Posted on 09/29/2005 6:19:24 PM PDT by operation clinton cleanup
Poppycock. Drugs/alcohol had been around *long* before the 60s.
It's humorous however to watch some try and blame ever thing happening today, including millions entering our country illegally, while government looks the other way, hundreds of thousand of murdering gang members, many here illegally, daily drive-by shootings, school and work place massacres, now religious fanatics that want to murder us all, etc, and blame it all on the 1960s.
That's laughable.
I was just a child during the 60's. I just want to say THANK YOU to all the Vietnam Veterans who served our country.
I find it strange that a lot of Conservitives and Freepers don't look at the demographics. People my sons age, kind of in the middle of the Mass FReeper age group, know they are going to get screwed and they don't like it.
Brit-Nap gen was after the Amer Founding.
I still stand by it: GreatEST (American as well as World) = Founding.
Yes, it was Pixie Stiks, which was really upsetting to me because I can remember going to the corner convenience store and buying loads of them. After that I avoided Pixie Stiks like the plague. They would make great big huge tubes of them
You '60s-apologists in denial that the '60s was the WATERSHED of everything crappy - and rationalizing and equivalencing other ages w/anecdotal incidents representing maybe 5% of the culture rather than say 45% - are laughable. ;-)
The "1960's" are mis-named. The time should be dated and referred to as the 19LBJ's
I also like the generation that setted Canaan after wandering for 40 years, the generation that spread christianity thru the Roman world in the first centuries AD, the generation under Charlemagne's grandfather who beat the Muslims back from France (not to mention other generations of the Crusaders), the generation which came to America and scraped out a living to escape religious oppression, the generation which fought for the Bible to be translated into English. Lots of extremely inspiring ages throughout history.
Founders right up there with them all.
Talkin’ bout my generation
In the mid-sixties hit “My Generation” the Who declared they hoped they’d die before they got old. It appears most rockers have further considered the matter and decided death isn’t that great a career move.
Watching recent inductions into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame was a reminder of what geezers “my generation” has become. Wrinkles, gray hair, and paunches that make Marlon Brando look like a health nut made up the uniform of the day. The “Young Rascals” are older than the president of the United States is, even though they don’t have their remaining hair feathered as nicely.
Something that was obvious was a change in mind-set. As usual in such situations, the recipients rattle off a litany of people to whom they’re grateful. Lots of the rockers thanked God for what He’d done for them. Considering the booze, drugs, and profligate living many rockers engaged in, they should be giving thanks. It’s a miracle some of them are still around. David Crosby of Crosby, Stills & Nash thanked his wife for sticking it out with him while he did a prison stretch for drugs.
One thing that struck me was the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame must be running out of groups to induct. This year it brought in Buffalo Springfield. Buffalo Springfield? They had one, count ‘em, one whole hit, “For What It’s Worth.”
You remember it. It starts:
“There's something happening here. What it is ain't exactly clear
There's a man with a gun over there. Telling me I got to beware.”
It goes on to explain that young people speaking their minds get so much resistance “from behind.” Wherever that is. After telling us that, they go on: “Paranoia strikes deep. Into your life it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid. You step out of line, the man come and take you away.”
Paranoia sounds like something these guys are pretty familiar with. Not to mention a complete detachment from reality. Those of us who were around back then know that most of the time young people said and did pretty much what they wanted with impunity. Protest rallies, shrieking obscenities at the president, using the flag as the seat of your jeans. . . . just about anything went. I only wish that “the man” had come and carried off some of those jerks.
Maybe Buffalo Springfield was inducted because the pooh-bahs who run the Hall of Fame think their song captured the spirit of a generation. It did, insofar as we boomers were – and continue to be – the most self-indulgent and pontificating generation in history.
Our parents made it through two monumental catastrophes, the Great Depression and World War II. They wanted our lives to be so much better than theirs had been. So they coddled us. We grew up spoiled and smug and egocentric.
The smugness was reinforced in colleges and universities across the Nation as we unquestioningly accepted the Leftist dogmas many instructors dished out. Bill Buckley had it right many years ago when he observed colleges claimed to be centers of academic freedom, but in reality they practice indoctrination.
As boomers bought into the liberal bromides, we were rewarded with being told we were the smartest generation to grace the face of the earth. Ever. We even started believing it.
