Lead, Follow or...

Winds of Change ^ | Sept. 1, 2005 | Jeffers

[CovenBuster]

Last word got cut off. Should read:



Do you stand with us, or are you going to just stand in the way?

[frogjerk]

During 9/11 the prediction was that 25,000 may have been killed. It turned out to be a little less than 3000. I will predict that this storm, after all is said and done will have taken the lives of about 7000 Americans.

Nature coupled with inept government officials is a recipe for widespread disaster and mayhem.

[Brian_Baldwin]

I am not a construction engineer, but I am hearing several reports now, as recent as within the last hour on FOX News from one interview and other sources who know the levees and are in fact engineers, that the effected levees that failed are about as best as they can get, that it really isn’t a matter of spending more dollars on the levee in the areas which are most vulnerable, but more of a matter of engineering, that there isn’t any such thing as an indestructible levee, that circumstance of foundation, environment, and physics, weighed against what is feasible through engineering as of this year 2005 and all of what our modern engineers, science and technology can provide, and that in fact the levees that failed in the areas in which they failed were pretty much the best levees an engineer can erect. In other words, those who are saying we are going to build better levees in the worst effected areas, and then rebuild those worst effected areas with new dwellings and community, may be pipe dreaming – that any new levee isn’t really going to be much better than what they already had. That perhaps, this is the best expectation that a levee can provide, the optimum that constructional engineering as of the year 2005 can offer even if older levees are replaced by new ones, and to expect some new levee to provide the safety, or any idea of tenable safety, isn’t realistic.

I would like to see these areas, all of these areas, rebuilt and re-inhabited. Certainly, I would love to see New Orleans rise again, if not from it’s fish bowl but as a city, that some new fancy levees guarantee safety. I think that some areas of New Orleans can in fact be rebuilt, including historical areas, and in fact some areas have to be rebuilt because of their strategic importance as a port and for other reasons. But, the reality is that in some other areas and Parish, that perhaps they should not be rebuilt until engineering catches up with the ability to provide security from such flooding. Such guarantee is perhaps decades away.

However, opinion is one thing. I think they are going to rebuild all of the areas anyway. We will be told this is the worst natural disaster in US history. Which will be another way of saying, it won’t happen again for a long, long time. At least to put that idea out.

And then, they will put in new levees, and we will be told they are better, fancier, modern. And then they will rebuild the areas.

This is only human nature.

In regards to an effective response from President Bush, I saw him on FOX News this morning during his tour of Biloxi Mississippi, and I am very impressed. The fact is, I have been led to believe that FEMA has been preparing for the last many years to respond in the event of a major terrorist act in the US, or other disaster, and as we can see, in New Orleans, should a major dirty bomb go off in a US metropolitan city, the type of events that would unfold would be similar to what we see in New Orleans, that by the next day most citizens will be on their own, effective response will be several days away.

In once sense, we have become too much of whimps ourselves to do what is necessary, and this has more to do with liberalism in the Blue States and in government than it has to do with President Bush, or for that matter former President Clinton, or the Democrat Mayors, Senator, et all. Basically, I think we can now see, that government in this day and age is pretty much clueless.

I think Bush is doing the best job he can under the circumstances.

Armed guardsmen, un-uniformed government agents armed, snipers etc. are now moving into New Orleans to start to shot the armed gangs, which is good. We are seeing the convoys of food, water and medicine start to work it’s way into the effected areas. Which is very good.

A long time ago, I recall a flyer I saw in, of all places, a public phone booth. The flyer read to the effect, when the death comet comes from the sky, the earth shakes below your feet and the ground falls under the towers that touch the clouds, when the great flood comes, that at that time, there will be no police to come to your rescue. No fire department. No army. Because, they will all be too busy simply protecting the most basic interests, limited, and it won’t be your house, your home, there won’t be time for that. You will be on your own. There will only be God.

Obviously, it was a religious flyer. But it was true. And when I read that flyer, I thought, yes, I am not really so religious, but it sure is true that me and my family will be on there own. The flyer even mentioned the evil in men would come forth to rampage (*loot), and civility will be lost. And, I thought, all of this is true.

And I thought, it can happen, it could happen, it very well will happen to me sometime, to my family.

And I thought, well, I guess I better buy a gun.

And I did. In fact more than one. Because I would have to be my own police department if things got really bad. So just in case.

Anyway, that is how I figured it.

I think a few years have gone by since 911. I thought, FEMA and the Homeland Security and all, they got everything ready, just in case. Obviously, it was a pipe dream on my part. Right now, FEMA, the National Guard, everyone, is doing the best they can. I am not going to blame anyone.

