Posted on 12/01/2003 7:38:02 AM PST by Holly_P
Your choice. I would not presume to choose for you, nor try to force upon you a helmet with less protective value than you'd feel comfortable with. But I don't care at all for *Darth Vader* helmets with lower face crosspieces.
Beyond that, what types of forces to the head and neck are most prevalent in bike accidents? I don't know. I do know that one of the biggest dangers is to the brain, and that's what modern MC helmets are designed to try to prevent, by reducing the acclerations experienced by the skull, thus keeping the brain from slapping up against the inside of the skull.
See following. It starts out:
It was on a flawless spring morning, May 5, 1985, that Larry McAfee, a 29-year-old mechanical engineer, decided, on an impulse, to take his motorcycle for a ride with friends on the mountain roads north of his suburban Atlanta home. Hours later, traveling no more than 10 m.p.h., he hit a curve, fell, and as his head snapped back, the base of his helmet crushed his top two vertebrae (as in Figure #2).Consider that in many ejection seats, the pilot ejects THROUGH the plexiglass bubble canopy cover, as a cannon shell shoots him through the bubble. The seat design is supposed to clear his way through it, but sometimes things don't break away as planned, or icing or battle damage adds problems beyond *routine* emergency ejections. And so he wears a helmet, a rather expensive one, and heavy both for the protection it has to deliver and the radio and other electronical equipment built in.
"There was not another mark on him," says Larry's mother, Amelia.
Yet in that split second, the 6'6", 240-lb. McAfee, an avid outdoorsman, hunter and fledgling parachutist, had sustained what the medical profession calls a "complete injury," one that would leave him permanently paralyzed from the neck down -- unable to walk, eat or even breathe again unaided.
You look around, You'll find plenty of bike helmets with an arched neck relief. But you'll also find way too many without it.
I wonder, too, if an impact to the head big enough to break your neck while wearing one of those helmets (like the three fullface models in the top row) would do your head a pretty big injury?
It doesn't take an impact at all. Just the inertia of a backward parachute landing fall during a windy day landing was enough to snap the spine of one Kansas skydiver I knew. He landed in soft sand, and the imprints of his heels and three points of contact- not including his head- were clearly visable and he hadn;t been dragged an inch. His helmet left a clear imprint where it had struck the ground to his right side AFTER the damage to his neck had been done, and he no longer had control of his body.
So many questions, so few answers. Do you have any links to any unbiased sources of information on this subject? i.e. not ABATE, not the Snell foundation.
The Air Force school of aerospace medicine had some pretty good data on helmets worn during ejection seat work, not directly related to motorcycle use, but close. And the DOT and NTSB refusal to certify or specify *approved* helmets suggests that they're comprised of legislation-writers and extortionists, not technicians with any background in such things. Indeed, a lack of real scientific data has been the cause for several states findings that helmet laws were unconstitutional in their particular state.
There MIGHT be some worthwhile foreign studies....
-archy-/-
All asphalt-based bike racers I'm familiar with wear fullface helmets. And while I've often seen them fall and hit their heads and get up and walk away, broken necks seem to be very rare. http://usff.com/hldl/report/3rdEditiona.html#R302
There may be some public interest in prohibiting the sale of helmets that cause worse injuries, or at least from mislabeling them as *safety* helmets. And there are public liability lawsuit questions also associated with such equipment so mislabeled, which may be a matter of some public interest, if only to prevent clogging up the courts with such cases.
In general, I prefer to see the marketplace take care of such things. But that's kind of hard on those who think they're buying safety equipment, and are instead buying the very instrument of their own destruction.
-archy-/-
There may be some public interest in prohibiting the sale of helmets that cause worse injuries, or at least from mislabeling them as *safety* helmets. And there are public liability lawsuit questions also associated with such equipment so mislabeled, which may be a matter of some public interest, if only to prevent clogging up the courts with such cases.
In general, I prefer to see the marketplace take care of such things. But that's kind of hard on those who think they're buying safety equipment, and are instead buying the very instrument of their own destruction.
-archy-/-
Oh, brudda... In that case, let's start by mandating the national speed limit at 25 MPH, 15 MPH, or even ZERO. At zero, we'll see an added benefit. Our oil consumption will fall dramatically, such that we won't be funding terrorists anymore!
Maybe I am oversimplifying.
