Posted on 02/12/2005 6:02:42 PM PST by Former Military Chick
I remember now catching the tail end of the movie on TV. Never got the title however. You're right. These inquisitions each time an islamofascist gets "iced" has the appearance we're "busting ass" to look PC to the rag heads by scapegoating our own guys. This kind of shit does not promote a high enlistment rate.
Evidence now indicates that troop strength is so low that the fat ass army paper shufflers are beginning to fill vacancies in combat units with women recruits. Supposedly something like 30 women KIA and 200 plus wounded so far. I can't believe this shit...that the US military is so feminized it will place females into combat roles (ground and air) rather than draft males to fill quotas.
"Shoot straight you bastards and don't make a mess of it!"
It appears there is a problem with Mrs Pantano's web site. Insufficient band width or something. Has anyone got her link for on-line contributions?? She may need financial help to get the web site up and running again.
"The Marines shot out the vehicle's tires to force it to a halt, took the two men into custody and ordered them to rip out the seats and the interior of the vehicle during a search for booby traps and secret compartments, Gittens said."
Before turning them loose to search the car, the Marines undoubtedly searched them thoroughly. The Marines also would have watched them carefully to make sure they didn't seize a weapon from the car. Accordingly, when the two men approached him, the Lieutenant must have been aware that they were unarmed. No, it doesn't look good for the Lieutenant.
"War is war and we are fighting murderous maniacs not pom pom girls."
That is no excuse for becoming murderous maniacs ourselves.
Still one of dfw's alltime greatest flicks.
There’s always doubt in an “undoubtedly” thorough search, how completely they were watched and what even unarmed potential insurgents were capable of when refusing orders to halt and seconds from overtaking you.
It’s unprecedented for any nation anytime anywhere to criminally hold combatants fighting such an insurgency to that level of perfection in judgment. To do so affects morale and combat effectiveness. The people who proposed such a thing, especially when we’re having such difficulty attracting both officers, combat arms troops and Marines in this war, are at least as “criminally” responsible for poor judgment.
I have great confidence in the forthcoming UCMJ proceedings. If exonerated, the UCMJ permits Lt. Pantano to prefer charges against his accuser. That is, unless he is overruled by higher command, as Chuck Yeager was at one point in his career. Let's get this out of the way and get back to the real business of killing people and breaking things.
In response to comment #47.
First off, welcome to Free Republic. A forum that allows all us the opportunity to share our point of view.
I agree, there is probably something in the middle when it comes to the facts of the case. My husband sent me the very same note, he is one of our finest serving our country and I respect beloved's point of view. Thus, I am open to your thoughts.
I think many of us hope that the good prevails and that includes our military folks.
Both articles are light on facts so it is difficult to render a fact based opinion. The USMC does waste a lot of time or energy prosecuting guys for doing their job's in combat, so obviously there is more to the story than is presented. What is missing might the facts as to why this Marine is facing charges?
I did not label him a hero. I asked my fellow Freepers for a discussion of this news item.
I do think, with events going on in Iraq and Afghanistan we do try to find a reason to justify actions. I do not take glee in the loss of life, but, I will say if it were our guy verses their guy I will stand behind our guy. Until facts prove otherwise.
Breaker Morant - 1980 Aussie movie (pretty good one, as I remember)
Tagline: When they speak of heroes - of villains - of men who look for action, who choose between honor and revenge - they tell the story of Breaker Morant
Plot Outline: Three Australian lieutenants are court martialed for executing prisoners as a way of deflecting attention from war crimes committed by their superior officers.
The platoon leader did not know whether the terrorists were armed or not when they approached. They had been to the SUV is my understanding. The marines had not checked out the SUV wishing to avoid possible booby traps. When the terrorists failed to obey the command to halt, all the more reason to believe they picked something out of the SUV...an explosive? Bingo!! You shoot. Sometimes you're right. Sometimes you're wrong. But all the time you and your platoon live. Makes perfectly good sense to me. If there is anything in the rules of engagement that this violates, then the problem is with the ROE. So what's the beef 0302??
Furthermore, the ROE apparently do not...although they should...provide for the immediate execution of enemy combatants out of uniform. For some reason, in this shitty war, they seem to have more constitutional rights than our own guys.
Any guy that has served our country in two wars is a hero Chick. Lt Pantano IS A HERO. I don't know how many "gooners" he's whacked overall, but I'd wager he's gotten his quota. These latest two will not be screwing with the US marines anymore and that's what counts. Lt Pantano is the kind of soldier that wins wars. Not the desk jockeys that sit on their ass till their pants are shiney figuring out ways to make themselves seem important by screwing over the troops. The problem here is with a command structure that has allowed these charges to even see the light of day...apparently thinking we're fighting a bunch of pom pom girlies over there. Unless these girly boys (Probably left over from the good old clintonista days) are cleaned out and replaced by George S. Patton types, we're going to loose this freaking war. That's my take chick.
Thanks for the response, and the welcome to Free Republic. I've read this blog a lot...but have never felt compelled to post until now.
So...accept my apology if this looked like an attack on you personally. I meant this as a general posting...but hit "reply" on your posting.
Hopefully he will get his day in court, and the truth will be exposed. The JA staff at Camp Lejeune is more than competent, and the last thing they want to do is prosecute a decorated Marine combat leader...trust me when I tell you this: they wish they could make this one go away.
Semper Fi.
I have no "beef" with you or the Lieutenant, kimosabe31. Nor have I declared that he's guilty.
Answer this: Why would the Marine Corps be doing this unless there was evidence that proves that he MAY have committed murder? The good PR? Nope. Bored lawyers? Doubt it. This is the last thing that they want...to nail a decorated officer for murder.
My point is this: Unless you were there and you saw what happened, don’t rush to judgment. Only a few people know the exact events of that day. It may have been a justified shooting, but there is a chance that it was not. And sometimes highly competent individual lose it. As luck has it, we live in a country that will give the Lieutenant his day in court, and not a firing squad on the battlefield, like you are suggesting we do to our enemy.
Why are we talking about Hannity instead of this story?
Lt. Pantano could have avoided this whole tragedy if he had not uncuffed the prisoners. He said he did so in order for them to check the vehicle, yet he was standing only a few feet away, so if there was an explosion, Pantano himself would have been blown to bits. So he used TWO magazines to kill these guys, drapes their bodies over the SUV and leaves a touching note.
He should have taken his prisoners to the pokey and just blown up the car. Simple.
You're forgetting the possibility of some powerful liberal politician sticking their nose where it doesn't belong. Just my guess as to why they would try and make something out of nothing.
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