Posted on 03/27/2006 4:08:50 PM PST by NormsRevenge
"Even if it is just "one hot meal and a single night's shelter"? How about if it's just one wafer during Holy Communion?"
What's your point? Even our legislators won't criminalize the illegals, much less your church.
"If not, please post ONE real news story of American citizens demonstrating in Mexico..."
The liberal media won't publish one but, from personal experience, I can tell that this article is eerily close to what really happens south of the border.
Have you ever lived in a border town? If not, you don't know what the people that do live in those towns have to put up with.
Most Mexicans are not educated and, therefore, still believe that California, et al, belongs to them.
Heh, you must be the only one who couldn't figure it out.
Your response doesn't logically follow from anything that I said.
I gave you a real-world helpful suggestion and you post back to me soft mud.
"Hey", thanks so much.
Kiss your nation good-bye folks. It was nice while it lasted
A M E N!!!
Why don't you just get over that? There's a lot more at stake here than one word.
Yes words have meaning. The President didn't call the Minutemen, "vigilantes".
We went over this last night. I even posted the exact exchange between Mexican president Fox and President Bush.
He did refer to the minutemen as vigilantes. Also, Rice did pretty much the same thing so it is pretty clear what this administration's policy on illegal immigration is - the more the better.
Your transcript was in error.
I posted the exact transcript as a response to your post. Did you even look at it? Why do you respond to this post instead the response I posted to you?
He did refer to the minutemen as vigilantes.
No he didn't.
Look, I am near the same page as you on the illegals. But I see too many blaming one man instead of the freak'n Congress. Look what came out of committee thanks to our own Repubs. We had a chance to enforce existing law. It's a bigger picture than one man and it's been going on for years. Speaking of that one man - you might want to read this if you have an open mind - Hispanics Fear Anti-Immigrant Backlash After Bush Remarks This was back in 03. Yeah, I want the president to do approx the same as you but Congress has got to gather it nuts up and the president has no choice but to follow. He hasn't vetoed anything yet, has he? But now our own freak'n congressmen have folded.
FR, some people are not going to listen to actual facts. Repeating certain pundits' twisted context of the exact words suits their agenda.
It was not in error. President Fox had repeatedly referred to the Minutemen as vigilantes for weeks before they ever took to patrolling the border. He even planned legal action against them before they ever started.
During the joint press conference it was clear what was being asked and that the question referred to the minutemen.
Why all of the jumping through hoops? He called them vigilantes - everyone but you two accept that. Even Secretary of State Rice has called them vigilantes. Here is on of her quotes.
Tenochtitlan, Mexico D.F. - March 11, 2005 - (ACN) The Secretary of State of the USA Condoleezza Rice said, "My country will not tolerate illegal actions by the Minutemen vigilantes" yesterday at a press conference here in Mexico City.
http://www.aztlan.net/condi_vs_minutemen.htm
Note that the date is March 11 - also before the Minutemen ever took the the field.
Again, it is clear to everyone that this administration considers the minutemen vigilantes. Exact quotes have even been given - you're own link to the white house transcript betrays your words.
Bush is held responsible because he is the ONLY person on the planet that is in charge of enforcing the border. He has chosen to not protect the border and even goes as far as encouraging illegal immigration.
You two can't blame congress because the laws are already on the books to protect the border - heck, its even in the constitution but Bush ignores it.
Don't you think he would veto a bill similar to HR4437? He has said all along for the past 7 years he's for a guestworker policy and being a man of his word, he hasn't budged an inch. I can't see that he would be willing to sign any real reform (assuming the idiots in the Senate would pass such a thing.)
He doesn't need congress at all to enforce the border - the laws have been on the books forever. He just refuses to enforce them.
What to do about the illegals already here is truly a complex problem and will require some work with congress, but stopping additional illegals from crossing the border every day is a simple problem - Bush just needs to enforce the existing laws and stop encouraging them to come.
The ironic thing is that most people (including me) wouldn't be against a guest worker program. The problem is that the current situation has to be rectified first.
If Bush would just enforce existing laws and stop the daily influx of thousands of illegals then most would give his guest worker program a shot.
For me, now the connotating of 'guest worker' is the same as 'amnesty' because the politicians have tried to hide the real intent. But a guestworker policy like you outlined earlier on this thread - or was it another one - would be fair and not reward criminal behavior. It's too bad the politicians can't see that.
Well it is pretty clear that when Bush's idea of guest worker is actually amnesty. That is not going to fly.
A true guest worker program where the worker is truly a "guest" would be accepted by most. In this situation, the kids and wife (if she isn't also a guest worker) stay at home in Mexico and don't burden our schools, medical infrastructure and social services.
If we can't control our borders then how in the heck can we control a guest worker program?
"I'm for a guest worker program, but they must leave the country and get in the back of the line for citizenship. "
I presume you are talking about the illegal immigrants with this statement.
If so, I agree. Also, I would put in a provision that anyone who is deported for being here illegally can not come back in, much less get citizenship.
That is the ideal situation, but I don't think that we will see any roundups of illegals. It's just too politically dangerous.
Instead, the government must go after employers of illegals. The punishment must be prison time and not simply a fine. The current laws may already allow for that but if not then that is one of the very few things that Bush needs congress to address on this issue.
The problem is what to do when illegals start producing false documentation to employers. Our prison systems will be overwhelmed if the those illegals are imprisoned and the border is still open.
That is why the border must be closed before any thing can be done with the illegals are already here.
"That is the ideal situation, but I don't think that we will see any roundups of illegals. It's just too politically dangerous.
Instead, the government must go after employers of illegals. The punishment must be prison time and not simply a fine. The current laws may already allow for that but if not then that is one of the very few things that Bush needs congress to address on this issue.
The problem is what to do when illegals start producing false documentation to employers. Our prison systems will be overwhelmed if the those illegals are imprisoned and the border is still open.
That is why the border must be closed before any thing can be done with the illegals are already here."
In general, I agree with you.
I have seen indications that some illegals have been deported. I think that once deported, they should not be allowed to try again legally.
I am not sure we can seal our borders, but I do think we can do more than we are doing. We must make a better effort to stop illegal immigration.
I do not oppose those who come here legally. We have laws that limit that, and if appropriate, those can be changed according to the needs of this nation.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.