GOP Irritation At Bush Was Long Brewing

Washington Post ^ | Friday, March 17, 2006 | Jim VandeHei

[Pelham]

Actually it's just a falsehood. I've noticed that those opposed to enforcing the immigration laws have a problem telling the truth about the views of those who want the laws enforced.

[EternalVigilance]

From that same source:



During the first 50 years after Independence,the United States received about 710,000 immigrants. In 2001 alone, we admitted one million.

During the first century or so of our country (1776 to 1884),we received about two immigrants a day; since the 1990s, we have been admitting two immigrants a minute.

In the last 20 years,the United States has admitted more immigrants than it did in the previous 65 years.

The level of legal immigration has doubled in the last 30 years

Since the 1990s,we have admitted enough new immigrants to make a new city larger than Washington D.C., every year.

The 1990 Immigration Act increased legal immigration by 40 percent.

There are 31 million immigrants already living in the United States; this is more than 11 percent of the nation's population. In 2001, the following nine countries supplied over half of all immigrant visas:

Mexico 19.4%
India 6.6%
China 5.3%
Phillipines 5.0%
Vietnam 3.3%
El Salvador 2.9%
Cuba 2.6%
Haiti 2.5%
Bosnia 2.2%

Updated 10/02

[onyx]

THREE full years in the rears. That's the government for you. Meaningless information..

[Howlin]

Actually it's just a falsehood.

Say it as many times as you can, but the posting replies tell a different story.

[Once-Ler]

Pence has voted for the federal budgit every year.

[Dolphy]

No, it went from it wouldn't be disastrous to the economy, to it would survive :)

[Howlin]

In fact, you are advocating for lawlessness.

Post the link where I did that. I can wait.

[Howlin]

I see; all hat and no cattle. Got it.

[A Citizen Reporter]

"From that same source:

Yes, very dubious:

"During the first 50 years after Independence,the United States received about 710,000 immigrants"

That just doesn't ring true to me. But I will look into it over the coming campaign.

[Wombat101]

"If there are no takers, perhaps the employer might have to pay a decent wage and provide some benefits, eh?"

Why should he when he just cry to Senator McCain and get an amnesty bill passed post-haste?

"Do you understand that the increasing supply of labor from the south, sought after in our trade agreements of recent decades, drives down wages for American citizens?"

Not true. The "trade agreements" that you refer to (NAFTA, CAFTA, etc)give incredible incentives to American business to relocate plants, offices, etc, cross-border to take advantage of cheap labor costs, and then reduce the import tariffs they pay on the goods they produce, returning to the country.

As for "wages" falling, they really haven't, much. What has increased is the LOCAL (state and municipal) tax burden and the cost of benefits, as adjusted for inflation. On average, it now costs an American employer 2+ times in benefits what he pays an employee in salary. Blame the unions for a good portion of that,and federal regulation and mandates for a good deal more. Not illegal aliens because, you know, they're not supposed to be working anyway, right?

Nowhere in any trade agreement was it ever established that millions of criminals (and that's what they are) were allowed to come and suckle at the American teat. That they do is a result of the lack of will displayed in enforcement, the irrational guilt felt by many Americans for being materially well-off, and the fact that border security is a very low priority compared making sure every abortionist is frog-marched to the concentration camps.

"Or have you repealed the law of supply and demand?"

No, the American people demanded cheap goods and Wal-Mart supplied them. The US government just helped them make it easier to do. Sounds to me like supply and demand is running like a Swiss watch (probably also Made in China). The downside is that when you walk into Wal-Mart, the only products stamped "Made in America" are Pepsi, Cigarettes, Doritos and laxatives. Speaks volumes, if you ask me.

"Do you want a wage race for the bottom with China?"

I think we have quite a long ways to fall before we start paying Chinese slave wages. When we're talking China we're talking about a country where the installation of a vending machine represents 1,000% economic growth in most areas. Stop creating bugbears.

[cmiller623]

Sorry to say but there is a lot of the Bush Admin that is disappointing. He continues to run high deficits and is bankrupting the country. I am a hard core conservative and I can't believe some of the poor decisions he continues to make. Health and Human Services is a joke. We need to cut down the size of government and stop promising everything to everybody.The Prescription Drug Benefit will bankrupt us even more. Even my mother who can afford drugs is now getting this benefit.

