Posted on 11/22/2004 5:26:41 AM PST by Marine Inspector
bump
I confess I do not understand what the correct conservative perspective should be on this. Conservatism admires and reveres tradition. Conservatism also prefers change to be slow, not rapid and reckless.
The old "give me your tired and your poor" thing on the Statue of Liberty is certainly tradition and immigration has been a big part of the US since inception. The vast majority of US citizens are descendants of immigrants. Only Amerinds are not.
But ethnic change certainly goes faster with unbridled immigration. Ethnic change is difficult to assimilate. Not impossible. It takes time. But it is difficult. New immigrant ethnicities take some time to see the light of being Americans. Hence Bush's huge jump in Hispanic support on Nov 2.
I don't see an easy solution and what is proposed is not horrible. You can't toss people out of the country when they have children who are US citizens. Yes, I know about "anchor babies", but those babies are often 12 and 16 years old now and are HS football stars. Do we toss those families out? Those kids may not even speak Spanish.
The folks here who focus on the language defecits of recently arrived immigrants as some unwillingness to acculturate into America's greater community are completely lost.
A few years ago I dated a second generation woman of Greek ethnicity. Her folks came over from Greece (Port of Kalamata - Yanni's village! LOL) and her mother spoke virtually no English, even though she had been in the U.S. for almost 25 years. But, her three sons included two doctors and a Chicago commodity trader and Anastasia was a marketing communications specialist for a Fortune 100 company. All four were put through school by scholarships and financial support by the Greek community - as well as a lot of odd jobs and hard scholastic work.
That's how quickly things can change in one generation in this American blessing.
You do realize we already have guest worker programs. They are used for seasonal employees in mountain hotels in the pocanoes and have been used for sugar cane workers.
What you describe is the traditional immigration story, comming to the USA to make a better life for your children.
OK. I'll bite. Proper conservative approach to immigration, take 1
The US has very generous immigration laws, and most would even be amenable to more immigration if it is lawful, stable and orderly.
A conservative has a sense of fair play, and watching people stand in line at the INS, dot their i's and cross their t's to do it legally, commands our respect. We love our country, and feel a natural affection for those who want to come and love it, too. Sneaking in under the cover of darkness in contempt of our laws is another matter entirely. Those who begin their relationship breaking the law are likely to continue doing so...wait until an illegal rear-ends your car and it turns out he didn't bother to buy insurance along with his fake green card and fake license. You'll "conservative" up real quick.
There is no need to rent cattle cars and crowd the offenders in for mass deportation. The lawbreakers will deport themselves if we dress up the offending employers in nice, bright orange jumpsuits and let them pick up the trash from one end of the Blue Ridge Parkway (Cherokee) to the other (Front Royal). In the winter. And let them bring their own tent and sleeping bag.
We can only hope the Congress keeps this in the trash heap where it belongs. I didn't vote for him either this time, I did in 2000. I have alway's been a Party kinda guy, up until these RINO's came into power. This issue is the big one, but among others, he let Bubba steal the Veto pen. Plus, you can't fight a legit WOT with open border's.
If I'm not on your PING List, feel free to add me. Keep your head down out there MI. Blackbird.
Yes I do. We have several in fact.
I'm not lost, nor am I a "sick" individual.
I just think it is "reasonable" to have immigrants learn some basic english if they expect to live and work and be successful in the United States.
I don't think it is "reasonable" to expect Americans to learn some Spanish so they can get help at their local Wal-mart or Burger King. Color me crazy, but that's my honest reaction.
When the government starts having to translate everything into spanish, and the store intercom ads are all in spanish, when the fast food menu turns Spanish, when your 1st grade niece is able to read in spanish but not english....then we might have a problem...we might have taken this overboard.
Before you all start calling me a Klansman, (yes, I know it's coming, I've dealt with liberals before)My girlfriend is an immigrant from Asia. A LEGAL immigrant. She studied for years, worked hard, and her family played by the rules to come here legally. It is still possible for people to follow the law and come to America legally....a lot of people seem to forget this.
If people think I'm a racist or a bigot or a sick and twisted individual, then so be it.
All I'm promoting is LEGAL immigration and at least some small effort on the part of immigrants towards integration into the mainstream of American society.
Linguistic and cultural ghettos have never strengthened a nation. How can we be one nation if new arrivals refuse/are no longer expected to learn the dominant language?
If you visit another man's house, you should at least try to abide by his rules, customs and norms. This is even more true if you illegally snuck into that man's house, instead of entering legally through the front door.
Flame on.....
I don't have a ping list. gubamyster and a few others maintain the ping list. I'm sure he'll add you if you ask.
Keep your head down out there MI. Blackbird.
Will do and thanks.
Let me ask you this. If we already have several guest worker programs, what do you think is the real reason Bush wants to add another?
I was being sarcastic.
Spare me your lectures. I am not misguided.
I know exactly what happens to the Guatemalan's that try to sneak into Mexico.
And make a point to note the Politicians who put money before country, and what their pro-illegal stance is costing Americans. Yes 80 percent of Americans are against illegal immigration, but by the same token they don't know what to do about it. And since most Americans get their news from TV/CABLE, that market needs to be saturated. The Pro-Illegal Politicans and Employers will do everything in their power to shut it down but by then it will be snowballing. It's time to take back America from Idiots that are AINO (American in name only).
The other choices for Pres. were worse, have you read "Unfit for Command" By John O'Neill.
Kerry doesn't deserve to be in the Senate.
No, there were a few candidates that I feel would have been better then Bush and no, Kerry was not one of them.
The Mexican elite would never consent to the "guests" returning to Mexico. The whole amnesty plan is to make it possible for Mexico not to have to reform itself --- things won't be improving back home for them to want to go home or be allowed to come home. In 3 years, most of the "guests" will have 3 or 4 USA born anchor babies who get them all kinds of welfare programs and many other benefits --- like generous housing subsidies --- why would they give those up to go home to work $30 a week maquila jobs?
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