Doctors spar on degree of Schiavo's awareness; sharp words by some

The Ledger.com ^ | Thursday, March 24, 2005 | MALCOLM RITTER

[Destro]

PVSers do indeed make such gestures and noises by the way.

[Destro]

There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven: a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot.

Ecclesiastics 3:1-8

[GeekDejure]

There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven: a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot.

=======

If we plant a time thingy under Greer will that uproot him ??? ;-))

[Raycpa]

A time to murder and a time to be murdered. A time to starve and a time to be starved. A time to dehydrate .....Greer

[Saundra Duffy]

I read that Terri is now bleeding from pores. If you think about what Jesus Christ endured in the Garden of Gethsemene, this will make your BLOOD BOIL and send shivers all over your body. This is absolutely unimaginable!!!

[GarySpFc]

The fine was not overturned - what was overturned was his fine for unorthdox treatments. The doctor was fined for bilking patients of money.

Oh! Do you remember what I stated about billings can be administrative errors? Anyone who has worked with health insurance claims is very famaliar with them. When I go to the link below I find the action was reversed. I quote, "The record contains competent, substantial evidence to support the Board’s finding that the patient enrolled in a $3000 treatment program but only received a $2000 treatment program. However, the record does not contain clear and convincing evidence to support the Board’s conclusion that the overcharge was the result of exploitation for financial gain under section 458.331(1)(n). There is no evidence in the record that the overcharge was intentional. The overcharge could have been an administrative mistake by Dr. Hammesfahr’s office or simply the result of the patient’s early termination of the program. Either scenario does not support the trial court’s finding of a violation of section 458.331(1)(n). At best, the facts in this case provide a basis for a civil contract dispute between the parties.
We reverse the final order of the Board disciplining Dr. Hammesfahr for financial exploitation of a patient in violation of section 458.331(1)(n).

http://www.2dca.org/opinion/March%2026,%202004/2D03-1109.pdf

[jer33 3]

Dr. Ronald Cranford...Something wicked this way comes.

If Michael Schiavo wins (in an earthly sense) this case will further promote Dr. Cranford's work and mission. His University does recieve funds from very liberal organizations supporting euthanasia.

[Earthdweller]

Terri Schiavo Before dehydration

God Bless you Terri in your hour of death.

May all who said your smile was fake be haunted by it for the rest of their lives.

[GOPJ]

Very well said. I would rather pass on our fairly limited resources to my children than give it to medical devices companies. I am seriously worried about big government bad laws being passed that might limit my freedom of choice.

I have a living will. I have no desire to provide one more vacation home for my doctor. But here's the problem, people like us are put in a spot when dealing with Terri. We fear the unintended consequences of lawmakers generalizing. Disappointing judges made it worse. They're the people who should cut the gordian knot, not wallow in elitist fears. How could they not respect for a woman who easily could have been abused? Can't they see this case is different?

I stand with Terri. Terri, the person. Not "Terri the life at all costs and misery" concept.

I slept on a hospital floor to safeguard my fathers last request not to be hooked to machines to prolong his painful death from cancer. He asked all of us to make sure that didn't happen and we stayed at the hospital in shifts to protect him from overzealous nurses.

Terri's different.

Maybe freepers can figure this problem out -- the judges are an embarrassment- coming across as unthinking control freaks.

Good people will have to solve this. People like you. People like me. The great unwashed. There's a man named Hentoff or something like that who writes for the Village Voice. He seems capable of seeing both sides. I'm sure there are others.

Thanks for your comments. You're a good person -- and honest. Maybe with good people trying, a fair solution can be found.

[A. Pole]

I slept on a hospital floor to safeguard my fathers last request not to be hooked to machines to prolong his painful death from cancer. He asked all of us to make sure that didn't happen and we stayed at the hospital in shifts to protect him from overzealous nurses.

You father did not want to be kept "alive" for another 15 or 30 years? How strange.

[lula]

Books? Movie?
I personally will boycott any and all things connected with Terri, unless it is from the parents.

[AmericanChef]

Note to self: before choosing another doctor, make sure he believes in God.

[don-o]

This is something that has bothered me about the way the discussion has developed. What does it matter, really, whether she's PVS or not?

On an emotional level, we can all get motivated by the idea that Terri could be rehabilitated to some minimal but gratifying level of communicativeness and response. But on an ethical level, it is ALWAYS wrong to deny a dependent food and water for the purpose of starving him or her to death, EVEN IF that dependent is unconscious and gravely and irretrievably disabled.

It is illegal IN FLORIDA for a guardian to fail to give the "protected" person food and water. This constitutes wrongful neglect (or abuse) on the part of the guardian.

The FLORIDA Constitution says that disabled people are entitled to equal protection of law.

Judge Greer has violated the ADA Cf 28 CFR, Ch 1, Subpart B, Sect 35.130 which states "Nothing in the Act or this part authorizes the representative or guardian of an individual with a disability to decline food, water, medical treatment, or medical services for that individual."

I think PVS is a junk diagnosis, anyway, because the criteria based on brain anatomy do not take into account the possibility that other parts of the brain can assume some of the functions which were lost by the damaged and atrophied cortex. It's analogous to the way my son, who has Central Auditory Processing Disorder (CAPD), has developed atypical neural pathways in order to process auditory information.

Mrs. Don-o

[GeekDejure]

I read that Terri is now bleeding from pores. If you think about
what Jesus Christ endured in the Garden of Gethsemene, this will
make your BLOOD BOIL and send shivers all over your body.

This is absolutely unimaginable!!!

=======

Yeah... and three vile, filthy, disgusting, despicable, deceiving,
lying, torturous, murderous servants of Satan are behind it from
start to finish: Michael Schiavo, George Greer, George Felos !!!

.

[Saundra Duffy]

Heavenly Father - We beseech Thee to stop those treacherous evil men who seek to take innocent life by starvation and dehydration.

[GeekDejure]

Hail Terri...

Child of God...

We pray those judicial sinners...

Do not cause the hour of thy death...

Amen !!!

[Jeff Head]

TERRI'S OWN ACTIONS PROVE SHE HAS THE WILL TO LIVE

[Destro]

You can go to a witch doctor all you want. I want a doctor whose medical knowledge is based on science.

[GOPJ]

Your father did not want to be kept "alive" for another 15 or 30 years? How strange.

If someone had hit my father and then made sure he couldn't get therapy to get better, he would have fought like a soldier. And so would my family. My father was old. He had cancer. He was in great pain. Terri is none of those. There was no ambiguity in my fathers situation. He wanted to die a natural death. He ate and drank up until the end. He didn't want to be sustained artificially. Can't you see the difference?

Strange.

Terri's family is doing the right thing. I'm sorry our judges are incapable of nuance. I believe with everything in me that Michael is lying about Terri's wishes. I believe only a fool would think of Michael as her "husband". And I believe people who think they are too cute to say what they really mean are childish.