[Howlin]

Table 1
Immigration Volume and Rates

Years	Average Yearly Total - All Countries	Immigration Rates (Per 1000 Population)	Percent of Average Yearly Total
			Great Britain	Ireland	Scandinavia and Other NW Europe	Germany	Central and Eastern Europe	Southern Europe	Asia	Africa	Australia and Pacific Islands	Mexico	Other America
1630-1700	2,200	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----
1700-1780	4,325	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----
1780-1819	9,900	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----	----
1820-1831	14,538	1.3	22	45	12	8	0	2	0	0	----	4	6
1832-1846	71,916	4.3	16	41	9	27	0	1	0	0	----	1	5
1847-1854	334,506	14.0	13	45	6	32	0	0	1	0	----	0	3
1855-1864	160,427	5.2	25	28	5	33	0	1	3	0	----	0	4
1865-1873	327,464	8.4	24	16	10	34	1	1	3	0	0	0	10
1874-1880	260,754	5.6	18	15	14	24	5	3	5	0	0	0	15
1881-1893	525,102	8.9	14	12	16	26	16	8	1	0	0	0	6
1894-1899	276,547	3.9	7	12	12	11	32	22	3	0	0	0	2
1900-1914	891,806	10.2	6	4	7	4	45	26	3	0	0	1	5
1915-1919	234,536	2.3	5	2	8	1	7	21	6	0	1	8	40
1920-1930	412,474	3.6	8	5	8	9	14	16	3	0	0	11	26
1931-1946	50,507	0.4	10	2	9	15	8	12	3	1	1	6	33
1947-1960	252,210	1.5	7	2	6	8	4	10	8	1	1	15	38
1961-1970	332,168	1.7	6	1	4	6	4	13	13	1	1	14	38
1971-1980	449,331	2.1	3	0	1	2	4	8	35	2	1	14	30
1981-1990	733,806	3.1	2	0	1	1	3	2	37	2	1	23	27
1991-1998	950,634	3.6	2	1	0	1	9	1	31	4	1	25	24

Sources: Years before 1820: Grabbe (1989). 1820-1970: Historical Statistics (1976). Years since 1970: U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service (various years). Note: Entries with a zero indicate less than one-half of one percent. Entries with dashes indicate no information or no immigrants.

[EternalVigilance]

Howlin: Of course, you both have noticed that the very same people who want every illegal deported are the very same ones who want ALL foreign trade stopped AND foreign companies thrown out of the country.

Pelham: Actually it's just a falsehood. I've noticed that those opposed to enforcing the immigration laws have a problem telling the truth about the views of those who want the laws enforced.

Howlin: Say it as many times as you can, but the posting replies tell a different story.

Looks to me like 'the posting replies' caught you telling a falsehood about your opponents once again, Howlin. Can you point to who these mythical folks are: 'the very same people who want every illegal deported are the very same ones who want ALL foreign trade stopped AND foreign companies thrown out of the country

[Torie]

You might be surprised to learn that the highest percentage of foreign born Americans was in the 1850's. It has to do a lot with why the North beat the crap out of the South in the Civil War. The Irish and Germans were just pouring in (and a lot Brits too, about 500,000 of them), from around 1845 to 1860, almost all to Yankeedom, and muscling the Yankee factories and economy.

[EternalVigilance]

You betcha.

If we don't force reform, who will?

How will our kids and grandkids be able to carry the burden we've accrued for them?

[Wombat101]

Am I mistaken? How many business owners do you know that would willingly report to the government that they are violating the law and employing illegal aliens?

Therefore, illegals aliens are not being counted in the employment figures, are they? Yet, we're all aware that a good many of them ARE working.

Either the gov't figures are full of Shi'ite or there's an awful lot of people out there lying about whom they have working for them.

Take your pick.

[EternalVigilance]

You might be surprised to learn that the highest percentage of foreign born Americans was in the 1850's. It has to do a lot with why the North beat the crap out of the South in the Civil War. The Irish and Germans were just pouring in (and a lot Brits too, about 500,000 of them), from around 1845 to 1860, almost all to Yankeedom, and muscling the Yankee factories and economy.

Absolutely true.

[Howlin]

I'll be glad to.

Just as soon as you answer Dolphy's direct question to you about WHO would be doing the jobs of the illegals after they are deported.

And

After you link the post where I advocated lawlessness.


(And this time, could we have DIRECT answers, not the mealy-mouthed parsing you've been doing for almost 400 posts?)

[EternalVigilance]

Not true. The "trade agreements" that you refer to (NAFTA, CAFTA, etc)give incredible incentives to American business to relocate plants, offices, etc, cross-border to take advantage of cheap labor costs, and then reduce the import tariffs they pay on the goods they produce, returning to the country.

Actually, those agreements, along with the FTAA, are specifically designed to do away with our border...to make labor as fungible as capital.

[A Citizen Reporter]

"You might be surprised to learn that the highest percentage of foreign born Americans was in the 1850's"

Which is why EV didn't want to talk about percentages.