But I do realize, it will be up to us, as Americans, to be ready, that it’s not going to be the government that is going to necessarily save us. We have to do it, in part, we have to be ready, as a moral, upright, community. There is a degradation of values and morals in today’s liberal society. That is the number one danger to us and our families. We have to take back our nation.

[RasterMaster]

This will be the standard reply I give to all posts when the subject is to blame Bush for all:

The nanny state/welfare mentality - it's always someone else's job. What part of MANDITORY EVACUATION do these fools in the media not get? The people on the coast were warned, told to leave, and chose to stick it out thereby endangered themselves and their families. That would be considered neglect when parents put their children in danger.

The Governor and Mayor's extreme ineptitude is what the bozos in the lame-steam media should be focused on. It was their job to prepare their constituents, NOT the federal government. There was ample time to prepare, and most responsible adults took to the road for safety. Yet all that was offered on the state level was another poor evacuation plan from the dimwit dimocrats. Either using "one way out" stuck in traffic or holing up in the dome, what choices!

Before the storm, they could have used all the school & city busses to evacuate those who couldn't make it on their own to higher ground further inland. But they chose weakness in the face of real danger instead.

After the storm, all resources were put at their disposal, yet they delayed making the request as well as delayed the delivery when aid arrived. Martial Law was declared and yet they still sat on thier hands allowing lawlessness to erupt. Neither can handle their jobs, yet refuse to step aside and allow someone else to handle it.

If President Bush hadn't announced the evacuation order, there would be more loss and suffering, mainly due to the clueless Democrats who failed to do anything - who, by the way, have been in charge of that state long before Bush ran for office.

When you have your hand extended, you shouldn't b!tch about getting aid when you were told to prepare for 3-5 days of food and water. When it comes to your family's safety, waiting on government to solve your problems is no better than waiting on a welfare check instead of getting off your arse and finding work.

But I guess wading around in sewage and griping about it is a much more pleasing alternative if you always pull the "D" lever when it's time to elect leadership. The failure of a democrat-led state is why the media is out in force trying to point fingers at Bush, when they all know the reality of the situation...their own failures cause many more to die than would have if they hadn't been slow to react.

[don'tbedenied]

Bet you a bottle of adult beverage the death toll is less than the "minimum".

[frogjerk]

There is only one option open to the mayor. Finger in the proverbial dike, and yell for the Feds

The problem is that his finger isn't even in the dike and never was.

[dfwgator]

"If it's to be, it's up to me."

[Pylot]

I believe that we will see at least 25000 deaths. That would be less than 2% of the population that got run over by this storm.

If you recall, the magnitude of the tsunami was not apparent for over a week and even then the toll kept climbing.

[Mrs.Liberty]

Jeffers posted this yesterday, right here on FR.

[rip033]

Amen! Enough of this finger pointing and belly aching. It's time to buck up and stand straight! My company has people employed down in the destroyed areas with family members missing. No one here is asking when the government is going to help them. Were collecting money to send to the offices just outside the damaged areas. They will then purchase supplies and run them to our employees. We all take care of each other. Not the government alone. We all have a stake in this!

[bvw]

It isn't time to point fingers of blame, even at the looters. 100 looters don't hold a candle to the 20,000 people that will die if they aren't rescued.

Time has quickly shown the folly of that sentiment. Order is the first order of business (saving only rescue of the immediately near death, meaning death in moments) for without order, without a ferocious intolerance for chaos, thugery, looting and lawlessness, the general rescue will not proceed at any speed if at all.

[SueRae]

Outstanding. Best post I've read since this happened.

[American Quilter]

(clap clap clap clap)

[Veritas et equitas ad Votum]

"I would ask you to prepare, in the course of three days, to completely evacuate and rebuild a city of approximately one million people."

This is a false premise.

The NO authorities should have standing plans at all times given the topography of the region.

This article makes it sound like the thoughts of massive floods and terrible hurricanes were never contemplated before last week. Perhaps they weren't, but they should have been established decades ago and updated annually.

[A Balrog of Morgoth]

The problem is that his finger isn't even in the dike and never was.

Last I heard, he was in Baton Rouge.

Could be that I heard wrong.

[Old Professer]

We are in the fourth day of the aftermath; by now, if thousands of dead people are there, given the air temperature and the temperature of the standing water, their bloated bodies would be floating all over the place and the skies would be black with seagulls and other scavengers.

[frogjerk]

I believe you are correct.

[The Spirit Of Allegiance]

Excellent systems analysis and discussion of crisis management. Thanks.

[frogjerk]

Correct. Everyone knew for decades that NO was at risk. Someone made a risk management decision long ago and said that a Cat 3 levee is "good enough". I guess they were wrong.