You are. What is pretty simple is the ability to design and manufacture some general, light duty helmets capable of at least some protection, at least at city speed limit levels. Change the levels of impact into those when the rider's machime is hit by a 50-ton semitrailer truck at combined speeds of 100mph or greater- which can be survivable- and a very different degree of stresses are involved.
In my accident in which a helmet did me some good, a construction worker's hardhat or military Kevlar K-Pot or MICH helmet likely would have sufficed. When a roadracer goes down on a course, or a racing hydroplane boat driver's boat lets go, it's a whole different story. And there WILL be those who want the very best they can get, based either on their experience, or just a desire for cutting-edge state-of-the-art equipment.
Dated info. Florida's 25-year-old helmet law was declared unconstitutionally vague back in 1995. The result is as follows:
As of 12:01 AM on July 01, 2000, Florida became the 30th state to allow motorcyclists to ride without a helmet. However, the amendment to HB1911 is far from a repeal of the helmet law but rather a modification of s.316.211. HB1911 was signed into law by Governor Jeb Bush on June 16, 2000.
316.211 Equipment for motorcycle and moped riders.-- Effective July 1, 2000
(1) A person may not operate or ride upon a motorcycle unless the person is properly wearing protective headgear securely fastened upon his or her head which complies with Federal Motorcycle Vehicle Safety Standard 218 promulgated by the United States Department of Transportation. The Department of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles shall adopt this standard by agency rule.
(2) A person may not operate a motorcycle unless the person is wearing an eye-protective device over his or her eyes of a type approved by the department.
(3) (a) This section does not apply to persons riding within an enclosed cab or to any person 16 years of age or older who is operating or riding upon a motorcycle powered by a motor with a displacement of 50 cubic centimeters or less or is rated not in excess of 2 brake horsepower and which is not capable of propelling such motorcycle at a speed greater than 30 miles per hour on level ground.
(b) Notwithstanding subsection (1), a person over 21 years of age may operate or ride upon a motorcycle without wearing protective headgear securely fastened upon his or her head if such person is covered by an insurance policy providing for at least $10,000 in medical benefits for injuries incurred as a result of a crash while operating or riding on a motorcycle.
(4) A person under 16 years of age may not operate or ride upon a moped unless the person is properly wearing protective headgear securely fastened upon his or her head which complies with Federal Motorcycle Vehicle Safety Standard 218 promulgated by the United States Department of Transportation.
(5) The department shall make available a list of protective headgear approved in this section, and the list shall be provided on request.
(6) A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a nonmoving violation as provided in chapter 318.
No problem. It would save one life to take that woman and string her up from a utility pole, thence building a raging bonfire beneath her.
Indeed, it could save the many lives of those who may otherwise perish in the next national civil war, and who can profit by the example of the roasting bluenose pecksniff. Or several of the same sort.
-archy-/-
Thousands of people fall and die every year in their houses. I'm simply not superstitious about safety equipment. There is no end to where that supersitition can take you. When it's my time to die there is nothing I can do to prevent it.
LOL, street bikes are death traps.
I've had three Harleys and a mess of other street bikes.
Gave them up some years ago. Too damn dangerous, to many close calls, especially in the bigger cities.
Now I still have some dirt bikes we ride in the high country and out in the high desert, but at least if you go down there, you generally just get scraped or bruised if that.
Go down on a street bike, and get ran over by five cars, after impacting concrete, curbs, or broadsided by 5000 pound cars. It's lights out quick.
Street bikes are just too damn dangerous for me.
After your busted up, turned into raw meat and dog food, the motorist will always say, " I just didn't see him officer"......
If others want to ride in the streets with fast moving 5,000 hammers, fine, just not me......
oh baloney. No way are you going to convince me that a helmet has a lower coefficient of friction against asphalt than the typical hair and skin covered human head. I've crashed and landed directly on my forehead/face wearing a full faced Shoei RF700. It definitely slid. I wish I still had it so I could show y'all a picture. Thanks to that helmet, I still have my original equipment face. My dirt bike helmet slides great and has yet to shatter as I have tested it numerous times. Quit trying to twist phyisics to back your goofy and disengenuous helmets-will-hurt-you-in-a-getoff arguments. If you like not wearing a helmet for comfort, style and other reasons just say so. I understand and I back your right to go helmetless if you choose (as I do on rare occasions). But save the BS about helmets causing more damage than they prevent.
by the way how does one get on a "ping" list?
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