Understanding the Bible

Dean's World ^ | July 2, 2006 | Dean Esmay

[Quix]

THANKS.

While I was sputteringly incredulous at the post . . . laying low today, I didn't want to wade in. I think you covered it very well.

Given the lofty position of Hebrew to the Israelites . . . the memorization you mention etc. I wouldn't call any Hebrew child of anything like responsible parents illiterate.

Sheesh.

[semaj]

Most early Christians were probably illiterate. Indeed, it is very likely that many of the original Apostles were illiterate. There is even evidence in the New Testament that Peter, Paul, and the other apostles were illiterate.

Had to stop reading at this point. It is my understanding that Paul was a very educated and learned Pharisee before becoming a follower of Christ. Luke was a physician. Peter was a business man who happened to own a fishing boat. Hardly the ingnoramuses the author portrays them to be in the first paragraph.

[Uri’el-2012]

Most early Christians were probably illiterate. Indeed, it is very likely that many of the original Apostles were illiterate.
There is even evidence in the New Testament that Peter, Paul, and the other apostles were illiterate.
Peter and Paul and the other New Testament writers often seem to be dictating to someone rather than writing for themsleves(Sic)

Dean Esmay has many ignorant pre-conceived ideas of
which he could dispel if he only he would read the Holy
Word of G-d and come to know Y'shua.

Every male Jew over the age of thirteen was capable of
reading either Hebrew or Greek at the time of Y'shua.

Dean seems to be ignorant of the fact that all the apostles
were male Jews over the age of thirteen and therefore
capable of reading the scriptures in the original Hebrew
and/or the LXX Koine Greek.

As many have pointed out, Paul having been the student
of the famed teacher Gamaliel, would have been one of
the most well read and literate in the the entire world.

b'shem Y'shua

[Just another Joe]

Paul (Saul) was a pharisee and so was, in all likelihood, able to read and write.

There was also Luke, a physician, who also, in all likelihood, able to read and write.

There was a tax collector, also probably able to read and write, and business owners that owned more than one boat, probably literate.

It is quite likely, in that day and age, that a, large minority, if not a majority of Hebrews were, at least, literate enough to read from the Torah.

I would say that a majority of the disciples were able to read and write and they would have taught the others.
Even five of them would have been more than enough to teach the rest,

[class8601_nuke]

I'm afraid I have to disagree with that. Satan knows what God plans in the end for him, but he can do nothing about it. God would never be afraid of Satan knowing the plan. Satan is powerless over God. Now, because He was fully human as well as fully divine, I believe the Father hid information until it was necessary, but I believe Jesus knew for many years who, what, where and when. Why was always known. Just my opinion, I know. BTW thanks for sharing the bit about the wedding. That makes sense to me, but I don't think it has anything to do with the crucifixion

[class8601_nuke]

Yes, I agree with you. It was the blasphemy accusation that clinched the deal.

[Finalapproach29er]

Thanks

[Finalapproach29er]

Got it. thanks

[Finalapproach29er]

Thank you

[Finalapproach29er]

thanks.

your a thousand miles ahead of me in knowledge.

[CyberAnt]

At the time Jesus was born .. the devil was not powerless .. after all, it was Adam who surrendered his power to satan in the garden. To say the devil didn't have any power is just not true.

Secondly, if the devil had known that God planned to send Jesus into Hell and paralyze the devil .. and there Jesus would become "the first born among the dead" .. the devil would have done more to keep Jesus alive. On the contrary .. because the devil didn't know the plan .. he joyfully plotted Jesus' death. Not only did Jesus not die .. his resurrection created a whole new class of being .. a new creation with a new spirit.

While the devil may "know" what his end will be .. he is the father of lies and there is no truth in him .. and therefore, he has deceived himself into believing he will triumph over God in the end.

While Jesus did paralyze the devil .. the devil still has a mouth .. and his current power consists of accusing the bretheren. I'm not trying to say the devil is more powerful than God - I don't believe that - but I do know how the devil operates in the earth.

As for the bit about the wedding .. I was trying to prove a point .. if God does not tell Jesus "when" the event is going to take place .. don't you think it's plausible that God would not tell Jesus "when" God would rescue him from Hell ..??

[gaspar]

Raycpa: I had never heard of the Muratorian Canon and looked it up in the Catholic Encyclopedia. It is truly an important document, but it seems to be derived from a time even earlier than that used in your timeline.

[Raycpa]

A catholic source gives this date:

It was written in Rome itself or in its environs about 180-200

Dates vary depending on what someone basis their system of dating on.

The important thing for me is that it was obvious that there was a wide spread early consensus about what was scripture and what was not very early on.

The fact that these early writings were used all over the world makes it fairly impossible for some latter day political group to force feed a different canon.

It would be like the NYT trying to republish yesterdays paper.