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Plan to Shift Bases Shakes Up Allies
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| Dec. 15, 2003
| Jamie Dettmer
Posted on 12/15/2003 7:03:43 PM PST by Tailgunner Joe
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Russia Feeling Jealous of American Influence Dec. 15, 2003
By Jamie Dettmer
Before 9/11 few would have forecast that Moscow might give the green light for the United States to station troops and establish bases in any of the five oil-rich and turbulent states of Central Asia - what the Russians jealously like to call the "Near Abroad." But when hijacked airliners were slammed into the World Trade Center towers and the Pentagon they turned the world upside down. Russian cooperation came quickly with President Vladimir Putin deciding to help solve several U.S. logistical problems in its plan to strike at Afghanistan and approving the basing of U.S. forces in the states of Tajikistan, Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan for search-and-rescue missions and special operations.
But the Kremlin elicited a pledge that the U.S. presence in the independent but heavily Russian-influenced Central Asian states would be only temporary, say Moscow sources. Now the U.S. presence looks to be a semipermanent one, and the leaders of Tajikistan, Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan have been keen to work both sides of the fence. According to Kremlin sources, Putin has encouraged the Central Asian leaders to tell the Americans that it is time to go, but the responses he has received have been ambiguous at best.
In a bid to restore some of Moscow's lost influence in the region, the Kremlin secured agreement earlier this year from Kyrgyzstan President Askar Akayev to establish an air base in his country at Kant. In October, the base was opened - a mere 20 miles from the U.S. air base at Manas. Putin insisted that the Russian facility is not meant to compete with the U.S. base. "One base will complement the other," he said.
That isn't the way some Russian commentators see it. Military analyst Alexander Golts says there is little military logic to the base at Kant. "Political symbolism is more important than military significance," he explains.
To: Tailgunner Joe
If Russia made arrangements with Mexico to build a military base in Monterey, Mexico, for the purpose of forward staging in case of turmoil in South America, would the US protest?
2
posted on
12/15/2003 7:35:02 PM PST
by
gcruse
(http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
To: gcruse
Damn right. I'm far from a bleeding heart, but I don't see any reason to poke the bear in the eye.
3
posted on
12/15/2003 7:49:24 PM PST
by
expatpat
To: Tailgunner Joe
I would not be surprised to see the Philippines become a sort of unsinkable aircraft carrier.
The Philippines-USA relationship is more than 50 years old and Filipinos have a great aversion to dictators and Muslim terrorists.
4
posted on
12/15/2003 8:05:28 PM PST
by
ikka
To: gcruse
If Russia made arrangements with Mexico to build a military base in Monterey, Mexico, for the purpose of forward staging in case of turmoil in South America, would the US protest?
I suppose you've never heard of Cuba.
5
posted on
12/15/2003 8:08:56 PM PST
by
Asclepius
(karma vigilante)
To: gcruse
If Russia made arrangements with Mexico to build a military base in Monterey, Mexico, for the purpose of forward staging in case of turmoil in South America, would the US protest?Maybe we can subcontract the Russians out and get them to patrol the Mexico-USA border for us since our "leaders" don't seem to be doing too great of a job defending our country.
6
posted on
12/15/2003 8:10:44 PM PST
by
xrp
To: Asclepius
I suppose you've never heard of Cuba.
Russia was our enemy then. Are you saying the US and Russia
are now where the US and the USSR were?
7
posted on
12/15/2003 8:12:53 PM PST
by
gcruse
(http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
To: xrp
I like it. The Russians have more recent experience at real border control. I'd gladly pay.
8
posted on
12/15/2003 8:13:57 PM PST
by
gcruse
(http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
To: Asclepius
Also, Russia not longer supports or has bases in Cuba.
9
posted on
12/15/2003 8:15:44 PM PST
by
gcruse
(http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
To: Tailgunner Joe
"... some of its oldest allies, including Germany" Here's that same LIE again!! Can they be so ignorant to not know about Germany in 1917-1918 or 1941-1945? No they can't. It's simply a LIE told so so big that they think you will not notice. Germany was quite possibly America's biggest adversary for the whole first half of the 20th Century! Germany is not in any way shape or form an "old ally."
10
posted on
12/15/2003 8:19:14 PM PST
by
FreedomCalls
(It's the "Statue of Liberty," not the "Statue of Security.")
To: Tailgunner Joe
Welcome to Krzesiny airfield
11
posted on
12/15/2003 8:30:29 PM PST
by
kaiser80
(You are most welcome)
To: gcruse
"Russia was our enemy then. Are you saying the US and Russia are now where the US and the USSR were?"
But isn't your first question based on this exact premise? Decide which point you want to debate from before you ask for answers.
To: gcruse
Besides, Polish women are some of the most beautiful in the world. Our armed forces deserve the best!
To: kaiser80
Some paint scheme!
The Polish Tyzghkijyrs?
14
posted on
12/15/2003 8:44:15 PM PST
by
okie01
(www.ArmorforCongress.com...because Congress isn't for the morally halt and the mentally lame.)
To: okie01
:) yes, that's tygrys (tiger)
15
posted on
12/15/2003 8:55:27 PM PST
by
kaiser80
To: flashbunny
But isn't your first question based on this exact premise?
Decide which point you want to debate from before you ask for answers.
What premise? I asked if we would object to Russia doing what we are doing in Eastern Europe, ie, establishing bases in countries in their back yard over which they have no control.
16
posted on
12/15/2003 8:56:39 PM PST
by
gcruse
(http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
To: gcruse
...your premise being that we still have some sort of cold war animosity left over between us and russia - which is also a theoretical question based on the false assumption that they are something other than the militarily weak (except for nuclear) power that they now are.
So you pose a question based on two false premises - that there is some sort of cold war still going on, and that russia actually would be able to put some credible military force near our borders. Then someone comes up with an historical analogy, and you say, hey, no fair, that's old news - while all you're doing is trying to start a debate on facts that are no longer accurate. Sorta like having your cake and eating it, too, but not exactly.
And what the hell does it matter what russia thinks? We would be putting troops in sovereign countries - they no longer hold any power over these former bloc countries. Maybe that's what they're afraid of - a final nail in their coffin of former 'greatness'. The only question is why are you afraid of it, and why do you give a damn what russia thinks?
To: gcruse
Okay...picture the US of present strength...now picture us having less than a tenth of our current power. That's the bargaining position the Russains are in. For God's sake can someone PLEASE start acting like it was us who won the Cold War and not them!
I think its time for the Russians to sit down, shut up and recognize the limits of their power.
To: gcruse
No, we'd go belly up and let them have Mexico like we did with Cuba, maybe sell out any Mexicans that didn't like it, like we did the Cubans.
19
posted on
12/15/2003 9:59:18 PM PST
by
piasa
(Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
To: gcruse
Russia promised to get out of Lourdes in Cuba, but then changed its mind.
20
posted on
12/15/2003 10:01:15 PM PST
by
piasa
(Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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