Why To Support Global Outsourcing

InformIT.com ^ | Oct 3, 2003 | Steve Fullmer

[Luis Gonzalez]

"At a meeting last month our Washington lobbyist ( yes we have a full time professional lobbyist) told us that Bush is so indebted to foreign nations for the war in Iraq that as long as Bush is President US companies are wasting time to lobby for help against foreign competitors."

I'm willing to bet dollars to doughnuts that your lobbyist is a Democrat.

[TopQuark]

You pose valid questions, and I'll try to answer the best I can.

Educate me where I'm wrong. I do not know whether you need education --- maybe you have enough and simply did not indicate it in your post. The only thing "wrong" with what you wrote was the absence of argument: in many places, you simply declare things, often nontrivial that require clarifiaaction, wrong.

It well may be that you have a point. But you have not made it in your post, nor have you shot down the article. All we have learned was that it irritated you. That is your right, of course, but if you try yo make a point it would be nice if you could explicate it.

By the way, what do you think about his global audience arguments?

Thanks for asking. I think it's leftist utopian nonsence in general, and in his case also factually incorrect. For instance, the following is a total nonsense:

Exporting jobs helps to create a balanced [what on earth does this mean? -- TQ] global audience. The need to export [whose need?] is particularly true [sic! It cannot be true --- he meant acute] of the technology sector, because the United States is the leader in technological advances. [Aha! So we have to be guilty and relinquish our lead. It is this kind of unearned guilt that is the first step towards socialist and other utopias] This offers the greatest bargaining power [this is ridiculous: he says, in essence that giving away makes your position stronger. That is, if you want to win a fist-fight --- cut off your arm. If you want to win a gun fight, give your pistol to the opponent and fight with a knife], which equates to greater gains [non sequitur].

The "logic" in the foregoing is, "If I am kind to my opponent, he'll be kind to me. My kindness increases my bargaining power." What planet is he from?

[TopQuark]

I agree with all of the specific grievances you have. They are unrelated to your previous post, however, and they do not cause outsourcing.

[Kay Soze]

Sorry he is not a republican and my company is such a huge Republican supporter that one of our last CEO's was appointed by W's dad to an ambassadorship.

I liked the outsourcing parties argument.

I read it somewhere and thought this would strike a nerve to effeiency/ pro move jobs offshore crowd.

[Luis Gonzalez]

There is no "pro move jobs offshore crowd", there are those who recognize the realities of the market CREATED by those very same IT guys complaining so loudly today.

It's poetic justice in a way, they created a technology that displaced tons of conventional jobs, from banking to reservation agents to yes...manufacturing. The technological advances created by IT workers improved efficiency, and reduced the number of people needed to accomplish many tasks.

Now, these IT guys are falling victim to their own accomplishments.

[Kay Soze]

I have a clintele that I sell to and IF it costs less to make my exact same product in a nation that;

1) does not have burdensome rules and regs and

2) has better trade agreements with other third party nation/buyers, than I'll shortly be selling IDENTICAL products made outside the US.

[TopQuark]

How about “outsourcing” elected positions to a more cost effective party?

This change constitutes OUTsourcing only if you are a Republican.

But you are correct in principle: when people switch their votes or formal party affiliation, that is what they do --- they pick the less costly/more profitable candidate. The benefits and costs are not measured by money alone, but you are correct in saying that this is what happens. Economists tell us the same thing.

We can prove that the current GOP admin has not been a cost efficient as the previous democratic one!

That's not as easy as you make it sound: the question of how to count costs and benefits is a tricky one. Moreover, it may not even be possible to do that for a group of people, that is, to move beyond a personal evaluation of the president.

So, you may want to substitute "we van prove" with "I believe."

[Luis Gonzalez]

K"We can prove that the current GOP admin has not been a cost efficient as the previous democratic one!"

Can you really?

Bush expenditures are only slightly higher than Clinton's as a percentage of the GDP...and Bill did not have to fight a global war. Reagan's and Bush I expenditures were significantly higher than both Clinton and Bush II.

Ronald Reagan defeated, and the Bush's have taken on militant radical Islam.

Bill got a blow job and cried about it on TV.

The argument that the previous administration was somehow more cost efficient than the current one is a pantload. Bill Clinton destroyed the military (remember the base closings, the deactivated divisions), and failed to replace one single piece of ordnance used in his quest to bury the Lewinski affair behind bombs.

Let me out in in simple terms.

If I am driving my car, and refuse to spend a dime maintaining it, you could say that I was more cost efficient because I did not spend any money. Of course, the car engine will eventually seize from lack of oil, water, or both, and then I will need a new car.

Clinton let the engine seize, and Bush had to buy a new car.

[TopQuark]

OK, and the point is... what exactly?

You have to make American labor attractive to companies. You can do that either by (i) keeping the money but being more productive, or (ii) being as productive as today but taking a pay cut.

There is a small readjustment going on, much like many we experienced for centuries: some jobs become extinct, and in some wages must drop. What's new is the noise about it. And the noise, in turn, is loud, because for the first time in our history anti-capitalism is mainstream. The left has won the dumbed-down masses. That's all.

[TopQuark]

I wish there were full-service gas stations left! I'd be willing to pay an extra nickle or dime a gallon to have someone else pump it. At the present price for labot that would be more than a dime. Especially because there are only few people who share your preference, and hte cost would be born by only these few.

At that level, you wouldn't want to pay for it either.

[Luis Gonzalez]

I have a truly radical notion.

We need to stir up up the stew again, like we did in 1938.

When the Fair Labor Act was passed in 1938, it was a radical notion, and an unprecedented restructuring of the American workforce.

Let's do it again.

Mandatory overtime after a 35 hour (or even a 30 hour) work week.

[Luis Gonzalez]

It is more than a dime a gallon, which ios why I don't do it all the time.

[TopQuark]

I have a truly radical notion.

Notion for what? What you propose is a measure against what?

[Luis Gonzalez]

It's a way to hire more workers by decreasing the work week.

It worked in 1938, and if we do it now, we may improve the quality of life for American families.

[Luis Gonzalez]

**PING**

[Dog Gone]

We couldn't eliminate outsourcing if we tried. What are we going to do, tell companies that they can't be global anymore? Gosh, that seems like a nosedive into a worldwide depression at mach speed.

I think the whole issue is an emotional one rather than a rational one. It's just amazing to me that we have many Freepers here who share the sentiments of the freaks who riot at WTO meetings.

Globalization is inevitable, and it's a good thing. Trade is a good thing. Having the most efficient producers producing goods and services is a good thing.

Yes, it sucks to lose your job. But if the economy is growing, something which all those good things listed above makes happen, you will find a new job if you only quit pouting and start looking. Keeping your skills sharp and relevant is critical. Being willing to start something completely different can be vital.

It's a brave new world where flexibility is the key to prosperity.

[Luis Gonzalez]

If you had a guess, what place would you say the US median income would fall into, in relation to the rest of the world?

[Dog Gone]

And people who have severe allergies triggered by odors (like my mom) would, too. I don't know of any full service stations , anywhere.

Last time I was in New Jersey, I hopped out of the rental car to refuel, and got yelled at. Apparently it's against the law to dispense your own gasoline there.

[dennisw]

It's my education that enables me to see through your posts.

What an amusing claim. I doubt you are one tenth as well read as Shermy or as well educated. I base this on the few hundred posts I've seen.

[Luis Gonzalez]

You also doubt that we landed on the moon, or that Elvis is dead.