Now we’re attempting to resist the rules of nature. When we were kids 50 was old. Not any more. We have the right to be young forever, darn it. And if we don’t feel like we did 30 years ago, then some doctors had better come up with pills that’ll do the trick. It’s our right. After all, we went to all the trouble of being born and are the smartest generation. Ever.
Don’t forget that, you young whippersnappers. Or we’ll have the man come and take you away.
Exactly. The Bohemian crowd had already graduated from school, or dropped out, or were kicked out. They were in their hey day in the late 50s and early 60s. They were mostly artists and writers and liberal arts type who couldn't find jobs.
The Free Speech Movement didn't start until early 1964. They used some of the Bohemian hangouts until they drove the Bohemians out, or made life so uncomfortable that the Bohemians got real jobs and left the scene or hung on at the fringes of the younger group. Actually, the Bohemians had renamed themselves Beatniks in the late 50s after Russia launched Sputnik. The anti-war protesters followed right along and latched on to the Free Speech Movement and all the groups morphed into one -- Bohemian, Beatnik, Free Speech, Filthy Speach, Black Panthers, Hippies, Flower Children, Yippies, Weathermen, Chicago Seven, etc.
It was interesting that the beginning -- the Free Speech Movement -- was rather short lived. That began because of some dispute over an arcane decision backed by the Board of Regents that was run by Gov. Ronald Reagan. I never understood the details, except that the protesters didn't like Reagan. The Regents and the University quickly solved their problem but the protesters were enjoying the notoriety and continued the distruptions -- now calling themselves the Filthy Speech Movement -- protesting their "right" to use obnoxious language in public any time they felt like it. That is where they lost most of the town, but they didn't stop there. There was the bosomy young woman who insisted on wearing a see-through bouse to the public library without any underwear on underneath. She got arrested and got her picture in the paper several times, much to the protesters' glee. These groups had two things in common: the use of illegal, mind-altering drugs and promiscuous sex. Of course they used their wild clothes and anti-establishment behavior to garner attention from the media and the normal people.
Sometimes I think the draft protests were just a cover to gain sympathy from regular folks who were just trying to do their jobs, go about their business, and raise their families. It was pretty hard to feel good about cracking down on these young folks who could be sent overseas on a moment's notice. This was especially hard on the police and the National Guard who were called in regularly to keep order.
But in truth, many leaders and members of the "movement" were never in danger of being drafted. Some were ineligible for medical reasons, or age. Many were women who were never going to be drafted, but were just along for the excitement and the drugs and sex, IMO. There had been a movie that came out a few years earlier, "Where the Boys Are", and I think that explains the involvement of many of the women -- especially the younger ones.
The invention and approval of the "pill" in 1962 or 1963 fueled the promiscuity too. No one had to exercise self control or responsibility any more. Of course the pill did not always work, so legalized abortion was the next frontier that was crossed. That got through in CA because of scare stories that were floated in the media about rape and incest and back alley coat hanger abortions and that is the reason Reagan signed the bill. Of course the procedure was used for every reason in the book and within a couple of years the number of abortions exceeded the number of live births in CA. From that has stemmed the huge rise in infertility we see today.
Gov. Reagan often stated that signing that bill (which preceeded Roe v. Wade) was the biggest mistake of his Governorship. I think the Gov. signed the abortion bill (which was restricted to rape, incest, life or health of the mother, but was interpreted to mean abortion on demand) in 1967. It's hard to remember all the details without looking them up! This is also the period when academic excellence fell by the wayside, and grade inflation began to be the norm. Professors started giving B averages for shoddy work in order to allow those who were enrolled in school to keep their draft deferments. The idea was floated that if the kid was smart enough to be admitted to the university, he was surely smart enough to graduate -- even if he did not do the work. There actually was a law suit a few years ago in the Academic Senate at Stanford University brought by the Math and Engineering professors against this policy. The were voted down, and it's pretty hard to get less than a B at Stanford. Perhaps this is the reason Chelsea Clinton could wander all over the world with her parents instead of actually attending class and still graduate. ???
