Bush declares war on immigrant cleaning ladies

The Hill ^ | October 29, 2003 | Dick Morris

[what's up]

I sincerely doubt that he/she has done anything in the minister department for anyone let alone illegals, one only has to look at his/her posts to see that he/she is using some pretty un-Christian tactics.

Yes, it seems Paul Klenk may be a fraud. Telling everyone to extend ministry to illegals, yet he does not seem to have personal experience in that area himself.

Beware of people who do not give credit where credit is due. He demands mercy of America yet will not credit America with the mercy they have given illegals all these years.

Many Christians like this guy do not recognize justice as an attribute of God's character. Seems to be they are imbalanced individuals. Must go...Have a good day.

[CyberAnt]

What is it about ILLEGAL that people find so offensive. If an American tried to sneak into another foreign country, the American would be arrested. Why do we have to treat people differently ..?? I just cannot understand that. We are not responsible for the living conditions in Mexico which drive these people north. Why is America expected to pick up the tab for this ..??

California is in dire financial straights because of all the ILLEGAL people who come here for a free handout, free schooling for their children, free housing, free food, free medical care. I'm paying the bill for all this FREE stuff. While these people may work - they send their money back to Mexico.

[Just another Joe]

You have challenged other people to come up with a workable solution.
What is your workable solution that will not inundate us with more and more illegal immigrants?

How much of a drain do you think illegal immigrants put on our health care, welfare, social, medicare, etc systems? How much, compared to that, would it be to deport the illegal immigrants to their country of origin? I think it would be a lot cheaper to give them a plane ticket and tell them, "Don't come back".
They are here illegaly. More come across the border every day unimpeded. How hard would it be for a group of terrorists to do the same? Can you say that you would know the difference between a Mexican sympathizer of Hezbollah and a Mexican wanting a job cleaning gas station restrooms?

The borders need some type of actual security that will stop the illegal immigrants from coming. The ones that are here need to be deported.

If I had all the answers I wouldn't be a no name, I'd be one of President Bush's advisors.

[StarFan]

I think everyone speaking a common language is about saying that regardless of where our ancestors come from, this is something we will share as a nation... It does not have to be a law but it needs to be understood...

That is, by far, the best argument I've heard to enforce ENGLISH ONLY. I disagree that it not become law lest we continue to have the government spending $$$ translating documents from English and department stores permitting employees to count change in a foreign language.

[paulklenk]

You pose a good question. Let me answer it the best I can:

First, I am not suggesting that people break the law, or ignore the laws on the books. What I am saying is this:

We do have an immigration problem, particularly with illegal Mexicans. We have laws that few are enforcing. Our country is gaining a lot of economic advantage from the status quo. In other words, a lot of people are using cheap, illegal labor.

On the other side, we have a lot of people whining about it, but not offering real solutions. They just harp on all those foreigners, and they sound like bigots when they do -- even when they're not trying to be bigoted, they come across that way.

Any talk of amnesty or other compromises riles these people up even more. But again, apart from shouting "Deport! Deport!" they really don't address the economic and practical ramifications of deporting millions of people.

I am suggesting that we radically change our immigration, particularly with respect to Mexico, which is sending us the most illegals right now. We need to find ways to make it just as easy to immigrate legally as it is illegally, and find a way to reward these people to give them an incentive to use the new system. Don't know what that system would look like, but I'd like to see some lawmakers tackle it.

Now, the Pat Buchanan's of this world may not like my ideas, but I am happy to say that few Americans pay attention to what Pat is saying, either, so we're even.

[dwd1]

I guess the question would be can you enforce the same regulations that you have re:Air Traffic Controllers and Pilots for International Flights... I think they have to learn and speak English...

If you pass the cost of translation on to the person in need of the translation, you would see English as a Second Language Enrollment skyrocket...

It is like the Advanced Cooking Classes in Paris... I believe the classes are given in French and less advanced classes are available in a variety of languages but at the top level... Oui, Oui, Monsieur!!!

It is funny how we take hits for doing what so many other countries consider standard and acceptable policy...

[XJarhead]

Nicely said. The stereotype that all illegals are freeloaders, or are taking jobs away from Americans, isn't true. I also agree that I'd like to find a way for those types of illegals to stay here legally. Unfortunately, the current system doesn't do that. That's why I'd be in favor of some form of amnesty that contains a work requirement.

