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Can A Progressive Be Convinced By Facts?
Manhattan Contrarian ^ | 22 Nov, 2021 | Francis Menton

Posted on 11/22/2021 4:00:13 AM PST by MtnClimber

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To: ConservativeDude

“the only way out of this, given the reality you just described, is to loosen the political bands that connect us.”

Agreed

National Divorce is the answer.

No Civil War - just Civil Separation
Choose Freedom - Choose Peace


41 posted on 11/22/2021 5:55:41 AM PST by Macoozie (Handcuffs and Orange Jumpsuits)
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To: MtnClimber

“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired.” Jonathon Swift (1721)

In other words… It is futile to reason someone out of a thing that he was not reasoned into in the first place.


42 posted on 11/22/2021 5:55:50 AM PST by Grampy126 ((Don't worry about the blind mule, just load the wagon.))
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To: 4bye4

true ... but I guess it went over your head ...


43 posted on 11/22/2021 5:57:22 AM PST by bankwalker (Repeal the 19th ...)
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To: Macoozie

civil separation just kicks the can down the road ... a war is required for a long-lasting fix ... unfortunately ...


44 posted on 11/22/2021 5:59:28 AM PST by bankwalker (Repeal the 19th ...)
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To: rlmorel

The root reason is pride.

Excess self-love leads to believing oneself to have more value than other people and this leads to self-worship.

Self-worship causes a person to regard themselves as equal to God, or, at least, equal to being god-like.

God is never wrong, so guess who also never is wrong?

Believing themselves never to be wrong, the prideful feel obligated to announce and enforce their most-enlightened-and-most-important-in-the-world opinion for the benefit of the little people, bless everyone else’s second class little hearts.

The longer people go on being prideful the harder it is for them to admit being wrong about anything. Frail as a house of cards, their lives are built on a series of untruths because they have had to twist so many truths in order to always be right. These people know that if they go back and remove even one card the entire house will crumble and that is too much for them to face and too far for them to fall.

Social media has magnified the problem of pride because the prideful person’s audience size reaches into unknown numbers instead of being limited to his or her traditional circle of acquaintances. Admitting that we have been wrong to one person is difficult for most of us and admitting it, after claiming infallibility, to vast numbers of people who are perceived to be less valuable than oneself has got to be nearly impossible for the prideful person.

Toss in the powers of evil, our world’s original spark of self-worship and pride, and this societal turn from the individual knowing that his or her value is rooted in being a creature loved and valued by God to the individual believing that he is perfect just the way he is and can do or be anything he wants or that she is a perfect princess, and we have the recipe for societal destruction.

Just a few happy thoughts for the day!

:-)


45 posted on 11/22/2021 6:02:10 AM PST by pax_et_bonum (God is good, He loves us, and He is always with us.)
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To: MtnClimber

My experience with liberals is that they don’t know facts, they spew what they have heard on MSNBC, CNN, etc and many issues don’t even make it to MSNBC, they will say, I didn’t hear that so it must not be true. Then when undeniable facts are pointed out, they say, “so what, who cares”. I have a niece who continually calls “Rick” DeSantis an idiot, “he doesn’t know what he’s talking about”.


46 posted on 11/22/2021 6:02:10 AM PST by Toespi ( )
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To: MtnClimber

Most libtards are mentally ill and don’t even know it 🤪

They don’t know the difference between fact and fiction or good and bad.


47 posted on 11/22/2021 6:05:25 AM PST by NWFree (Somebody has to say it)
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To: bankwalker; cgbg; rlmorel
IMHO, with too many people (especially liberals) it becomes not just about how they feel when they hear the information, but mainly about how they feel when they argue it. The more often and louder they argue a point, the more they feel it. And since feelings are everything to liberals, their own arguing is like a self-perpetuation machine.

Any hope we have of convincing a liberal with facts about a topic is only early on before they've argued their side a lot. Once they've spent a lot of energy expressing their emotion, then their emotion is dominant in their thoughts.

Proverb 25:9 (AMP) -- Do not rush out to argue your case [before magistrates or judges]; Otherwise what will you do in the end [when your case is lost and] When your neighbor (opponent) humiliates you?

48 posted on 11/22/2021 6:07:09 AM PST by Tell It Right (1st Thessalonians 5:21 -- Put everything to the test, hold fast to that which is true.)
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To: Beowulf9

Tribal warfare is the easiest to instigate.

The government is also importing Islam, for the same purpose.

Suicide the society.


49 posted on 11/22/2021 6:08:15 AM PST by Cboldt
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To: rlmorel

It’s spiritual.


50 posted on 11/22/2021 6:09:44 AM PST by Cboldt
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To: Jonty30

“They can only be convinced by death camps, as they are being dragged away.”

More likely, they’ll claim that something went wrong or tha Left didn’t follow the Left’s plan correctly. They won’t fault the plan.


51 posted on 11/22/2021 6:18:30 AM PST by Seeing More Clearly Now ( )
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To: Macoozie
I am reminded of what Will Rogers said.

"If you throw a rock into a pack of dogs you can tell which one you hit, because that one will be yelping."

