Mystery missile launch': Chinese missile test or airline contrail?

examiner.com ^ | 11/12/10 | Joe Newby

[lookout88]

The news crew filmed the contrail/plume for 10 minutes. How many missiles only move a little in 10 minutes? The picture shows a distant plane with a contrail that goes back perhaps a hundred miles towards the horizon. It’s an optical illusion that makes it look like a missile launch. The exact same airline flight from Hawaii was filmed the next day making the same type of contrail.

Well, I just had a going away party for my son with about 20 Air Force Officers. NONE OF THEM SAID IT WAS A PLANE. These are engineers, and aeronautic engineers. Plus, about 6 pilots.

I will take there word over the media. This is how the public is brainwashed.

[ResearchMonkey]

You are being evasive, I’m not talking about tracking a moving object, I’m talking about capturing video. That is to say: the complex dynamics of filming in total to get the best possible image. -— In this case the degradation of video quality is indicative of distance from the lens. Its not really speculative as you’ve stated, it more of an experience thing.

Well RobRoy, it’s been interesting discussing this with you although I’m not sure why you’re so closed off to reasonable discussion. — Have good say.

[wideminded]

Like this Tomahawk headed for Iraq.

Is there a plume leading all the way to Iraq. No.

Is the launch plume vertical. No.

[wideminded]

Except for that NOTAM.

I consulted an aeronautical chart and a great circle distance calculator. The nearest corner of Warning Area 537 is about 117 miles from Catalina Island.

[wideminded]

I have seen people wonder where an unfriendly sub might disappear to after taking such a risky shot. How about UNDER a conveniently dead in the water floating city?
Ship 55 miles out.
Shot 35 miles out.

The "missile shot" is supposed to have been north of Santa Catalina Island. The point where the cruise ship was stuck is 150 miles from Catalina Island, off the coast of Mexico.

[wideminded]

I just had a going away party for my son with about 20 Air Force Officers. NONE OF THEM SAID IT WAS A PLANE. These are engineers, and aeronautic engineers. Plus, about 6 pilots.

I greatly respect their experience. But if they are all just looking at the same original video/picture as everyone else, with no additional data, they could all be wrong. There's no question that the images look at first glance like a missile launch. But I would guess that none of the people at your son's party has compared the two pictures here, taken on separate days.

I will take there word over the media.

Me too. But the authority of experts is not always a reliable guide.

[justa-hairyape]

Was supporting your point that the cruise missile leaves a smoke trail during take off. That is what you typed, right ? I did say thanks for the info. Oh well.

[justa-hairyape]

You cannot compare a high quality zoomed in live video camera to a low quality distant still shot of a web cam. That shot is absolutely worthless. Heck an artist reproduction with crayons could look better. We got a live zoomed in high res video, you have a distant low res web cam image. Just reproduce a live video of that flight. That would be the minimum requirement I personally would need to counter the evidence the original video gives. But hey, we missile loons are just stubborn, I guess.

[TigersEye]

That is an interesting thought.

They are definitely proximate locations for a little juant in a sub.

[Finny]

Yeah, and at this point, if they want the airline contrail, great. It's okay by me. I have zero control over it anyway. The event was just an interesting thing and should keep us on our toes.

And in fact, it won't be the first time in this administration where the cover story was suspicious. The so-called "photo op" fly-by of the White House, and the SEALS doing business in with that pirate-hostage situation.

As Fauna said in Sweet Thursday, "There's people who'll buy anything." And that's okay by me.

[Finny]

I greatly respect their experience. But .........

Man. You sure think a lot of people are stupider than you.

[Finny]

I greatly respect their experience. But .........

Man. You sure think a lot of people are stupider than you.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Yep.

The busiest airspace in the world and no other contrails in sight...

It’s useless to argue with the morons.

Transponders are required for commercial flights and there is no flight data for the time in question from any of the four airports.

Smells like a missile...

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Yep.

The busiest airspace in the world and no other contrails in sight...

It’s useless to argue with the morons.

Transponders are required for commercial flights and there is no flight data for the time in question from any of the four airports.

Smells like a missile...

[Jess79]

I was playing with that Bob Hope Airport monitor. That's a pretty fun toy. At any rate, I found it interesting that right about 5:00 pm on the 8th, all the air traffic cleared between Catalina and the Channel Islands. Could just be a coincedence, but still interesting. That area stayed clear for almost 15 minutes except for one flight, American Airline 161, which cut right across that area heading southwest at approx 5:05 pm.

Then I watched the video again from this source:
http://www.ktar.com/?nid=6&sid=1353284

Look what appears on the right side of the screen at the 1:35 mark. Flt 161? Who knows. It's hard to make any educated guesses without knowing the exact time the missile was launched. I've read anywhere between 4:45 and 5:15.

I still don't see how anyone can believe it was a plane if the reported position of the photographer is correct. If the helicopter was flying around the Santa Monica/Palisades area, Flt 808 may have been heading straight towards them prior to 5:00 pm, but once it reached Catalina, it turned and headed straight east. At that point, the helicopter would have been almost due north of the plane and the film should have shown the plane's contrail(s) moving in a horizontal line from right to left. That did not happen. Instead the contrail curved right and went out to sea to the northwest just as the photographer reported. I know, I'm preaching to the choir.

[DontTreadOnMe2009]

I only saw a :52 second video and half of the total contrail was laid down in that time. Where is the 10 minute video?

---

1:40 of missile streaking upward;

rest is all of the lingering and amazing and unique smoke plume floating in the sunset sky.

The “10 minutes” is a garble of what the orig cameraman said was the TOTAL shot ...

[DontTreadOnMe2009]

Second, the photographer who filmed the footage said the object flew off towards the northwest. That would mean it flew away from the city, not over it, and certainly not to Arizona.

Third, there has been a lot of speculation that the verticle flight of the object was an optical illusion because the object was actually flying towards the camera. Yet that theory contradicts the photographer’s report that the object flew northwest. In addition, if the object was flying from west to east (towards the photographer), we should have seen two contrails. I’ve never seen a commercial aircraft fly overhead with only one contrail.

Bottom line, I don’t believe for a second it was US Airways Flt 808.

---

Good explanation

[lookout88]

Man. You sure think a lot of people are stupider than you.”

In what sense? I made a comment after listening to Air Force Officers. I prefer to believe their opinion. What’s wrong with you?

[Finny]

My comment was addressed to wideminded! Wideminded, someone who apparently thinks that in spite of the folks you and I know to have much more hands-on working knowledge applicable to the event, they must be quite stupid because wideminded knows better.

Just like the camerman, who has been flying in copters and filming LA skies for ELEVEN YEARS, is so stupid that he couldn't tell the difference between an airline contrail and a missile shot. *sigh*

I included you in the post address as a courtesy ping! My goof for not making it clear that my comment was addressed to wideminded ......... whose mind is SO wide that it must be infinitely better equipped to assess things like missile launches and contrails that people who are actual professionals, like the AF officers you so wisely give more credence than wideminded. :^)

[lookout88]

Oh ok. Posts get fuzzy when you don’t read the whole thing. I am getting very concerned because this is really looking like a bungled cover-up. I trust these guys to know what they are looking at. Hey, read the book “One Second After”. It puts a perspective on what could happen. I don’t know for sure what this was. I am just forming an opinion from intelligent people who know more than I do. I am beginning to think we are in real trouble.