[dwd1]

Ein, Zwei, Drei, Vier... Schöne tag, mein herr...

Funny rumor I heard one time (I think George III spoke only German) was that there was a vote on whether the language in the colonies would be German or English and English won by one vote...

Mein liebe Gott! Ist dar wahr?
My dear God! Is that true?

[paulklenk]

Thanks -- we have to find a solution, and it sounds like you're thinking of some yourself.

[PigRigger]

"Bush declares war on immigrant cleaning ladies"

Glad they finally picked up old Maddy.

[dwd1]

Devil is in the details but I think that would be the fairest way to go... Problem is there is not enough political will to do so... Also, what happens afterward?... After the amnesty, will there then be strict enforcement or will we go through this again when say the people that are here illegally wanting the same thing are from China, Africa, or Haiti? As I said, devil is in the details....

Truth is too many people (whether they want to admit it or not) are OK with the status quo because the upside of breaking the immigration laws by US companies and the people they hire surpass the sanctions they are exposed too... Choosing the lesser of two difficult choices... Higher labor cost vs profit... Job in US versus starvation... No easy choices....

[The Westerner]

I hear you, Paul. My former housekeeper kept an attorney on retainer for thousands of dollars. After about 10 years he said he couldn't help her. The immigration process is totally broken! It is slow, and causes the poor immigrant to use their surplus money for shady lawyers...money that she wanted to use to buy a home. These are hardworking people, not some deadbeats.

[paulklenk]

My former housekeeper kept an attorney on retainer for thousands of dollars. After about 10 years he said he couldn't help her.

What is really sad is, it is quite possible that the lawyer knew all this time there was nothing he could do. He quite possibly took her money for ten years and finally told her it wasn't worth it. He probably could have told her the bad news years ago. I know this from experience when I naively tried to help a Russian girl find a lawyer. I tell you, if she weren't dating someone, I'd ask her to marry me today and solve her whole immigration problem.

[StarFan]

Please name me one Senator who can write a bill that will accomplish that?

Therein lies the problem and either our complaints are falling on deaf ears or, I suspect, many are relying on the lone voice of Tancredo to get the message out.

We must fax, write or call and ask our representative where they stand on amnesty; on our open border policy; on foreign-issued ID cards; on cutting federal funding to cities that have 'santuary' laws (violating federal law) that prohibit local police from reporting illegal aliens to federal authorities, and if they will vote to abolish federal requirements to provide foreign-language ballots. The ability to speak, read and write basic English is a REQUIREMENT to become a naturalized citizen (press #1 for English doesn't foster that goal) and only U.S. citizens are eligible to vote.

In short, let them know we are informed voters who demand answers. Perhaps a baby step but one heading in the right direction, IMHO.

[paulklenk]

You have a lot of great ideas. Holding our representatives accountable is a great start to learn more about the complexities of the issues, and where the best opportunities are for legislation we can really support.

[XJarhead]

One gripe we seem to hear is that people don't want to pay for illegals. A legit beef. And the reality is that some Supreme Court decisions make it difficult to deny certain benefits. I'd support something like the following:

1) A constitutional amendment permitting governments to condition economic/social benefits on citizenship and/or legal status. No more obligation to educate the children of illegals, for example.

2) A legal residency program of maybe 7 years or so, during which the person could remain in the U.S. if they were actively employed for a certain percentage of that time. They'd have limited or even no eligibility for social service benefits.

3) at the end of seven years, they could apply for citizenship. 4) Consideration is made to linking the program to an amnesty. So people could stay, but they wouldn't be able to soak off the government, other than having their children be permitted to go to school if their parents are legal. They'd be net contributors to the government coffers. If they go without work for an extended period, knowingly assist illegals to stay here, or violate other rules, they get bounced back.

The effect of that might be to keep those illegals here who really are interested in working, let them become legal, and more tightly control future immigration. And by cutting back on entitlement to social services, you discourage the freeloaders from entering.

[VeritatisSplendor]

not new shingles. a new roof. the plywood had delaminated; the rafters were undersized -no mcmansion here.

Mrs VS

[VeritatisSplendor]

not new shingles. a new roof. the plywood had delaminated; the rafters were undersized -no mcmansion here.

Mrs VS

[paulklenk]

Those are some good ideas.