52 posted on 11/22/2021 6:19:42 AM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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To: bankwalker

Excellent post.

If you are not familiar with them, you will enjoy the podcasts of Terence McKenna.

He is off the charts brilliant and focuses on similar themes.

https://psychedelicsalon.com/category/people/terence-mckenna/

I will give you some to start with since there are so many:

(you can use this link for easier searching by number:
https://psychedelicsalon.com/podcasts/)

Podcast #261
Podcasts #295 and 296
Podcasts #589-593
Podcast 560
Podcasts 223-226—These are the most difficult to understand so should be listened to last—really worth the effort though.


53 posted on 11/22/2021 6:22:53 AM PST by cgbg (A kleptocracy--if they can keep it. Think of it as the Cantillon Effect in action.)
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To: MtnClimber

I can tell you that everything I say to anyone about COVID (and I include some of the most highly placed public health people and scientists in the country) is usually responded to by either “You must be a Trump voter” (80%) or “You obviously voted for Biden” (20%).

Reality is taking a break in this country, and it’s not just progressives.


54 posted on 11/22/2021 6:27:48 AM PST by Jim Noble (The nation cannot be saved until the GOP is destroyed)
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To: Beowulf9

“If you read the FBI declassified files on the Weathermen you will find they landed on the idea of using the blacks to cause dissention in the United States.

Obama has connections to the Weathermen. I’m sure this is all been the plan for years and is now so big it’s hard not to see the leaks.

Stemming from communists of course.”

The Weathermen’s closely related group, the SDS (Students for a Democratic Society) in 1968 carried out a plan in which they claimed that Columbia University was harming Blacks in wanting to build a community gymnasium on the side of campus that faced Harlem. This claim was a total, facade, invented by outside Communist strategists, an excuse to take over the university president’s office and incite chaos on the campus. The same pattern of inventing narratives that incite chaos and destruction continues today in our cities.


55 posted on 11/22/2021 6:29:25 AM PST by Seeing More Clearly Now ( )
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To: Seeing More Clearly Now

Related tidbit—Charles Manson also was trying to cause a race war. It is a common theme in leftist lore.


56 posted on 11/22/2021 6:31:30 AM PST by cgbg (A kleptocracy--if they can keep it. Think of it as the Cantillon Effect in action.)
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To: MtnClimber

Progressives not only lie to others, they lie to themselves.


57 posted on 11/22/2021 6:39:11 AM PST by RKRider
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To: pax_et_bonum
That is a valid observation, that it is about pride.

Back in his famous book "Witness" by Whittaker Chambers (who was crucified on a political cross by the Left) he writes an incisive passage that bears on this:

"Communists are that part of mankind which has recovered the power to live or die - to bear witness - for its faith. And it is a simple, rational faith that inspires men to live or die for it.

It is not new. It is, in fact, man’s second oldest faith. Its promise was whispered in the first days of the Creation under the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil: “Ye shall be as gods.” It is the great alternative faith of mankind. Like all great faiths, its force derives from a simple vision…Other ages have had great visions. They have always been different versions of the same vision: the vision of God and man’s relationship to God. The Communist vision is the vision of Man without God.

It is the vision of man’s mind displacing God as the creative intelligence of the world. It is the vision of man’s liberated mind, by the sole force of its rational intelligence, redirecting man’s destiny and reorganizing man’s life and the world. It is the vision of man, once more the central figure of the Creation, not because God made man in His image, but because man’s mind makes him the most intelligent of the animals. Copernicus and his successors displaced man as the central fact of the universe by proving that the earth was not the central star of the universe. Communism restores man to his sovereignty by the simple method of denying God."

This is why I regard this former communist spy, this dumpy man, as one of my personal heroes. He understands the Left all too well, in ways we simply refuse to face.

58 posted on 11/22/2021 6:46:06 AM PST by rlmorel (If the Biden Administration was only stupid or incompetent, some actions would benefit the USA.)
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To: MtnClimber

This was also an assault on the 2A.

If Kyle had been convicted then *any* use of a firearm in self-defense would become an automatic charge of murder. The left needed to stop anyone from thinking that they can use a weapon against a leftist ‘rally’ (mob). It would empower the mob no end.


59 posted on 11/22/2021 6:48:06 AM PST by fuzzylogic (welfare state = sharing of poor moral choices among everybody)
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To: Cboldt

I am leaning towards that (see the post above about Whittaker Chambers)

It is a religion. It is the way they approach everything, from race, economics, international relations, global warming, the environment...

Hating Trump.

You have to be a believer or an apostate. In this, the Left has much in common with radical Islam in their attitude towards apostates.

It is what will empower them to destroy those who disagree with them if they ever openly assume full control of the levers of power and remove our right to defend ourselves.

It is another reason why the Rittenhouse trial was in no way trivial-that is just another avenue of attack on our right to self defense.

They have been working on eliminating the means for some years now.


60 posted on 11/22/2021 6:50:34 AM PST by rlmorel (If the Biden Administration was only stupid or incompetent, some actions would benefit the USA.)
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