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Venona Ten Years Later: Lessons for Today
History News Network ^ | 7-18-05 | Steven T. Usdin

Posted on 07/17/2005 5:58:36 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe

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To: Tailgunner Joe
Answers to similar questions, regarding educated Muslims with experience of life in Europe and the U.S. like those who led the 9-11 and Madrid attacks, are essential to constructing a defense against 21st century terrorism.

Did I miss the memo? They were educated in Western Hating American and European academia. They couldn't have gotten a more anti-western message in any madrassa in Pakistan.

21 posted on 07/17/2005 6:34:35 PM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (Deadcheck the embeds first.)
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To: Rodney King

I have to admit, even though I held the media and the left in reserve with a grain of salt, part of me said "Back then, things were different. The media didn't lie to us back then, only now..."

Boy, how naiive. I didn't feel betrayed, but I did feel like I had been fed a shovel of shiite growing up. I look at nearly everything I learned with a skeptical eye, now.


22 posted on 07/17/2005 6:34:52 PM PDT by rlmorel ("Innocence seldom utters outraged shrieks. Guilt does." Whittaker Chambers)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
"opposed to the basic tenets of modern society"

Perhaps because they were and are themselves opposed to the basic tenets of modern society? We always assume these people are just naive. In my experience, there is a kind of flipness that might charitably be traced to naivety, but that is a teenage version of the thing and readily passes. By the time people are this deep in it, they know what they are doing and like it. Anything is better than admitting they've been wrong, or worse still, that someone they have hated and smeared is a better man than they are.

23 posted on 07/17/2005 6:36:04 PM PDT by JasonC
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

Good handle...don't be lonesome-there are more of us here than you think! Someday this state will change...someday....


24 posted on 07/17/2005 6:36:18 PM PDT by rlmorel ("Innocence seldom utters outraged shrieks. Guilt does." Whittaker Chambers)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
The pertinent question is no longer whether Americans spied, but rather how highly educated, intelligent men and women failed to comprehend the true nature of Stalinist communism, and why they were willing to risk their lives and imperil the security of their families, neighbors and friends to commit crimes on behalf of a foreign power opposed to the basic tenets of modern society.

I don't believe American "Liberals" failed to comprehend the true nature of Stalinist communism. I look on most of them as "Compassionate Communists". They embraced the goals of communism, while shying away from some of it's excesses. They may have decried some of Stalin's method's, but believed that the people were ultimately to blame . The people brought it upon themselves by their failure to accept. Blame the victim!

25 posted on 07/17/2005 6:37:22 PM PDT by F-117A
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To: ken21

Thats because they were invited spies.


26 posted on 07/17/2005 6:38:51 PM PDT by mthom
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To: tet68

They still don't.


27 posted on 07/17/2005 6:39:50 PM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (Scratch a Liberal. Uncover a Fascist)
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To: ken21
Bookmark (for purchase)

Thanks for the recommendation ken.

28 posted on 07/17/2005 6:42:41 PM PDT by Just A Nobody (I - LOVE - my attitude problem!)
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To: ken21

That book knocked me out, as well.
Alger Hiss.
Never forget the name.
McCarthy - a gifted man who gave his entire reputation to save our country.


29 posted on 07/17/2005 6:43:42 PM PDT by mabelkitty (Lurk forever, but once you post, your newbness shines like a new pair of shoes.)
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To: ModelBreaker

I respected Moynihan.
Even more so when I learned he was not fooled by Hillary.


30 posted on 07/17/2005 6:44:47 PM PDT by mabelkitty (Lurk forever, but once you post, your newbness shines like a new pair of shoes.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Excellent article Joe. This is the kind of the thing that the mainstream media takes great pains not to share with t he masses. For the most part people still believe that the cold war was just paranoia.


31 posted on 07/17/2005 6:45:54 PM PDT by DouglasKC
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To: rlmorel

You and I came away with the same central points - McCarthy is a hero.
Can you recommend some goods books on him? I'd like to read them, as well.
She hit a home run with her analysis, and I'm glad she chose to correct the wrongs of Mr. McCarthy's historical record.


32 posted on 07/17/2005 6:47:51 PM PDT by mabelkitty (Lurk forever, but once you post, your newbness shines like a new pair of shoes.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

In 1938/39 the French passed by courier directly to FDR that the Hiss brothers were Russian spies. FDR did nothing. The author has the gall to say McCarthy was excessive, odd he subscribes nothing to FDR.


33 posted on 07/17/2005 6:48:46 PM PDT by cynicom
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To: rlmorel

Read "Dish" by Jeanette Walls - you want to know about how the media lies and for how long? JFK should have been IMPEACHED!


34 posted on 07/17/2005 6:49:07 PM PDT by mabelkitty (Lurk forever, but once you post, your newbness shines like a new pair of shoes.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
That first batch of Venona decrypts released a decade ago included cables between Pavel Fitin, the Soviet head of foreign intelligence, and his officers in New York describing the espionage activities of an American engineer codenamed “Liberal” who worked for the U.S. Army Signal Corps.

Well, that was certainly an appropriate code name...
35 posted on 07/17/2005 6:49:45 PM PDT by Virginia Ridgerunner ("Si vis pacem para bellum")
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To: Fudd Fan
Yah huh ... funny how the past couple of days have made
"our" late night session not seem so twilight zone-esq.

...orders came from the top.

Since the WH was crawling with 'em, I would say this is most probable.

36 posted on 07/17/2005 6:50:34 PM PDT by Just A Nobody (I - LOVE - my attitude problem!)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
The Venona secrets were disclosed at the July 1995 press conference largely as a result of prodding from the late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan, who learned of the program when he headed the Commission on Protecting and Reducing Government Secrecy.

NEVER TRUST DEMOCRATS WITH NATIONAL SECURITY!

Moynihan taught the Soviets a lesson. NEVER reuse a one time pad. Sure as hell this lesson was noted and circulated by foreign intelligence and WILL NOT be repeated.

NEVER TRUST DEMOCRATS WITH NATIONAL SECURITY!

37 posted on 07/17/2005 6:52:04 PM PDT by Doctor Raoul (Support Our Troops, Spit On A Liberal Reporter)
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To: rlmorel

After seeing what the barking moonbats are doing in Minnecraponus, that undeniably confirmed that Joe McCarthy was indeed right.


38 posted on 07/17/2005 6:55:49 PM PDT by Fred Hayek (Liberalism is a mental disorder)
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To: rlmorel
He bought our country time,...
And you see the tactics of the Left back then repeated nearly verbatim now.

Who will be the patriot that buys us time, this time?

BTW, your tagline is most appropriate!

39 posted on 07/17/2005 6:56:06 PM PDT by Just A Nobody (I - LOVE - my attitude problem!)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

"There were also political reasons to keep Venona under wraps, especially in the 1950s. Republicans were attacking Democrats for coddling Communists and playing down the Red threat, while the Truman White House accused the GOP of red baiting. Publicizing documentation of widespread Communist espionage would have plunged the FBI into the middle of a superheated partisan debate."

Heaven forbid that word might get out that the Republicans were telling the truth!


40 posted on 07/17/2005 6:56:27 PM PDT by Sam Hill
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