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Nothing to Lose But Their Chains (Ledeen)
Spectator ^ | 11/20/03 | Michael Ledeen

Posted on 11/20/2003 1:00:56 PM PST by freedom44

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To: Stultis
And we did have such help. Without French aid- there never would have been a United States. Without the French Fleet at Yorktown- Cornwallis never would have played "The world turned upside down" when marching into surrender.

But look what happened in France after they incurred the huge expense of supporting our forces and waring with Britain? Their Monarchy fell to bloody radicals and Europe was tossed into a malestrom of blood for 20 years. The bill for foreign engagements is always paid for on the Domestic front and it is almost never good.

101 posted on 11/21/2003 2:41:42 PM PST by Burkeman1 ((If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.))
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To: Burkeman1
We support the corrupt elites against the people. We say one dictator is bad while another is good. In short- the people of the Muslem world are against us and it is them that we fear- not our puppets or payed for elites.

True, but it is the much derided "neocon" types that have been working (not just lately, but for a good quarter century or so) to change this attitude and approach. Also some "mainstream" conservatives like Gingrich who want to purge and overhaul the U.S. State Department (which is the primary institutional advocate of the policies you describe).

102 posted on 11/21/2003 2:42:08 PM PST by Stultis
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To: Stultis
The neocons have a certain idealism that one can admire if still think pure folly. And I am no fan of the "realpolitik" people either. Good "trade" relations with all no "political" relations with any. I see the USA as a Beacon or example- not as an enforcer or policeman.
103 posted on 11/21/2003 2:46:22 PM PST by Burkeman1 ((If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.))
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To: Stultis
But another problem. In Eastern Europe and even Russia- they had been exposed to Western Democratic thought before they became Communist. Even in Russia- hand written translations of the Federalist papers were passed around like some golden secret. Radio free Europe and the BBC were listened too secretly and with a passion. In short the peoples under the boot of Soviet Communism craved Western thought on Democracy, limited government, free markets, rule of law. They soaked it up. Why- becasue their cultures had at least been exposed to it once before and it was in their cultural blood.

This is not the case in the Muslem world. The oppressed radicals don't pass around copies of the Federalist papers in Egypt or in Algeria. They don't seek to understand the rule of law or Western jurisprudence. They believe they are oppressed and look back into the history of their own culture to find salvation - in Islam- in warped notions of Islam, yes- but they don't look westward for their salvation as those who lived under Communism did.

104 posted on 11/21/2003 3:02:48 PM PST by Burkeman1 ((If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.))
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To: Stultis
Return the boat to proper authority.
105 posted on 11/21/2003 9:06:16 PM PST by Burkeman1 ((If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.))
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