Settlers destroy Palestinian olive trees [Happens Every Year This Time]

Reuters ^ | Nov. 27, 2005

[American in Israel]

Definitely you need to get some rest.

Definitely you need to get some morals.

[ScaniaBoy]

Thanks for the comments.

As I said in another post I was embarrrasingly naïve about olive trees but I have been doing some reading up now,

With blushing cheeks I must admit I was embarrasingly naïve also about the perpetual stories about settlers destroying the olive trees of local Arabs. From what I 've read here, thanks to Alouette and Piranha, it is at least a tale that needs a lot of corroborating evidence before it can be taken on face value.

I should have known better - I recognise the MO from south Lebanon, where it was mainly Christians that were given this treatment (ie being lied about) by the PLO, western peacniks, and the media.

[American in Israel]

Wonder if that's just how olive trees are done?

Yep, that is just how it is done in the parks in the center of Jerusalem. Just with a bit more care to get clean cuts. First time I saw it done I was shocked, at least till spring.

Now the interesting thing is that this is known by olive farmers obivously, and the Palestinian's take every advantage to lie. So every year they prune their trees, and every year they whine about it to the leftist press, and every year the leftists print up garbage, and every year it is disproved.

It is not that they are not researching the lies and printing them without retractions, they obviously know they are lies when they print them again for a fresh audience each year. It is that they are traitors, working with the terrorists to destroy the state that they so hate. One has to wonder at a person that is so full of hatred of the ideals of freedom that they are willing to burn down the house they live in. For the Arabs will surely execute them all when they are in power.

Lying is no object to those with no moral foundation, it is just another tool in the dirty bag of tricks.

[geopyg]

Talk about media spin. And to the others - the tree in the photo is not uprooted.

I remember when my dad had his tree expert prune the crab apple tree in our back yard. It looked just a little bit better than the olive tree. My mom came home and started crying telling my dad she didn't want it cut down - just pruned. My dad tried to explain to hear what the tree guy had told him, but of course he was gone!

The following year it still looked pretty bleak (which my mom never failed to point out!!), but it sure took off after that! It was amazing.

[geopyg]

From a Google search on olive tree pruning, see especially the 2nd paragraph:

Origins
It seems that the often gnarled and gray branches and trunks of the fairly small olive tree were first cultivated for their olives about six thousand years ago in areas of the Middle East. They have been cultivated on the island of Cyprus for four thousand years or so. This slow growing, but long living evergreen takes about ten years to grow to maturity, but after that it yields olives for perhaps hundreds of years.

For maximum production the tree needs stringent pruning every ten years or so, cutting right back to the main branches. This rejuvenates the tree and crops can be expected to increase to full capacity within three years.

In North Cyprus, as in other Mediterranean countries the olive tree can be seen everywhere, in the wild and under cultivation. Usually favouring well drained sunny hillsides, olive trees can nevertheless thrive in backyards and flat plain lands.

The nurture and care of olive trees is a matter of some skill. Although olive trees can live and produce olives for hundreds of years, they do need skillful pruning and without attention they can soon die off. This has been the case in North Cyprus, but now that young trees planted and have started to produce, growers are hoping once again North Cyprus region will be a serious Mediterranean producer. Some estimates suggest that there are about 800 million olive trees under cultivation around the world, and nearly all of them are in the Mediterranean countries

[geopyg]

One last thought. I wonder if the settlers figured the palis weren't going to take care of the trees and wouldn't go to all the work of pruning them? And the settlers figured they would be back in after a few years and wanted to have healthy trees to come back too?

[American in Israel]

Wow, compare that to the Palestinian Police who arrested two Jews that took a wrong turn, ending up at a road block. Then took them to the center of town where everyone took turns beating them to death in the police station.

Kinda different, Jews defending Arab children from Jewish children, and Arabs who just kill people any chance they get.

Kinda like comparing an Ant to an Elephant, both are living creatures, but it is darn hard to step on an elephant and not know it.

