Why Schiavo's Parents Didn't Have a Case

latimes.com ^ | March 25, 2005 | Andrew Cohen

[goldstategop]

I consider human beings to be more important than empty platitudes. Empty platitudes have always been the last refuge of tyrants and scoundrels.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[nickcarraway]

Judge Greer is also ignoring a law passed by the legislature and signed by Governor Bush last year. He claimed it was a violation of separation of powers. The whole point to our system of government, is if a law is disagreed with, the legislature creates a new law, and the executive signs it into law. If creating Terri's law was a violation of the separation of powers, the isn't every single ammendment to the Constitution as well? The legislature did exactly what it was supposed to do in that case, and the judge ignores it. He isn't responsible to the laws of the state of Florida, only to himself.

[HiTech RedNeck]

You do know that these more liberal guidelines were drafted in pursuance of a precedent molded out of penumbras and emanations by the SCOFLAws? A tighter law would have been found unconstitutional by the SCOFLAws. So eager were they to protect the right to die that they applied the same standard to it which would be required to determine who inherits grandmother's antique chest. It is a shame and an outrage. And you are dancing with glee over it.

[Kozak]

Too bad Terri isn't a dog.

Pinellas County animal Control Ordinance

Sec. 14-32. Cruelty to animals.

(a) Whoever impounds or confines any animal in any place and fails to supply the animal during such confinement with a sufficient quantity of good and wholesome food and water shall be in violation of this article.

(b) Whoever keeps any animal in any enclosure without wholesome exercise and change of air shall be in violation of this article.

(c) Whoever abandons to die any animal that is maimed, sick, infirm, or diseased shall be in violation of this article.

(d) A person who unnecessarily overloads, overdrives, tortures, torments, deprives of necessary sustenance or shelter, or unnecessarily or cruelly beats, mutilates, or kills any animal, or causes the same to be done, or carries in or upon any vehicle, or otherwise, any animal in a cruel or inhumane manner, shall be in violation of this article.

[goldstategop]

Of course not. They are all in it for themselves. The peasants can go mind their own business. What the Lords Of The Manor says, goes.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[Truthsearcher]

Yes, and I am saying they can pass another law that supersedes it.

Furthermore, if Greer did not want her to die he could have found a way around it. Judges almost always reach the conclusion first and then come up with ways to justify their conclusion, the frequently come up with penumbras and emanations and "living constitutions" to support the result they wish to find. I am not going to give Greer a pass on this, he wanted this result, for whatever reason, he wanted it.

[txradioguy]

"If you want the status of spouse to be conditoonal like for example the spouse has to remain chaste/celibate the entire time their other spouse is in such a state to maintain their "next of kin" status then the legislature has to pass it as an addendum to the law."

YOu're telling me that somewhere in the Florida family court sttutes there's not ANYTHING that covers where a husban or wifes claim to "guardianship" begins and ends?

And besides it doesn't need to be passed as an addendum to ANY law. It's right there in the vows we take when we're married.

"For better or worse...in sickness and in health I will forsake all others..."

How can you say THAT is Puritanical?

[goldstategop]

Yes... but a judge can order a person to be starved to death. Of course, that's not judicial activism. That's just following the letter of the law.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[HiTech RedNeck]

QUITE so. If Greer didn't want this to turn out with Terri's death, he could have viewed the testimony of the Schiavos about her supposed wish to die with skepticism because it appeared so late, and because others testified that she never made any such statements and one testified that she made an opposite statement.

[txradioguy]

sttutes = statutes

I apologize for my crappy typing. Somewhere my old HS typing teacher is rolling over in her grave.

[HiTech RedNeck]

And, if the guardian commits crimes, he can be disqualified. He committed the crime of adultery.

[T'wit]

>> Whoever impounds or confines any animal

But surely this applies to Terri, too. She is unarguably an animal.