It was also the same period when the rabble rousers floated the idea in California that they did not need official state's residence to be eligible for a tuition break -- sort of the "think method". If the student CONSIDERED himself a state resident, he was eligible for the tuition break, according to their reasoning, even if he'd only just arrived within the state borders. I moved away about that time, so I don't know if that policy was ever actually adopted, but they argued long and hard about it. Many of these lackluster students grew up to run our universities and public schools today, unfortunately.
It was a hard time for everyone, particularly the town that had to endure it. The property destruction was disgraceful. I'm sure that the same stories could be written about Madison, Ann Arbor, Cambridge, etc.
I realize you said that a teacher said that. I was pointing out that your teacher was wrong. Did I have to spell it out in full detail? I thought it was implied!
I guess I have to be more specific in the future and finish every thought for some people.
I don't mind people from the 1960's per se. I do mind very much the people who failed to learn anything from the 1960's.
Much of it was a rehash of things we already knew - even before the arrival of the pill, it was well known that sleeping with loads of people was not a good idea. The people who "forgot" this and remained "forgetful" are idiots.
Government is not the answer to all our problems. This was well known before the 1960's - Stalin and Hitler showed the danger of an overpowerful state to a painful degree. The people who "forgot" this and remained "forgetful" are imbeciles.
Morality is there to prevent people from treating each other like animals. Animals operate on the instinct of "if it feels good, do it". But we're not animals, we're human beings, endowed with conscience and restraint. The people who "forgot" this and remained "forgetful" are still dangerous.
Regards, Ivan
Alchohol was pervasive in the culture before the 60s, but other drugs were not -- except among illegal aliens and the Hollywood and NYC elites. I can remember the shock waves in my home town when a market near my high school was closed down because of marijuana sales. The customers were Mexican migrants, and use of that drug was definately considered a low class pastime.
Heroin was around in the criminal classes and the avant guard in New York, (perhaps New Orleans) but it barely touched the rest of the country and definitely had a very bad reputation.
The first time I EVER saw someone "drugged out" was on the street in Berkeley in 1963. I already had two children. My husband was appalled and set about moving us from the neighborhood within a month! It really was something new for our community, but it was running rampant within a year with drugs being freely passed around and tried at grad school parties.
Ivan:
If only the majority of the population were as wise as you! Thanks for your comments.
Every generation has its anti-conformists - even if the alternative has its own conformity standards. Whether it was British youth going to sea 200 years ago, Calif gold seekers in '49 (and the Yukon 50 years later), the Roaring 20s, post-WWII Beats (On The Road was writen in 1947-48), hippies in the 60s, punks in the 70s, drug lords in the 90s, Rap artists in the 00s, they all follow the same vein.
People who are celebrated today, like Sam Clemens, Jack London, Henry Miller, Hemingway, Kerouc, et al could not function in 'normal' day-day lives during their creative years no matter how hard they tried - if they even cared to try.
The thing that separated the 60s from all the rest was two-fold: we were at war with an enemy that was fought outside mere battlegrounds - it was all about corrupting each other's respective societies to defeat them from within; and, the sheer bulk of younger people vs the older generation (many parents were born in the low birth years of the 30s) meant that kids had the numbers on their side.
The trick for every generation is to train and absord the next crop of young people into a functioning, productive citizens. Ultimately, age and time makes everyone a conformist.
Unfortunately mine did. It took me until I was in my 30s to fully understand the impact. Thank God I did. Corrections have since been made.
They also run many corporations. Chew on that ....
Please give me the post where someone said that drugs/alcohol had not been around before the 60s.
You either purposely created a strawman that you could defeat, you are missing the clear cut historical point even admitted to by those who participated, or you are simply ignorant and are not aware of what the goals of the 1960s counter-culture were, and what they achieved.
I was alive long before the 1960s and I know the damage that was done, on purpose, and the results from this damage that we still live with today, including the current culture war. The Culture WAR you see today is simply a continuation of the one the left proliferated in the 1960s with all their might and with every lie they could muster.
A very, very small minority of adults used the crutch of recreational drugs before the 1960s, very few children even knew what they were. Drunkeness has always been around and has destroyed many (was long known to be a great cause of poverty, exchanging paychecks for alcohol instead of children's food, shelter and clothing), that being said, few adults used anything but alcohol before the 1960s but being a drunk was never something to be proud of; the 1960s counter-culture worked hard to destigmatize being a druggie or a drunkard.
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