Posted on 01/14/2005 12:21:45 PM PST by Mr. Mojo
Welcome to Free Republic. What a wonderful first post. Looks like you're going to be a good asset to us.
The Czech CZ-52 has been available for years, with the same or better pentrating ability. The normal price is no more than $150, whereas the FN Five-seveN is $800 and up, plus a lot more for the civilian ammo as well. So, if the CZ-52 hasn't been a problem, I wouldn't worry about the FN. Its just another "issue" created by the media/'Rat cabal in their never-ending quest to turn the whole country into D.C.
Then that would make you a little lot less than brilliant.
You restated a point that I made concerning the Glock. Thank you for validating what I remembered.
This Hooh Hah over the 5.7 is a media creation that serves to create problems, not "solve" them in any valid way.
Thanks for your insight
Your welcome. And you are certainly correct in your statement.
- Knightshadow.
Thank you.
- Knightshadow.
LMFAO, My thanks to the misinformed berk who posted this malarkey, thank you for reminding me what kind of simpletons anti-gun bigots are.
The fact is the level 2 kevlar vests are really weak in comparison to decent body armor like the interceptor or the even better dragon skin and the bottom of the barrel as far as protection goes, and the majority of all rifle rounds can penetrate level 2 kevlar with ease even when using standard ball ammo.
5.7mm stands no chance against decent body armor, and no vest is actually bullet proof, even the revered dragon skin is only bullet resistant.
Furthermore any idiot could modify almost any handgun round and give it the ability to penetrate kevlar, and there are handguns that are powerful enough to do so with standard ammo such ass .44 magnums and anything with more power really and there are weaker rounds then the .44 that can penetrate.
The only reason cops wear this crap is because the majority of the decent body armor out there is to big and bulky for them to wear on a daily basis, I know alot of cops and believe me even 2A kevlar is a choir to wear all summer as you will get very hot and sweaty and their jobs are hard enough.
Furthermore if I am correct they tested the speciality AP ammo next to standard .45 ACP ammo, I doubt standard ball 5.7mm would do near as well although either way our constitution protects the right to keep and bear arms with no exception as to how well those arms penetrate body armor.
BTW All of the cops I know took their oaths to defend the constitution of the United States of America and it’s second amendment seriously and None of them would suggest such unconstitutional bull as the banning of this weapon nor would any of them enforce such a ban, and believe me I asked.
The bottom line is only a complete buffoon would think that criminals would not be able to buy this handgun even if it were banned and it would also take such an idiot to think they do not have access to the specialty armor piercing rounds that FN is not importing.
Banning this handgun like all gun control would be completely pointless an a outright violation of our constitutionally protected right to keep and bear arms.
To bobber58 an mr.mojo
According to the National Safety Council, the total number of gun deaths (by accidents, suicides and homicides) account for less than 30,000 deaths per year. See Injury Facts, published yearly by the National Safety Council, Itasca, Illinois.
Yet law-abiding citizens use guns to defend themselves against criminals as many as 2.5 million times every year — or about 6,850 times a day.
This means that each year, firearms are used more than 80 times more often to protect the lives of honest citizens than to take lives.
Of the 2.5 million times citizens use their guns to defend themselves every year, the overwhelming majority merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers.
Less than 8% of the time, a citizen will kill or wound his/her attacker.
Citizens use handguns to protect themselves over 1.9 million times a year.
As many as 200,000 women use a gun every year to defend themselves against sexual abuse.
Citizens shoot and kill at least twice as many criminals as police do every year (1,527 to 606).
In Vermont, citizens can carry a firearm without getting permission... without paying a fee... or without going through any kind of government-imposed waiting period. And yet for ten years in a row, Vermont has remained one of the top-five, safest states in the union — having three times received the “Safest State Award.”[Our safest state has the least amount of gun control]
And readers of Newsweek learned that “only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. The ‘error rate’ for the police, however, was 11 percent, more than five times as high.”
Dr. Kleck is a professor in the school of criminology and criminal justice at Florida State University in Tallahassee. He has researched extensively and published several essays on the gun control issue. His book, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America, has become a widely cited source in the gun control debate. In fact, this book earned Dr. Kleck the prestigious American Society of Criminology Michael J. Hindelang award for 1993. This award is given for the book published in the past two to three years that makes the most outstanding contribution to criminology.
Even those who don’t like the conclusions Dr. Kleck reaches, cannot argue with his impeccable research and methodology. In “A Tribute to a View I Have Opposed,” Marvin E. Wolfgang writes that, “What troubles me is the article by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz. The reason I am troubled is that they have provided an almost clear-cut case of methodologically sound research in support of something I have theoretically opposed for years, namely, the use of a gun in defense against a criminal perpetrator.... I have to admit my admiration for the care and caution expressed in this article and this research. Can it be true that about two million instances occur each year in which a gun was used as a defensive measure against crime? It is hard to believe. Yet, it is hard to challenge the data collected. We do not have contrary evidence.” Wolfgang, “A Tribute to a View I Have Opposed,” The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, at 188.
Wolfgang says there is no “contrary evidence.” Indeed, there are more than a dozen national polls — one of which was conducted by The Los Angeles Times — that have found figures comparable to the Kleck-Gertz study. Even the Clinton Justice Department (through the National Institute of Justice) found there were as many as 1.5 million defensive users of firearms every year. See National Institute of Justice, “Guns in America: National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms,” Research in Brief (May 1997).
The statistics sited by me are from Dr. Klecks study.
No we the law abiding can not get the specialty armor piercing rounds, I have no doubt that the kind of scumbag criminal willing to murder a police officer would have no prob getting this round since many of them are still able to get many different types of illegal weapons us who obey the law have no access to.
Swiss citizens can legally own a variety of machine guns, submachine guns, anti-tank weapons, anti-aircraft guns, howitzers and cannons, in fact their military sells such weapons to the general public. [I’m sure these people have no prob legally getting the FN 5-7 and it’s specialty AP ammo]
In about half the Swiss cantons you can get a permit for carrying handguns, and in the other half you can legally carry concealed firearms without any sort of permit.
Switzerland has less gun control then any other country however they also have the least amount of gun crimes.
Many anti-gun bigots are under the delusion that their ammunition has to be registered and they are only legally ably to own a certain amount of ammo however only Swiss military ammo must be registered and only if bought at a private store, but need not be registered if bought at a range The nation’s 3, 000 shooting ranges sell the overwhelming majority of ammunition.
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