Highly Qualified Teachers Need Not Apply -- Bush is trying to weaken teacher credentialing

The New Jersey Teachers Union ^ | President of the NJ Teachers Union

[Coleus]

And nothing about their wonder boy, Jimmy McGreevey, who promised them the world while campaigning and once in, has not increased educational aid.

Throughout our history, many parents with little education, home schooled their children (including those who later signed our declaration of Independence) or the had their child educated by religious schools, some presidents were homed schooled, wasn't Abraham Lincoln?

Many nuns in Catholic Schools did not have college degrees, but most do now. So what? For decades, Catholic Schools have been educating some of our more productive and successful citizens of this Great Country.

And who is to say that a piece of paper automaticly qualifies someone to teach? There are tons of teachers out there with piles of degrees who can't teach a thing.

[Amelia]

And who is to say that a piece of paper automaticly qualifies someone to teach? There are tons of teachers out there with piles of degrees who can't teach a thing.

True enough. So how would you determine who was and wasn't qualified? Do you have a method besides allowing them to experiment on students for a year or two? (Not good for the kids if that experiment is a failure, so it's nice to have something that might predict success....)

[Criminal Number 18F]

Here in FL, where we have had vouchers, only a small percentage of parents whose kids are eligible for vouchers actually used the vouchers and enrolled their kids in private schools. Why more parents did not, I don't know.

My limited experience, in just one year spent teaching, suggests that one reason many kids are failing is that their parents don't give a damn. Only a parent who gives a damn is going to jump through voucher hoops.

The funny thing is, if there are more schools opening up, public or private, there are probably more teacher jobs -- even if the new jobs are all non union, the union teachers will benefit because the municipalities will have to raise pay to hang on to teachers. This is trivial economics, but the unions don't get it. They actually believe their class-war nonsense. Or they really, deep down inside, believe that their members are overpaid, relative to their market value.

d.o.l.

Criminal Number 18F

[macrahanish #1]

The district where we live is very conservative and has a conservative, Christian superintendent.
I tracked the hours she's worked in the last six months. She's averaged 67 hours per week.

[summer]

The funny thing is, if there are more schools opening up, public or private, there are probably more teacher jobs -- even if the new jobs are all non union, the union teachers will benefit...

I agree with you. For one thing, there will less overcrowding in the schools.

I also agree with what you said about the parents.

[summer]

Why are they all ticked off at President Bush?

They all complain about a lack of funding with No Child Left Behind. That may be true, but I still say the GOP has done more to keep education on the front burner than the Dems ever did when they had the White House. That is yet another reason I am so reluctant to see a Dem in the White House now. I just get the feeling education will end up so far down the list, as it always seems to be when the Dems are in power. Yes, they have lunch with the teachers union president, but it seems to me that's about it.

[summer]

And actually, I didn't always feel that way - for a long time, I thought: education = Dems. But, that is just not true. The people coming up with new ideas to solve problems in education, and trying out new solutions, are the GOP leaders. The Dems are not offering new ideas or new solutions -- they just wish the GOP would shut up already, and that is not enough of a platform for me to support.

[summer]

I don't post very often here on FR, because of the yahoos, and how busy I am jumping through hoops for the College of Education, but whenever the discussion is about teaching, I tell the folks who think public schools are so rotten that if they know anything useful, they should go into teaching, and help fix it, instead of just griping about it! Mostly, if falls on deaf ears.

LOL...yes, sometimes that is true.

Old Student, thank you for your kind words to me elsewhere in your post, and for sharing your thoughts here. I greatly enjoyed reading what you said. You sound like you have a great deal to offer students, and I hope you let me know when you have graduated and get your classroom.

As for a teacher ping list, someone is now starting up a new teacher ping list, and I will ping that poster to you. This thread is full of teachers, so believe me, you should not feel lonely. :)

[summer]

Re posts #9 and #275 - P.O.E, Old Student wants to be on a teacher ping list. :)

[summer]

Oh, and the trick she played? She wrote her middle name instead of her first name and chuckled because she thought I wouldn't figure it out. Okay, not much of a joke to anyone else, but I was elated!

LOL... :)

[summer]

RE your post #271 - I'm glad you mentioned alternative routes to certification, because I meant to mention that in my earlier posts, about the other private school teachers at that one school who were from out of state. At the time I was talking about, there was not yet any alternative certification routes in FL, but, now, FL does have that.

[wai-ming]

teachers in private and religious schools receiving taxpayer-funded vouchers don’t even need to possess a college degree.

Notice the subtle jab at private schools and vouchers here.

I'm not suggesting that private schools hire unqualified instructors, but the idea of the government dictating the rules to private organizations that receive voucher money makes me uneasy.

What next? Will they start telling grocery stores that accept food stamps what they can and cannot sell?

[summer]

I'm also a retired Air Force Master Sergeant, with 24 years of service

PS Thank you for serving our country. :)

[summer]

I found some good information about the new salary career ladder for FL teachers -- scroll down to "BEST Career Ladder" and then click on under "Levels and Responsibilities" HERE.

[summer]

It's interesting that pay for this district will now range as much as $8,000 higher for some teachers. I think the districts were each allowed to come up with their own salary increases for this program.

