The Ukrainian connection

Your welcome

The Soviet propaganda machine always described freedom fighters as Imperialists. What's new about this accusation that Poland or any other western country is "imperialist" in supporting the Ukranian peoples' desires to be free?

I'll say it again: the best security Russia can ask for is a happy, independent Ukraine that fears not the Soviet-style repression of their political aspirations.

"I'll say it again: the best security Russia can ask for is a happy, independent Ukraine that fears not the Soviet-style repression of their political aspirations."Thank you that is truth what you write!

"I'll say it again: the best security Russia can ask for is a happy, independent Ukraine that fears not the Soviet-style repression of their political aspirations."

Very true.

then why not make russian a 2nd official language and allow for dual citizenship? this would have diffused the east and made it more likely for Yuschenko to win? These two things are not major concessions but they are vital for the people who live there. Discounting their needs that much makes it apparent that they are treated as 2nd rate compared to those that live in the west.

"I know under ur skin imperial ambition is beating that maybe those western ukranians will reuinite with poland"

Tell me, why this would be imperial ambition?
Are you trying to say that when something gets stolen from you, and you want it back, you are greedy, and therefore wrong!?

Next, even though some of that land rightfully belongs to Poland, just as say Maryland belongs to America, after WWII, stalin deported a whole bunch of Ukrainians too, so it isn't their fault that they live in what is now western Ukraine. The Ukrainian people there are respectful of that land's Polish history, and they take care of the monuments from before WWII as if they were their own. An example of this is the cementary of the Defenders of Lwow, Poles who fought to keep the city Polish after WWI.

Also, before WWII ended, stalin convinced Poland's greatest "allies," Churchill, and Roosevelt, to endorse his border shifting. Those two traitors to freedom gave stalin their blessing when he purposely drew Poland's post-war borders to the west of Lwow and Wilno, two very important cities to Poland historically. Much blood was shed throughout the centuries to defend those lands from invaders, including Russia, Turkey, Sweden, and many others.
I guess to an American, this would be like someone taking a big chunk of the U.S., say with places like Saratoga, Washington and Westpoint included. You would of course want it back. Now do you see how important these places are to Poles?
As a note of interest, after the meeting, Churchil and a Polish ambassador went to Moscow. The ambassador knew nothing of the allies' treachery. He soon found out when molotov, stalin's right hand man, arrogantly told him how Poland had been betrayed. The ambassador, with tears in his eyes, turned to Churchill, and begged him to say it wasn't true. Begged him that the millions of Poles fighting worldwide weren't dying just to appease stalin. (By the end of WWII, Poland lost roughly a quarter of it's population as compared to under 1% each for Britain and America)
Churchill simply said it was true.
Later, after the ambassador asked Churchill how the allies could do such a thing, Churchill started yelling at the man who had just found out that his country was to be given as a prize to the worst murderer who ever lived. He accused Poland of trying to undermine allied solidarity, and that Poland was unapreciative of what was being done for it, unapreciative that Britain and France went to war for Poland. Funny, I think, that when the war started and it was time to act, as treaty obligated them to, Britain and France sat and did next to nothing. The Polish ambassador in France at the time couldn't believe it. When he shouted to his French counterpart that a treaty was a treaty, and must be honored, and what Britain and France were doing was not right (still deciding if they should declare war on Germany), when Polish cities were being bombed, the Frenchman retorted "Would you then have French cities bombed?"
This shows the political maneuvering and backstabbing that was the truth of WWII, not the simple killing-all-the- nazis-and-liberating-cities view held by many people in the west.

I am so happy that Poland, Ukraine, Lithuania, and all the other countries are free of the soviets at last. Still, each of the countries previously behind the iron curtain are quite poor. This is not due to some simple discomfort, as most people believe was what communism must have been like, but very real draining countries of not only their economies by the soviets, but also massive waves of arrests and executions, especially of the inteligencia of these countries. These countries were treated in many ways like Poland, betrayed by their allies to their worst enemy, coming in the guise of a liberator.
Maybe now, you can see that Polish hopes of Yuschenko winning the upcoming re-election are not some twisted, malevolent greed for land, but a hope for the Ukraine to truly throw off it's chains, and be free of Russia, free to do what the Ukraine wants, and not the directives of some enslaver claiming to be your best friend.

It is my hope that Poland gets out of the EU, and that Ukraine doesn't join. Maybe, all the countries that were once under soviet rule can make a seperate alliance, not needing to argue with EU countries about everything that should obviously be the right thing to do, like not marrying gays!

Poland, Lithuania, Ukraine, and other countries of the region are poor because of Russia's theiving and attempts at indoctrination, and also because the governments are still quite socialist. This seems to be passing away though, as in Poland, the ruling SLD (socialist party) is immensly unpopular (cited at 10% in a survey done near to a year ago). We shall se what the next elections hold, and hopefully the SLD's corruption and stealing will finally cease to be a problem. I hold similar hopes for all the countries in the region, but now, it seems like one bunch of wrongdoers will be replaced by another, namely the EU.
I really want that whole section of Europe to be finaly and trully free. I absolutely hate the way crooked politicians twist the truth, or make up their own, making it seem to many that theirs is the right way. Poland, for example, had such a good chance to rise again, and be truly free and prosperous, and now, the EU comes along and decieves enough Poles to get a majority vote, and therefore put Poland in the EU. This is simply putting Poland under the "direction" of someone else again. At least we are hampering every wrong decision the EU is attempting to make. Maybe the EU will throw Poland out.
I hope so, and that the Ukraine doesn't join, so that we may be free to make our own decisions.

great response!

Did even read it? You notice he says poland should get lwov and all surrounding regions back. (Which were built By Russian princes fyi.)

What was that slaughter called when the Ukranians rose up and killed off 5-6% of Polish-Lithuanian populous? I distinctly remember it was a joint effort with the tartars of crimea due to the nice policies of either you become catholic or purged off the land...