Switchgrass to Gas? [Claim: could be done in five years]

Technology Reviews ^ | February 22, 2006 | By Neil Savage

[thackney]

Related ongoing thread

Seeking Newer Ways of Ethanol Preparation
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1582767/posts

[SlowBoat407]

Oh yeah? Well, it's just because Bush and Rove happen to own some of the biggest switchgrass plantations in the country. And how did they get them? By exploitin' the masses...

Oh, sorry. Thought I was at DU for a minute.

[MNJohnnie]

Anyone notice that Ethanol still needs to be mixed with oil before you can make it into gas?

[GrandEagle]

LOL! For once you can bet that this WON'T be Bushes fault!

[Atlas Sneezed]

Agrivida proposes to add genes to the corn plants that will produce enzymes for breaking down the cellulose.

---

FRANKENFUEL!

[cripplecreek]

Anyone notice that Ethanol still needs to be mixed with oil before you can make it into gas?

I noticed, but I also notice that it means a lot less oil used. That means less money going into the hands of terrorists.

[.cnI redruM]

OK, so they baseline the program to execute procurement by 2013. It then slips to the right 2 years, because almost any program with a high degree of tech risk does. That gives us switchgrass gas by 2015. At least that's my guess on the prognosis for this one.

[GSlob]

I could see the LEOs pulling out the switchgrass plants like they would do cannabis. Ethanol, after all, is the "A" in the BATF.

[BobinIL]

I can see it now, endless fields of switchgrass all over the midwest where corn used to be grown. Think of all of the pheasants that would be living in these fields, a hunters dream come true!!!!

[chuckles]

...."Anyone notice that Ethanol still needs to be mixed with oil"......

No, It doesn't. Only if you want to make E10, or E85. If you want straight ethanol, no mixing needed. The mixing with gas is to poison it to keep you from drinking it without paying tax.

[MplsSteve]

Interesting post.

I believe that biomass has a lot of potential for solving many of our nation's energy problems.

There's a agency in Minnesota that receives some funding from the state. It's known as AURI (Agricultural Utilization Research Institute) and they've been doing a fair amount of work in the field of biomass.

Here's a link to the most recent issue of their newsletter where they discuss uses for biomass. It's actually quite interesting. Here it is:

http://www.auri.org/news/ainjan06/contents_jan06.htm

[Mr170IQ]

Biological conversion of cellulose into ethanol is a slow process, and one that is tough to scale up to provide the entire country's transportation fuel needs.

From an industrial perspective, it is much simpler to convert coal into syngas ( carbon monoxide and hydrogen ), and then to catalytically produce methanol. There are no technological problems in producing tens of millions of barrels a day from coal.

The major "plus" that biomass derived fuels have is that they are theoretically "carbon neutral" - using them should not contribute to rising atmospheric CO2 levels. They are also considered "sustainable" - there is not a limited supply to run out eventually.

If you have not bought into the myth that rising CO2 levels are endangering the climate, and you are confident that in the 400 or so years it will take to run out of coal that we will find something better, then coal is a much better choice for large-scale transportation fuel development than cellulose-derived ethanol.

However, it is quite possible that in some localities the economics of ethanol might be quite competitive.

[redgolum]

Only because of the timing chips in the current cars. Brazil has all of its cars and trucks able to run up to 85-90% ethanol. The technology is there, but it will take a long time for it to be universal in the US.

[redgolum]

That and 100% ethanol will attract moisture out of the air till it hits about 92% pure. The gas is added to keep down the moisture a bit. Extra water won't hurt, but obviously isn't going to help your mileage any.

[Mr170IQ]

I might also add - Biomass can also be converted into syngas, and then into methanol or other chemicals. It is a much simpler process than biological conversion of cellulose.

It is most effective to do this if you have an "unlimited" supply of industrial heat to convert the biomass or coal into syngas. Combining a nuclear reactor with a syngas production facility would improve the efficiency tremendously.

[IronJack]

But in this process the corn stalks and leaves -- about half of the plant mass -- are thrown away.

Not completely true. There are numerous uses for the residual biomass. It can be pulped and burned to offset the energy costs of the ethanol refining process. It can be chopped into silage and fed to livestock. It can itself be stripped of its sugars and starches and converted into ethanol.

By the way, "corn stalks and leaves" is one of those linguistic curiosities, kind of like "eats, shoots and leaves."

[Straight Vermonter]

I don't look for any magic bullet to fix our energy problems. Using switchgrass or other biofuels can certainly be an element of the solution.

Up here in the northeast corn stoves are becoming increasingly popular. Those who have typically burnt wood can know burn corn instead. It is much cheaper and the fuel is renewed yearly instead of 20+ years to grow a tree to burn.

Anything that gets us away from the problems in the ME or idiots like Hugo Chavez is for the good.

[untrained skeptic]

Anyone notice that Ethanol still needs to be mixed with oil before you can make it into gas?

While our current cars in the US don't run on strait ethanol, there are cars being made for other markets that can run on either pure ethanol, pure gasoline, or any mixture of the two.

Ethanol can also be used in making biodissel which can be used in existing dissel engines.