Cruel Joke or Medical Anomaly?

UM List ^ | Tim Wilkins

[scripter]

A see a little misdirection and misrepresentation is your normal MO. In reference to homosexuals leaving the lifestyle, on what basis do you deny the validity?

[scripter]

Argh. "A see" = "I see".

[xzins]

Nonetheless, I have a higher regard for those who include their references than for those who don't.

The one side at least is allowing me the opportunity to go check for myself.

[scripter]

The one side at least is allowing me the opportunity to go check for myself.

That's not good enough. Apparently some folks believe we need someone to tell us what is valid and what isn't. We can't check for ourselves.

[RobbyS]

Except the "Old Testament" of the Jews--which was adopted by the Protestants --ignores most of the Jewish religious literature generated after the return from the Babylonian exile. The Catholic canon fills in which of this gap.

[Paul C. Jesup]

A see a little misdirection and misrepresentation is your normal MO. In reference to homosexuals leaving the lifestyle, on what basis do you deny the validity?

Peer pressure. I could turn your entire statement around and point out that SOME hetrosexual men and women will develop homosexuals tredancies over the course of a long period of time in a all single sex enviroment. But if you take them back to a enviroment that is not single sex, they will go back to being hetrosexual.

Now will you answer the questions I ASKED you.

[scripter]

Peer pressure? I certainly didn't expect that response so perhaps my question wasn't very clear. Peer pressure from what? Organizations to list claims with questionable validity or peer pressure to leave the homosexual lifestyle?

Are you familiar with any of the organizations that help homosexuals leave the lifestyle? Have you read any of the links under the homosexual help category I've listed? Before I forget: What's your question?

[little jeremiah]

I think we agree more than we disagree, and I apologize if I was jumping the gun. I am very used to seeing people post ill-informed opinions on the topic of homosexual attractions and behaviors, often with the ulterior motive of promoting the gay agenda.

There is a verse in the Book of Jeremiah (can't remember it word for word, not being a scholar) but it says something about the human heart being deceitful and prone to wickedness. Homosexual acts are, as you pointed out, just one of those forms of wickedness - there are so many more. But the attempt of the gay activists and their supporters (usually leftists) to force "tolerance" on everyone else is really just a form of indoctrination, and it normalizes all kinds of sexual deviancy and immorality, thus effectively destroying the value of monogamous marriage and the real meaning of family. And they have stated that this is their objective.

And normalizing same sex acts doesn't help those who are attracted to such behavior, as now there is a false concept of homosexual "identity" - meaning that a person with such desires cannot change. And this is the real reason so many homosexuals suffer from depression, anxiety, elevated levels of alcohol and drug use, attempt suicide, and so on. If they knew that being a "homosexual" is not their real identity, that many have changed and they can too - this would give many suffering people hope. Instead, this avenue is closed to many due to the media, government, and so on parroting the gay activists' lies.

[little jeremiah]

Anyway, he was a genius who understood more about human nature than you or I.

Speak for yourself, dude.

Anyone - so-called genius or no - who succumbs to the desire for same sex sodomy, does NOT know more about human nature than I do.

[Paul C. Jesup]

Speak for yourself, dude.

Anyone - so-called genius or no - who succumbs to the desire for same sex sodomy, does NOT know more about human nature than I do.

He had enough intellegence and morals to not entrust his designs for weapons to the immoral governments of that day. That is why he created his codex.

[Paul C. Jesup]

And what is your definition of "help"?

[Pan_Yans Wife]

ping

[little jeremiah]

I'm not saying Leonardo was an evil person or had no morals! I don't understand what kind of box you're trying to place me in.

I have great respect for his intellect and his artistic ability. I'm just saying he wasn't perfect, and the fact that he succumbed to his perverted desires for same sex sodomy a bad character flaw, and proves that he didn't know more about human nature than I do.

You're welcome to say that he knew more about human nature than you do, but you have no basis to say that about my knowledge of human nature!

Geez!

[little jeremiah]

And what is your definition of "help"?

I realize this question was not directed at me, but since this is a free forum open to the public, and we've all been discussing this topic, I have a couple of questions for you.

1. You must know that scripter's links to help for homosexuals means help to overcome or heal their same sex desires. Why do you pretend that you don't know what help for homosexuals means?

2. Why don't you state your position on homosexuality? Do you consider same sex acts morally neutral, healthy and good, immoral, unhealthy, or what? Or are you confused and trying to figure it out? Where on the spectrum do you stand? If you aren't honest, then there's no point in trying to have an honest conversation or debate about it.

[Paved Paradise]

I do not believe people are born homosexual. I am not going to go into all the reasons why I do not believe this; suffice to say however that I also do not believe that many of these people feel that they made a "choice." I have always believed that due to an experience or experiences, and other external stimulii, that they may have feelings and then make conclusions based upon these feelings. I believe many heterosexual people have also had similar feelings at one time or another but never acted upon them, and perhaps may have even been disgusted and surprised that they even had feelings or thoughts like that. However, I also believe that we are living in a fallen world. God doesn't make mistakes. I believe that too. BUT.... He has allowed many, many rather horrible things to occur. How else do you explain Siamese twins, hermaphrodites, chimeras, and other such odd phenoms. God has MADE these people too. There are too many examples to list them all but I think homosexual tendences, among other things, are a sign of an imperfect world, one that sin entered into when Adam ate the fruit offered by Eve.

Thanks for the interesting post though.

[Paul C. Jesup]

I'm not saying Leonardo was an evil person or had no morals! I don't understand what kind of box you're trying to place me in.

The Codex, the book Leonardo wrote in code that had the designs for his various inventions.

I have great respect for his intellect and his artistic ability. I'm just saying he wasn't perfect, and the fact that he succumbed to his perverted desires for same sex sodomy a bad character flaw, and proves that he didn't know more about human nature than I do.

I can think of worse character flaws a person might have, like arrogance.

[little jeremiah]

What the ?????

Your "answers" to my questions (and you didn't answer the other two) do not make a particle of sense.

Arrogance is worse than same sex sodomy? Well, it all depends on how the arrogance is displayed and acted upon. Actually, even then, same sex sodomy trumps arrogance as a character defect. It is an act, whereas arrogance is a state of mind, and often a person who is striving to be a better person will not act or speak out of arrogance, even if they percieve it in their own heart. In other words, it can be conquered. But to act on a sinful or immoral desire is much worse. No doubt, arrogance can be the seed which sprouts into all manner of evil acts. But it can't be compared with the act of sodomy, you're comparing a deed with a state of mind.

BTW, if you can't/don't answer my other questions, there's no point in any more responding to you.

[Bryan24]

Human being are "at the top" of the evolutionary chain, correct?

How is it then, that humans are among the most fragile of all the mammals?

Survival of the fittest (the backbone of evolution), would argue that humans are several magnitudes beyond any naturally occuring evolution.

[insanitor]

There are a lot of heterosexual men who believe that they were "made to have sex with more than one woman", so since they are not homosexuals, and yet having sex with more than one woman is defined as a sin by the bible, the premise of this thread may not need apply to only homosexuals, per se.

[Paul C. Jesup]

Well, it all depends on how the arrogance is displayed and acted upon. Actually, even then, same sex sodomy trumps arrogance as a character defect.

I don't know what you are on, but arrogance has lead to more human suffer throughout human history than anything else. Tell that to the victims of Julius Caesar, Nero, Caligula, Napoleon, Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, the Clintons; yes some of these people had homosexual leanings, but most of them didn't.