Posted on 11/26/2008 8:54:48 AM PST by Amityschild
I believe that, because I think that by now, if it wasn’t legal, we would know. You’re right, he isn’t legally the pres-elect, so we’ll just have to wait and see what happens.
I think what Girlene meant is he's NOT a Pres-elect until he gets the votes officially on Dec 15.
OTOH, for all the pros and cons on the subject arguing about the burden of proof, how can you prove that a document which is not released be checked for authenticity unless someone or an expert see it and hold it physically?
One can't ask people to prove a negative. Also, if we say imagine if this argument was on the other side, what we would have been saying?
The answer is simple, a conservative would have been COMPELLED by the now-ALL-silent-Media to produce such document or else.......riots, demonstration, union strikes, code pink panthers, gays, and yes, Rambo Emmanuel and company trying to stop the "third stolen election/selection"! Right?
I’m guessing that it was previously released, but as I said, we’ll have to wait and see what happens.
Sure, but we don’t want wait until he’s inaugurated, do we?
The compelling argument has to do with zero’s rhetoric about openness, unity, one America, etc...
If I were him, I would nip it in the bud and make great hey out of it by citing the “deniers’ tactics, VRWC, etc.
When he doesn’t take that route, something doesn’t add up and running the clock where impeachment will not be an option with the number of rats in the Capitol tunnels.
Absolutely! Look what they did with Sarah Palin — converging on Alaska trying to muck up something... anything... to ruin her position as candidate. (They found nothing.) In Hussein’s case, we KNOW there’s a problem, but news outlets aren’t expending any energy to get to the bottom of it.
Why is somebody's birth record a private matter in the first place?
There are some basic facts about a person that seem to be a public matter, one being one's existence. I can see, and hear Barack Obama, so I know he exists. Why is his birth record not a public matter, since he travels in public, was supposedly born in a public hospital, and is claiming eligibility to the highest public office?
I know there is the recent technology threat of data privacy and identity theft, but does anybody seriously think that Obama's identity is going to be stolen? Obama's birth certificate would not have a social security number, since they weren't automatically assigned to infants in 1961. He has made public what he claims is his certificate of live birth, so one could presume that Obama has already consented to have his birth information made available.
What is so private about Obama's hospital birth certificate, that his individual protection supercedes the public's right to know?
-PJ
There is nothing private about someone who is running for office, especially the presidency. He/she gives up any and all claim to privacy the moment they begin contracting and accepting donations for their campaign. No more anonimity is one of the costs of candidacy.
Just my simple opinion from a simple mind for a simple question.
The issue is legitimate because the certificate is not.
Mark Levin, who is constitutional law litigator, says this issue of Obama’s citizenship will never be successful.
I’ll take his legal expertise over some of these lawsuit proponents, including Alan Keyes.
-PJ
Well, I figure as a senator, he probably had some level of clearance and he probably has a passport. Both of these documents require a proof of citizenship. One of the requirements for proof of citizenship is verification of date and place of birth. For just about everyone, the first piece of paper anyone has that verifies birthdate and place, is a birth certificate. It would be extremely rare, if not impossible, for him to have gotten where he is, without having at one time, shown his birth certificate.
Proof of citizenship is not proof of eligibility to be President. He could have “gottten where he is” a lot easier than you think without a certificate that showed he was eligible to become POTUS.
I agree, but to obtain a proof of citizenship, one must provide verification of place and date of birth.
GO TO YOUR LIBRARY TO OR SUITABLE PLACE (LEST YOU WANT TO STICK WHERE YOU ARE} USE OTHER CPU AS THE PLAINS RADIO FORUM DISPLAYS IP AND POST INTO PLAINS RADIO FORUM REQUESTING THAT ED HALE / PLAINS RADIO BURIES THE HATCHET AND TRANSMITS THESE INTERVIEW TAPES TO FOXNEWS AS SO REQUESTED BY FOXNEWS.
http://pub29.bravenet.com/forum/2442810129/ for above forum page
LEO DONFRIO APPEARS TO BE FINE [Turkey day slight update]
http://pub29.bravenet.com/forum/2442810129/show/940488
A very few I emailed and I made one single post comment [now update]: What the hell am I [was] listening to [lapping late Weds eve to early Thurs AM] ? A rebroadcast of what sounds like Wednesday Nov 26 [had to be Tues Nov 25 ] Plainsradio “listen live”. Leo Donofrio is speaking via phone hookup to someone via phone hookup to a JD who is obviously a lawyer asking him in straight prepared questions.
