some reason or another view all forgien policy through a prizm of Jew-hatred.
44 posted on 07/09/2006 3:05:45 PM PDT by Minus_The_Bear
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To: pinz-n-needlez
You could just say "NUMP"

I'm series.

45 posted on 07/09/2006 3:12:08 PM PDT by MrEdd (Bad spellers of the world - UNTIE!,)
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To: SJackson
But the longer I spent, the more I came to realize that this was not only a lie but an impossible strategy for achieving victory.

I got no further than this ...if its a lie what is the truth?

If its a lie what difference does it make if its a possible strategy or not?

46 posted on 07/09/2006 3:18:19 PM PDT by woofie ("Romper, bomper, stomper, boo. Tell me, tell me, tell me do.Magic mirror, tell me today. Did all ...)
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To: Dick Bachert
The waste and corruption today must be on an imponderable scale...

Take heart. If the supply improvements I saw starting in oh '87 or so continued after I got out in '91, computerization and frequent TAM updates have made things unrecognizably better since you were in. Not necessarily how they should be, but unbelievably better.

47 posted on 07/09/2006 3:18:20 PM PDT by MrEdd (Bad spellers of the world - UNTIE!,)
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To: MrEdd

LOL Thanks for the sage advice. ;-)

Pinz


48 posted on 07/09/2006 6:19:09 PM PDT by pinz-n-needlez (Charter Snowflake, Rummy fan)
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To: SJackson

Long read, not much positive in the author's view of his 10-11 month tour.

But all that he's described is year-old news. I wonder what it's like there today, a year later?

Some in the Microwave Generation can't understand when things aren't hunky-dorie immediately. Today bicycles come pre-assembled. Who makes a doll house for their kid nowadays when they can get a fine plastic one ready-made in China for them? Pick up a birthday cake - message already written on it for you - at the grocery store. Always-on internet. Cell phones in every hand for instant communication with everyone. The list goes on...

Some things take time. Some successes can't be measured by the hour or by the day. What is the measure of success in Iraq from May 2003 until today?

Better than the MSM is reporting (because they avoid positive stories), and better than this one guy's year-old report, and continuing to progress in the right direction.

Just my opinion.

For what it's worth.


49 posted on 07/09/2006 7:21:42 PM PDT by tgslTakoma
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To: Minus_The_Bear

Why do some of you people insist on calling anyone who doesn't think that every American policy decision should be based on appeasing the Jews a "Jew hater," "anti-Semite," or "biggot'?

I heard a man on C-Span today criticize Joe Leibermann's consistent support of any and all Jewish decisions. The man happened to be a Jew himself. The Leibermann suppoorter to whom he was speaking called him an "anti-Semite," explaining to his audience that "even Jews can be against Jews"!! This seemed to be his only argument: name-calling without making any substantial counter-argument.

You people simply reach for your shelf of convenient phrases anytime you're called upon to respond to criticism of your so-called beliefs. It would be so refreshing if you'd think on you own for once.

Furthermore, I may be naive, but I have no earthly idea who "America Firster retreads" are. Could they be people who believe in less government interference? Much, much less gov't spending? Less interference in other countries' affairs; etc.?? If so, then I guess I'm one of them, and proud of it. I call myself a conservative Libertarian, by the way; if that's synonymous with "Firster retreads," then so be it.


50 posted on 07/09/2006 8:56:22 PM PDT by kwheeler
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To: MrEdd

Hope you're right.


51 posted on 07/10/2006 6:39:55 AM PDT by Dick Bachert
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