I bet this report is crap too, because it does not make sense that the Arabs "need" to pass through a Jewish section to get to school, when all Jewish towns I have seen are built round with a fence around them to protect them from the Arabs. It's a circle the wagon effect, one tends not to circle the wagons around Indians when you are outnumbered a thousand to one.

Like most leftists story's, they tend to not pass the "sniff test" even before you dig into the package. In this case, Arabs reported violence, violence that was never witnessed, but the Knesset provided police escort in case it was true. In the story that this thread is based on, the Arabs reported trees cut down, the Knesset hopped on the band wagon and the trees were just pruned, like they were pruned every year, and reported cut down every year.

In case you have not noticed, the Knesset is the bad guys in vilifying the Jews in the politically incorrect towns that the Kenesset can sacrifice on the Altar of American subsidies. No politician gets rich with free and content subjects, they get rich siphoning off cash flow, and American subsidies make cash flow.

People living in houses they built on land they paid for and paying small taxes is not near as fattening. So a lot of fat cats tend to sell them out to the highest bidder.

That happens to be the State Department at the moment. With the standing Keesset, the Arabs could have won the war a long time ago if instead of buying guns and tanks and explosives, they would have just offered cash to sell out Jews. Sharon would be living in Tahiti in a mansion, and the bulk of the Jews would have been back in the diaspora.

Funny that Sharon is trying to create a third diaspora, must be his quest to be a godly man, for he is surely trying to be omnipotent.

[dervish]

"Wow, compare that to the Palestinian Police who arrested two Jews that took a wrong turn, ending up at a road block. Then took them to the center of town where everyone took turns beating them to death in the police station."

Here is another one for comparison, stoning two teens to death --


"Terrorists murder Israeli teens near Tekoa

Two Israeli youths, both 14, residents of the Gush Etzion community of Tekoa south of Jerusalem, were stoned and then stabbed to death overnight at the Haritoun Cave, close to the Judean Desert community. The bodies of Ya'acov (Kobi) Mandell and Yosef (Yossi) Ish-Ran, both 14, were discovered yesterday morning. Their heads had been smashed in by rocks.

The boys' families only discovered they were missing close to midnight on Tuesday, after they had skipped school to hike in the wadi. They had thought the boys went to school, then to a demonstration in Jerusalem.



Israeli soldiers and policemen carry the body of a Jewish boy found dead near the settlement of Tekoa in the Judean Desert.
Sherri Mandell grieves over the body of her son, Ya'acov, murdered by terrorists.
Yosef (Yossi) Ish-Ran


Little coverage of these brutal killings was given by our local papers. This obscene act of terrorism was virtually ignored by the local media. The fact that their faces were battered beyond recognition or that their blood was smeared on the walls of the cave was never reported. When the story was run, it was usually accompanied by a photo of a weeping Palestinian parent or the picture of an injured Palestinian child. We note all too often that Jewish victims are seldom seen in photos. "

http://www.tampabayprimer.org/index.cfm?action=leftNav&drill=Israel

The parents have created and run a foundation named after their slain son Kobi mandell to help families of terror victims.

[dervish]

I don't know anything of the circumstances in this story, but your link does not mention the Knesset. In it eight year old Tarek explains that without the soldier escort "the settlers beat us up." Not much to go on.

The Muslims are addicted to claims of victimization and fabrication of "facts." Thus it is prudent to take with skepticism reports of Jewish vandalism, violence and criminal mischief.

What I am curious about is what your expectations are. I am sure that there are incidents of Jewish mayhem on Muslims. All Jews and Jewish Israelis are not saints. Why would you expect them to be so?

Further when a murderous population, the Palestinians, repeatedly targets your family, children on buses, in malls, at discos, for death and maiming, rational thought has a way of disintegrating. From my point of view, it is miraculous that the settlers, who are constant targets of terror attempts, don't lose it more often. Not condoning just recognizing the frailties of human nature.