[goldstategop]

Hmm.... I'm surprised Judge Greer did NOT rule monogamy unconstitutional. After all by a strict interpretation of Florida family laws, bigamy is illegal and Michael Schiavo forfeited his duties and rights as a husband when he betrayed his marriage vows and lived in wedlock with another woman and had children by her. But that won't do for our "progressive" courts. There's no reason he shouldn't have it both ways. Just another sign of the times.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[txradioguy]

From the Florida State Law on Co-habitation

798.01. Living in open adultery

Whoever lives in an open state of adultery shall be guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. Where either of the parties living in an open state of adultery is married, both parties so living shall be deemed to be guilty of the offense provided for in this section.

Bingo!

[Truthsearcher]

I believe in States' rights, I also believe in life, liberty and pursuit of happiness. I believe when one conflict with the other States' rights lose.

That why I believe Lincoln actions was correct in 1861, there states rights was also used to defend the southern states' right to practice slavery. The federal government has every right and duty to step in and put a stop to a state government that acts to deprives its citizens of life and liberty without due process.

[Kozak]

Well, many on the left have argued that she has no humanity because of her condition. Ergo she must be an animal....

[txradioguy]

(b) For a misdemeanor of the second degree, by a definite term of imprisonment not exceeding 60 days.

Throw the bum in jail.

[goldstategop]

If Judge Greer wanted to impose the death penalty, it should have been an equal one. Why in the world should Michael be allowed to reap the fruits of his crine?

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[txradioguy]

(e) $500, when the conviction is of a misdemeanor of the second degree or a noncriminal violation.

Take some of the money this bum is using for his high priced mouth piece that was supposed to go for his wifes long term care while we're at it.

[Destro]

Florida Statue 765.101

(10) "Life-prolonging procedure" means any medical procedure, treatment, or intervention, including artificially provided sustenance and hydration, which sustains, restores, or supplants a spontaneous vital function. The term does not include the administration of medication or performance of medical procedure, when such medication or procedure is deemed necessary to provide comfort care or to alleviate pain.

You are also incorrect - a guardian is appointed if no next of kin is available. MS has that right as the husband - he is the designated "proxy".

765.401 The proxy.--

(1) If an incapacitated or developmentally disabled patient has not executed an advance directive, or designated a surrogate to execute an advance directive, or the designated or alternate surrogate is no longer available to make health care decisions, health care decisions may be made for the patient by any of the following individuals, in the following order of priority, if no individual in a prior class is reasonably available, willing, or competent to act:

(a) The judicially appointed guardian of the patient or the guardian advocate of the person having a developmental disability as defined in s. 393.063, who has been authorized to consent to medical treatment, if such guardian has previously been appointed; however, this paragraph shall not be construed to require such appointment before a treatment decision can be made under this subsection;

(b) The patient's spouse;

765.404 Persistent vegetative state.

For persons in a persistent vegetative state, as determined by the attending physician in accordance with currently accepted medical standards, who have no advance directive and for whom there is no evidence indicating what the person would have wanted under such conditions, and for whom, after a reasonably diligent inquiry, no family or friends are available or willing to serve as a proxy to make health care decisions for them, life-prolonging procedures may be withheld or withdrawn under the following conditions:

(1) The person has a judicially appointed guardian representing his or her best interest with authority to consent to medical treatment; and

(2) The guardian and the person's attending physician, in consultation with the medical ethics committee of the facility where the patient is located, conclude that the condition is permanent and that there is no reasonable medical probability for recovery and that withholding or withdrawing life-prolonging procedures is in the best interest of the patient. If there is no medical ethics committee at the facility, the facility must have an arrangement with the medical ethics committee of another facility or with a community-based ethics committee approved by the Florida Bio-ethics Network. The ethics committee shall review the case with the guardian, in consultation with the person's attending physician, to determine whether the condition is permanent and there is no reasonable medical probability for recovery. The individual committee members and the facility associated with an ethics committee shall not be held liable in any civil action related to the performance of any duties required in this subsection.

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You tell me how Greer ignored these statues? Looks liek he held them up to the letter.