Posted on 02/10/2005 7:02:09 AM PST by malakhi
Maybe he did not have intent but if someone makes two films in a row where your country is the bad guys and are turned into pantomine villains you start to get a complex hence my original post.
And just as an aside, for the most part the Mohawks were allied with the British :0)
I can understand that, as I noted it was the British being debased, even if it was for dramatic effect. The historical background of Braveheart I don't know enough about to judge.
Well, I think if he made a movie showing the Americans getting beaten in battle when the Americans in fact were beaten in battle, I would be all right with that.
If this guy Tarleton (just guessing that his portrayal is the one that bothered you) was considered by fellow Brits to be "bloodthirsty" to the point that they were made uncomfortable by his actions, I don't see a problem with Gibson expressing that point of view on film.
I'm glad you found some quotes from Mel that corrected your impression of his interviews.
Probably not, he wasn't known for giving quarter, but I don't think anyone contends there's any basis for the Church incident, and I don't think there's any basis for portraying him as killing women, children, or prisoners en masse as in the "hospital" scene.
Did the Brits Burn Churches?
Couper Samuelson
Posted Monday, July 10, 2000, at 3:00 PM PT
In the new Mel Gibson film The Patriot, British soldiers are shown committing various atrocities against colonials during the American Revolution, such as locking civilians in a church and setting it on fire. Did the British actually violate the rules of war as the film alleges?
Many histories of the war document instances in which British and American soldiers shot prisoners of war or, more commonly, enemy soldiers trying to surrender. (This was considered a violation of the rules of war at the time and remains so today.)
Lt. Col. Banastre Tarleton--the model for The Patriot's main villain--reportedly killed more than a hundred colonial prisoners in South Carolina and was dubbed "Bloody Ban." The term "Tarleton's quarter" signified no quarter at all.
The journal of Thomas McCarty, a sergeant in the 8th Virginia Regiment, reports that British regulars shot civilians (at least two of them women) who were tending to wounded colonials after a nighttime engagement near New Brunswick on Feb. 1, 1777. After a skirmish in Newtown, N.Y., in 1779, two lieutenant colonels under Gen. John Sullivan were captured by the British. A fellow prisoner, John Salmon, recounted in his diary that when the two officers refused to give up the location of Sullivan's army, they "were put to death with terrible torture."
But historians generally agree that the rebels probably violated the rules of war more often than the British. Francis Marion, who led a band of militiamen in South Carolina (and whom Gibson's character most closely resembles), ordered his men to fire upon a group of British regulars and American Tories who had surrendered. A witness described it thus: "Numerous Tories died with their hands in the air."
In 1778, Georgia militiamen captured, stripped, and killed British Lt. John Kemp along with nine of his men for refusing to renounce the king. And the term "lynching" comes from Col. Charles Lynch of Virginia, who became famous for extra-legal executions of Tory sympathizers.
The church-burning scene in The Patriot is actually based on an incident from World War II, when Nazi soldiers burned a group of French villagers alive. There is no evidence that a similar event took place during the American Revolution.
Couper Samuelson is a Slate intern.
The link I posted said "he never spared prisoners" (but I don't remember "the 'hospital' scene", so I could be making a bad comparison).
I haven't seen anything about women and children yet.
As a leader of the cavalry, many British historians consider him to be one of the most dynamic of his day, but it’s his horrid treatment of civilians and soldiers in the South that dominates his legacy. Ironically, he has been largely forgotten in British history, but was so hated in the South that he's still very much remembered in Revolutionary history.
But historians generally agree that the rebels probably violated the rules of war more often than the British. Francis Marion, who led a band of militiamen in South Carolina (and whom Gibson's character most closely resembles), ordered his men to fire upon a group of British regulars and American Tories who had surrendered. A witness described it thus: "Numerous Tories died with their hands in the air."
In 1778, Georgia militiamen captured, stripped, and killed British Lt. John Kemp along with nine of his men for refusing to renounce the king. And the term "lynching" comes from Col. Charles Lynch of Virginia, who became famous for extra-legal executions of Tory sympathizers.
The church-burning scene in The Patriot is actually based on an incident from World War II, when Nazi soldiers burned a group of French villagers alive. There is no evidence that a similar event took place during the American Revolution.
............................................................
Wow. Thank you for that. I knew there were innaccuracies that could be linked to Gibson being less than honest in his portrayal of the Brits.
Hey, I admitted that an hour ago - both sides committed atrocities... I never claimed the colonists didn't commit them.
Yeh you did. But changing the facts in the movie with the church burning jogged my memory. I remember that article from a while back and it does go to prove that the British were held in an innaccurate light by Gibson.
Yeah, but it's Hollywood - everythign they do is inaccurate. ;0)
That being said, you need to see if you can locate a copy of "History of the Campaigns of 1780 and 1781 in the Southern Provinces of North America", which was written by Tarleton in 1786, in which he attempts to justify his "savagery"... Interesting read, if you can get it. :)
Oh, and by the way? It really dosn't matter what "side" committed atrocities during that war, since the people fighting on both sides were British ;0)
(I kill me...)
LOL
I don't think anybody told Mel that though....
Look, the bottom line is that I can understand the brits being a little peeved about Braveheart and The Patriot, but I just hope you keep in mind that most Americans don't hate the british - the movie was entertainment plain and simple, and I don't think the brits really have anything to worry about. :)
Oh absolutely. Ditto for the Brits not hating the US.
Although a lot of them hate Bush despite my protests.
I would love to see some well-done accurate movies made about the Revolution, but I don't ever see that happening from Hollywood...
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