Further, mayhem and mischief, even beatings, are not murderous terror.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Mar 28, 2002 - Rachel Gavish, 50, of Elon Moreh was one of four members of the Gavish family killed in Elon Moreh, when a Palestinian terrorist infiltrated the hilltop community near Nablus, burst into their home, and shot them shortly before 9 P.M.

She was killed along with her husband David, her son Avraham, and her father Yitzhak Kanner.

The terrorist continued to shoot from one of the rooms while neighbors and security forces returned fire. Others placed a ladder to allow family members on the top story to escape. The terrorist remained in one of the top-story rooms, until he was shot and killed by security forces.

'snip'

Rachel Gavish was buried in Elon Moreh alongside her family members. She is survived by her six children: Menashe (23), Yeshurun (2), Avigdor, (19), Tzofia (18), Leah (17), and Assaf (14).

http://www.israel-mfa.gov.il/MFA/Terrorism-+Obstacle+to+Peace/Memorial/2002/2/Rachel+Gavish.htm [Elon Moreh the home of the settlers who were accused of destroying the olive trees]

http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/M/Moreh.asp

[Grzegorz 246]

"The Muslims are addicted to claims of victimization and fabrication of "facts"..."

Sure...
I think that the only one in this thread, who lives in Israel is anotherview, who admitted in #71 that such things really happens but of course American Jews know better...

[Convert from ECUSA]

Thanks for the ping in #213, Salem!

AiI,



You live there, so you have first hand experience and observation.

[kenavi]

What I am curious about is what your expectations are. I am sure that there are incidents of Jewish mayhem on Muslims. All Jews and Jewish Israelis are not saints. Why would you expect them to be so?

I don't. But I think some settler supporters do, and will do so despite any evidence. And I think some won't mind even if it is true that settlers engage in unprovoked violence. That being said, you and Alouette make a pretty persuasive case that settler criminality is vastly over-stated in the press.

[American in Israel]

Good to remember that one of the children beat to death with rocks by Arab men was an American. Over 50 Americans have been killed over here now by Palestinians, sometimes directly targeted as Jewish targets were passed by for Americans.

But the State Department and Bush keep giving the terrorists money and presuring the Jews who have killed no Americans. I do not understand.

[dervish]

"I think that the only one in this thread, who lives in Israel is anotherview, who admitted in #71 that such things really happens but of course American Jews know better..."

No, American in Israel is there too.

Here are his posts on this thread:


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1529409/posts?page=122#122

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1529409/posts?page=127#127

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1529409/posts?page=175#175

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1529409/posts?page=197#197

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1529409/posts?page=227#227

[Grzegorz 246]

"No, American in Israel is there too."

True but a real Israelite is a better source than a Californian living in Israel. I don't know that this stuff about trees is true or not and you don't that either but the point is that such things happen, so turning this thread into an anti-Palestinian orgy is not normal in my opinion, however that's just only my opinion of course.

[dervish]

As far as I'm concerned they are both "real Israelite[s]" unless you know something I don't. They are both on the spot.

"anti-Palestinian orgy"

You missed the point. The article, and the Palestinian propaganda machine, even the Israeli Left, is an anti-Settler orgy. In the world at large it is "real Israelites" who are demonized, not those poor Palestinian victims of occupation who have done nothing to deserve their mistreatment.

Just ask the BBC's employee Tom Paulin --

"The interviewer wrote that Paulin, a consistent critic of Israeli conduct towards the Palestinians, clearly abhorred "Brooklyn-born" Jewish settlers. Paulin, a lecturer at Hertford College, Oxford, was then quoted as saying: "They should be shot dead.

"I think they are Nazis, racists, I feel nothing but hatred for them." Earlier in the interview, he was quoted as saying: "I never believed that Israel had the right to exist at all."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/04/13/npauli13.xml

What you saw on this thread was a denial and questioning of whether the event actually occurred as claimed by Muslims. This is what I call healthy skepticism given the history of the claimannts.