Posted on 01/14/2005 12:57:30 AM PST by conservative in nyc
I guess the 717 just couldn't compete with the 100-seat regional jets being produced by Embraer in Brazil. Or maybe there's just no market for a 100-seat jet these days?
Well they can always tear down the hanger and build condos on that site. Real estate near the coast in Southern California is worth a king's ransom. Boeing will either sell the land or build something on it--that land is far too valuable to be covered by an idle factory building. The lost jobs in aerospace are likely to be replaced with construction jobs in a year or two.
It is sad. The B-717 had conquered the MD-80 wing ice problem due to unused preheated fuel going back to the tanks and efficient engines. The B-717 cost around $36 Million last I heard. The similar Tu-334 costs around $15 Million but is not awarded U.S. FAR-25 certification for lack of a bilateral agreement bewteen USA and Ukraine.
http://www.tejavia.com
It is sad. The B-717 had conquered the MD-80 wing ice problem due to unused preheated fuel going back to the tanks and efficient engines. The B-717 cost around $36 Million last I heard. The similar Tu-334 costs around $15 Million but is not awarded U.S. FAR-25 certification for lack of a bilateral agreement bewteen USA and Ukraine.
http://www.tejavia.com
Do you have any idea what Embraer is selling their 190s for? The 717's a bit heavier, but probably a lot more durable in the long run. 30-year old Douglas jets are still flying today. Can't say the same for Embraer jungle jets.
The 100-seater market just doesn't seem to be very big these days. It's probably been killed by regional jets, which can offer higher frequency at lower costs. As far as I know, all U.S. airlines have scrapped their Fokker 100s, and only Northwest still flies DC-9s. Only a handful of smaller airlines, like Airtran, Midwest and Hawaiian bought the 717. And I've never seen a 737-600 or A318 (I think Frontier flies the later). On the other hand, JetBlue did order a bunch of Embraer 190s recently.
Ping
The article should have mentioned the absurd air-quality regulations in Southern California that make it difficult or impossible to use and store the paints and solvents necessary to build aircraft.
Actually, the market for the smaller RJ's is dying and the hot new area is the 100 seat market. Boeing tried twice before to cancel the 717 but was talked out of it by airlines, primarily Airtran I believe. Boeing has abandoned this market segment and the only producer of 100 seat jets is Embrear. Even Canadair doesn't have a jet in this segment yet.
What's the seating capacity on the CRJ-900? 80 to 90? Then again, I haven't actually seen any of those.
A sad day to see the end of the DC-9/MD-8x/MD-9x line, really. Not a bad 40-year run for them, though.
}:-)4
Dang it. I really like flying on this aircraft. Comfy and quick.
Seating is 86. I don't know if Bombardier plans to compete in the 100 seat sector and it would be a shame if they didn't. Having flown on both the Canadair plane and the Embrear I think the Embrear is more comfotable from a passengers perspective but I understand the Embrears don't have the operational flexibility of the Canadairs.
I always thought the 717 was doomed. In addition to the Embraer offering, there's the Airbus A318 and there will soon be a 90-100 seat offering from Canadair, not to mention the erosion in the market since the introduction of the smaller regional jets from Canadair and Embraer and the fact that there are still a lot of good used F-100s out there.
Canadian discount carrier JetsGo started flying F-100s last year- they probably got them from a US carrier. Not sure what the economics of the plane are like, but I had a ride on one and if I didn't know that Fokker was out of business I would've sworn it was brand new.
The CRJ900 is 80-90 seats but is not yet in production. They're also looking into developing something in the range of 110 seats. I think what we'll end up with is two distinct markets- Boeing vs. Airbus for larger (130+) jets and Canadair vs. Embraer for the smaller ones. I think Bombardier blew it- they invented the regional jet but cancelled the 90-seater, giving Embraer an advantage of several years. If they don't pick up the pace Embraer could end up pushing them out of teh no. 3 spot in the jet market.
Actually the aeronautics/aerospace regs that kicked in a few years ago(99-00?) was national in scope. 99.99% of the VOCs and particulates have to be removed from the exhaust stream.
Depending on how/when the technology matures, the body shops will eventually face the same requirements.
The old Norton AFB (can't remember what they call it these days) advertises that the VOC regs are more lenient up there than in the LA Basin.
U.S. citizens hold/held the aerospace jobs. Illegal aliens will get the construction jobs. Yet another kick in the pants...
The constructions jobs created by real estate development go to all kinds of people. Not all construction workers in California are illegal immigrants. I know because I did a home renovation in San Diego a couple years ago. A lot of the low-skilled people are illegal immigrants but there are all kinds of contractors who work on new buildings and most of them are U.S. citizens: architects, engineers, electricians, concrete and roofing contractors, HVAC contractors, wall and window contractors, and all the office staff who support them. It's a huge group of people that build new buildings when you count everybody who's involved. When Boeing develops that real estate they will create a lot of jobs for U.S. citizens.
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