[summer]

Here in FL, Gov Bush just announced a new reading program paid for by a private corporate sponsor, whereby the state will have an online "reading club" and discuss books. The new program is called Read Together, Florida, and Gov Bush writes about it here in his recent e-newsletter:

For those E-Newsletter recipients who have Adobe Acrobat reader, Governor Bush's e-newsletter is available in .PDF format by clicking HERE.

The text version of the e-newsletter is below.

MESSAGE FROM GOVERNOR BUSH

When was the last time you picked up a new book? Beginning in April, you'll have the perfect opportunity by participating in Florida's new statewide book club. This week's fourth annual Celebration of Reading Conference in Naples was a perfect forum for us to announce this latest chapter in Florida's reading success story.

"Read Together Florida" kicks off this April. It will create a statewide community of millions of Floridians reading the same book at the same time. We've selected one of my favorites, Zora Nearle Hurston's novel, "Their Eyes Were Watching God", as our featured book for the project.

We're encouraging Floridians to read this book, to share it with their friends, families, coworkers and others in a variety of discussion groups at Florida's public libraries, local bookstores, schools, and on the web. We're excited about the possibilities of this new initiative in bringing communities closer together while encouraging a love of reading among Floridians of all ages.

"Read Together Florida" is possible because of the generous sponsorship of Washington Mutual.

[summer]

I also noticed this from the article: Those lower qualifications will cost a lot less – meaning more profits for private voucher schools.

I had to laugh. Some private schools already pay a pittance, and can't possibly pay any less. So, obviously, that is not what is getting this union president upset. I think it is that this new law may somehow result in more teachers reaching those failing students, and, if it's a success, initiated by the GOP, that will not make the union happy.

I wish the teachers union would get out of politics altogether. Look how many teachers are on this thread. They all care about education, but I am sure none of them want to see any dues money paying for color political campaign brochures of Kerry. If the union would stick to education, they might attract more members.

[summer]

A little light bulb has just gone off in my head after thinking more about this thread. AS I said before, I think this new law is something GW has to do out of necessity. But, here is another way to look at it, again, out of necessity:

The old "private school" formula up to now has been this:

(1) the unique lure of the "better" student at private schools, enabled
(2) low teacher salaries by private schools, to be accepted by
(3) "highly qualified" teachers.

But, now, with voucher students from failing public schools moving into private schools, the new equation looks like this:

(1) NO more unique lure of the "better" student at private schools, BUT
(2) low teacher salaries by private schools continued, yet NOT now accepted by
(3) "highly qualified" teachers.

With the influx of voucher students, a "highly qualified" teacher at a private school accepting voucher students has a tough decision - because that teach can return to the public schools for far more pay if that qualified teacher wants the challenge of the kind of student that will now be showing up at private schools.

So, something in the equation HAS to change. But what? The students from failing public schools will still be students from failing schools. The low salaries from private schools will still be low. But what kind of teachers will accept this combination of both low salaries AND the student you find in a failing public school? Not "highly qualified" teachers - they can teach those kind of kids in public schools for a much better salary.

Consequently, the change has to come from who is allowed to teach those voucher kids in a private school setting. And, the teacher applicant pool, as I initially mentioned, has to be open to more people.

Because the only other possible change now would have been:

Private schools now significantly increase their pay scales to continue to attract "highly qualified" teachers for this new influx of voucher students. But, private schools will not do this. Some private schools already make a fortune and will not raise teacher salaries.

And, here's what perhaps should have happened a long time ago - if the union really cared about teachers and imporving teacher pay, instead of politics - the union should have already tried to unionize all the private school teachers.

But, now, it's too late, because those new private school teachers, without college degress, may be more than happy with whatever pay they earn teaching these voucher students. Because these teachers, without college degress, have no choice - they can not go in the public schools to teach.

Meanwhile, more "highly qualified" teachers may now exit the private schools, and go teach in the public schools because: there will be less of a difference between the students populations of public schools and those private schools now accepting voucher students.

The unique selling point the private school now has in luring a "highly qualified" public school teacher on staff will not exist anymore. But the private school still has to hire someone.

[P.O.E.]

Thanks!

O.S. - I try to keep the pings down to a minimum - maybe one a day, if that.

Good luck in your studies.

[Triple Word Score]

How many really good teachers did you have during your K-12 years? I had about a dozen who were good to excellent, and two or three who made a huge impression on me. Most of the rest were mediocre for various reasons--burn-out, lack of talent, inexperience, personal problems, or professional conflicts. A few were really bad--undisciplined, immoral, creepy. Two of my teachers (JROTC) had a fist fight in front of a class. I had a Driver's Ed teacher who openly favored cute blondes who would sit in his lap or on his desk. I had some teachers who were stupid or ignorant. In one history class, we just watched films on Aztec History the whole time. I don't think we ever took an exam or wrote a paper. He didn't intervene with horseplay or stop any of us from doing anything we wanted. He was just babysitting.

I think the good-to-bad teacher ratio has remained fairly constant over the years in the public schools, and for the most part we have to take the good with the bad. I went to good schools and still had lousy teachers. It wasted my time, sure, but one good teacher can make up for a bunch of lousy ones when it comes to stimulating a lifelong love of learning and the ability to think critically.