Leo states he has NOT been threatened. HE WAS SLEEPING FOR A COUPLE DAYS. Then another fellow who asks if other material ( passports, student applications) can be entered.. LD seems negative on this. But LD DOES say “this” AM “Court’s Case” [CW- I thought they were using changed name] ( via Connecticut action) did get docketed today in the US SUPREME COURT. [to USSC docket No. 08A46]
Steve, a young admirer calls in, who had emailed LD w/ LD acknowledging Then another fellow calls in from NY, an man of some age. …
http://www.plainsradio.com/chat.html
http://www.plainsradio.com/show.html
The Caren & Ed’s Friday show button at lower left Nov 21 breaks off after break. HERE [I’m 90% sure it was here) ED HALE SAYS HE HAS SNUBBED FOX NEWS REQUEST FOR TAPES OF THE SHOWS. EH expresses great chagrin as Fox didn’t want to have anything to do with plainsradio requests to Fox earlier. I’ve posted into forum message board polite but ardent request he drop the snub of Fox, that this has to get out!
REPEAT: GO TO YOUR LIBRARY TO OR SUITABLE PLACE (LEST YOU WANT TO STICK WHERE YOU ARE} USE OTHER CPU AS THE PLAINS RADIO FORUM DISPLAYS IP AND POST INTO PLAINS RADIO FORUM REQUESTING THAT ED HALE / PLAINS RADIO BURIES THE HATCHET AND TRANSMITS THESE INTERVIEW TAPES TO FOXNEWS AS SO REQUESTED BY FOXNEWS.
They’ve made their point already.
http://pub29.bravenet.com/forum/2442810129/ for above forum page
So yes- following links etc (while wonderful smells coming from kitchen)
Donofrio has himself posted here:
http://www.therightsideoflife.com/?p=1216
Wrotnowski v. Bysiewicz: Clerk Bickell Allegedly Obstructing Justice on Another Emergency Stay Application
November 26th, 2008 at 1:27 pm
Today, Leo Donofrio, Plaintiff in Donofrio v. Wells, reported on Mr. Cort Wrotnowski’s emergency stay case from Connecticut. He says that Supreme Court of the US (SCOTUS) Clerk Danny Bickell is again denying Mr. Wrotnsowski’s motion in similar fashion as he did to Mr. Donofrio’s (see that whole saga here).
Media alert: Wrotnowski and Donofrio will be interviewed by Bob Vernon on the Plains radio Network at 10:30PM EST; Mr. Donofrio was also on the Scott Hennen show today (MP3). This was the first main stream media exposure of the case. Please see the link and look for an audio file at this blog to be uploaded soon.
SCOTUS Docket: 08a469
A full posting is available below.
PDF document: Connecticut Supreme Court order of Chief Justic Chase Rogers.
TREASON AT SCOTUS? BICKELL OBSTRUCTING JUSTICE AGAIN IN WROTNOWSKI V. CONNECTICUT SECRETARY OF STATE
- Wrotnowski and Donofrio will be interviewed by Bob Vernon on the Plains radio Network at 10:30PM EST.
- Mr. Donofrio was also on the Scott Hennenshow today. This was the first main stream media exposure of the case. Please see the link and look for an audio file at this blog to be uploaded soon.
US Supreme Court stay clerk Danny Bickell is guilty of obstruction of justice for the second time. Yesterday, Cort Wrotnowski filed an emergency stay application in the case WROTNOWSKI V. BYSIEWICZ, CONNECTICUT SECRETARY OF STATE, which is coming directly from a Connecticut Supreme Court order of Chief Justic Chase Rogers.
Mr. Wrotnowski was informed by Danny Bickellthat Mr. Bickell denied Cort’s motion based on Rule 23.3, the same grounds Mr. Bickell had illegally improperly relied on to obstructDonofrio v. Wells [docket], the same case which is now going before the entire Supreme Court for Conference of Dec. 5th and to which Donofrio has pointed out Mr. Bickell was guilty of attemping to overturn Justice Powell’s holding in McCarthy v. Briscoe 429 U.S. 1317 n.1 (1976) and Justice O’Connerin Western Airlines, Inc. v. Teamsters, 480 U.S. 1301 (1987).
Furthermore, the issue was fully briefed - in the application submitted to the SCOTUS yesterday by Mr. Wrotnowski based on Donofrio’sresearch, and Donofrio’s fear that Bickell would try to pull the same obstruction of justice again.
Furthermore, Mr. Bickell is fully aware that the Supreme Court is hearing this issue in full conference despite Bickell’s best attempts to stop that from happening.
Donofrio (me) believes Mr. Wrotnowski’s case is at least as strong as his own, if not stronger. And Donofrio warned Wrotnowski that Bickellwas going to try the same tactic again.
Donofrio was right. Today, Bickell informed Wrotnowski that he was refusing to pass the emergency stay application on to Justice Ginsberg.
In a follow up phone call, Mr. Wrotnowski pointed out to Mr. Bickell that the issues he raised were properly briefed in the application and that it was the job of a Supreme Court Justices to make decisions of substantive law, not Mr. Bickell. Bickell then berated with mocking insults.
Mr. Wrotnowski has been through two lower courts and is now using our US Supreme Court rules to properly petition our Supreme Court for relief. This is outrageous and Mr. Bickell needs to be fired immediately and brought up on criminal charges for obstruction of justice, and possibly treason.
Courageously, Mr. Wrotnowski refused to back down and eventually Bickell said he would, reluctantly, docket the case.
As of 12:38 PM the case has not been docketed.
If you think that justice has been obstructed then please voice your opinions to the appropriate authorities. This is a very urgent issue which is now causing out entire system of justice to be overturned by a single clerk.
Mr. Wrotnowski
[UPDATE. WROTNOWSKI V. BYSIEWICZ, CONNECTICUT SECRETARY OF STATE…
…has been docketed, despite having initially been denied process by the SCOTUS stay clerk, Danny Bickell. Wrotnowski’s case has been submitted to the Honorable Associate Justice, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Circuit Justice for the 2nd Circuit (includes Connecticut).
POSTED BY NATURAL BORN CITIZEN AT 9:12 AM
Below link to a nice picture of Cort- who saw Connecticut trot out some HEAVY lawyerly big guns for the little less-than-an-hour obfuscation finally at hands of State Supreme Court Head “Judge”:
http://americamustknow.com/connecticutcase.aspx
LD & CW were just on plainsradio again T’day eve ( I know because Joe Thunder said he had a turkey hangover!) & “Ken from Arkansas” again calls up, with LD thanking him profusely for ref’g this article on previous show. Except I hear previous show as being 11/25 as “this morning” CW got docketed w/ USSC & I’m sure its been now archived as 11/24. Also 11/21 show (pretty dang sure it was that’n) has Ed Hale rejecting Fox News request for show tapes because they ignored him before when he requested Fox News attention. I suggest contacting via FASTBLAST [no you don’t have to go to forum as I suggested] on live feed/chat page at least to urge tapes go to Fox- and AT LEAST GET SHOWS ARCHIVED CLEARLY. Anybody seen error in archive? If so please email me. I really don’t think I’m losing my mind! Working solo here but...
WHATEVER THE CASE- THIS ARTICLE IS APPARENTLY WORTH ITS WEIGHT IN GOLD (with serious comments).
http://federalistblog.us/2008/11/natural-born_citizen_defined.html#more
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2139442/posts
Were you high when you wrote all of that? Do you not get it? There is a Birth Certificate, there is a birth announcement. Checkmate. On to the next item on the agenda, please.
Use Occam’s razor here. Is it more likely that when Obama decided to run for president that he paid off a bunch of staffers with the State of Hawaii, paid off, threatened or killed witnesses in Hawaii, the hospital, paid off/threatened/killed multiple witnesses and family members and friends in Kenya, Kansas and who else knows where? Then sent out thousands of staffers across the nation and around the globe to do more of this paying, threatening, killing of hundreds or thousands of people, covering tracks and shredding documentation etc etc etc to rewrite his personal history to show that he was born in Hawaii....or....
Was he actually just born in Hawaii? The simplest explanation tends to be the right one.
How many psychotic breaks have you had in your own lifetime, JackM? Ever been on thorazine or similar anti-psychotics? Just wondering, since you threw out the idea.
Considering the Constitution was written by human beings, yes, it had to have flaws. The converse would be that it was perfect and therefore written by perfect beings, i.e., gods. If you are ready to blaspheme and be the silly one, go ahead and declare the founding fathers as gods and declare the Constitution a new book of the Bible.
And no one really prescribes thorazine anymore, it binds to too many neuroreceptors, not selective at all. I prefer SSRIs, SNRIs and the occassional long half-life benzodiazepines :)
It's an old saying, "The best is the enemy of the good." Alternative, "The perfect is the enemy of the good."
We are asked to be good by our Creator. Then it comes that men after power say "This is the way to perfection", and name a specific way that aligns with their immediate interests, and demand that others seek such "perfection".
The "perfect" is crafty and wily. The good is simple.
The Constitution is simple and good. Yet men have come and attempt its perfection, or other men say "Look it's not perfect!" and by that minimize the Founder's accomplishment and the wisdom wrapped up in that original charter. Either way it is that by use of "the perfect" that a great wrecking bar is applied to the good foundation so as to destroy it.
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