Posted on 02/11/2005 2:28:24 PM PST by FreeMarket1
When the USA does things like this, it means we're losing to the terrorists.
That was only when bill clinton was in the white house then big goverment police states were a bad thing here on free republic.But a (R) is in the white house now so its all good happy days are here again.
Police tactics?In the ritzier suburbs of Chicago, I get pulled over routinely for the 708er equivalent of DWB -- for driving a Chicago registered vehicle in "their" suburb after dark.Only those breaking traffic laws should have anything to fear. Some here are acting as if this is some gestapo tactic designed to subjugate the masses. It takes a really lame brained driver to find himself pulled over these days. How many unregistered and probably uninsured vehicles do you see roaming our roads? Those are ones who should fear strict enforcement. I know I fear them. If you can’t obey the smallest of laws, how much more so, the big one ones?
Not because of the color of my skin, but because of the zip code on my vehicle registration.
A request for narcotics dog search of your vehicle is not warranted as a result of a minor traffic violation.It is now (as of January 24th, 2005).
the constitution is there to make the job of government more difficult to oppress. the right of every american to overthrow their yokes of oppression are there too...
there will be costs to both sides... the sparring taking place now are setting the stage for the final bout...
the government is jockeying for position to identify all the home grown terrorists by fingerprinting everyone... they are also instigating a self-fulfilling prophecy.
teeman
When's the last time you read the law? How do you know you are obeying the smallest of laws? Do you have any idea how many laws you violate in a single day unawares? Gun laws alone total nearly 1,000,000 words in this country - imagine the totality of law in general, then multiplied by overlapping and conflicting modifications by court rulings, then multiplied again by misinformed 'law enforcement'.
Roman proverb: "The more numerous the laws, the more corrupt the state."
We live under a multitude of obscure and incomprehensible laws. The nice policeman taking your fingerprints for a "minor" traffic violation is not doing so for your protection, and he is not your friend or advocate; he is doing so to find more opportunities to enforce more laws, and has stopped you and is investigating you because he believes you may be a lawbreaker.
Maybe he had to submit some sort of written documentation proving that he wasn't dead. Your tax dollars at "work". ;-)
They do not have a proper reason to build their data base in this way, they should not, but I don't see what could be a improper act as a violation of rights, if they allow refusal and have no penalty for same.
Finger prints are taken for any number of reasons to add to identification.
Many families have their children finger printed, the military has a data base as do employees of many corporations. Some of these data bases are linked.
This is the first I have heard of a adult fingerprint collection activity, and the method used is what is causing alarm, not the act of collecting the information.IMHO
I address this in my reply at #68.
I actually do find it amusing sometimes when people balk at being fingerprinted. I believe it to be part of a ID process these days. So many seem afraid of proving who they are. One wonders?
But I do disagree with the method used in this case.
Not long ago, some car rental agency was asking for prints.
Man, what a argument that caused. I still view it as silly.
There is no right to be invisible or anonymous if asked for ID for a proper purpose and still receive the goods, services or whatever from the asking authority.
I am happy to prove my existence! That I am who I said I am.
One wonders why someone would not.
Fingerprinting of traffic violators who have no other form of identification does not seem unreasonable.
In fact, fingerprinting might be reasonable if the government could be entrusted to place the fingerprint immediately into a tamper-resistant numbered sealed envelope, which would be returned unopened to the offender when he appeared in court and/or paid the fine, unless the offender wished to argue that he was not the person represented by the fingerprint in which case the police would then be free to try to identify who the print actually did belong to.
Someone with a copy of your fingerprints can prove that they are you. Are there no crooked cops in this world?
There was a recent case of a misread print, but I believe it was due to protocol differences and copy reproduction problems. It could also be that the print was indeed correct and the investigation halted for other reasons.
Our judicial system make errors all the time, but forensics are getting better everyday.
I can think of nothing that cannot be used in a wrong way if someone wants too.
I just think, that in a age of DNA and forensics, coupled with stolen and misrepresented ID's, that it is better to use what we have.
It would be different in a different reality.
"Seems only those with a dirty background have anything to fear. "
Or those who object on principle to being treated like a criminal.
A traffic infraction is not a crime, and people stopped for traffic infractions should not be treated like criminals.
True enough, but commercial drivers have had to endure this for decades.
Back in the 1970's it was CITY policy in my neck of the woods to fingerprint anyone who applied for a Taxi Cab License. (I later learned it was mainly to make identification of the body (of the cabdriver) easier after some fine rider went psycho in the middle of the night.)
And of course, with advent of the Universal Commercial Drivers License, no trucker has any rights unless you are from south of the border in which case you drive regardless of your past, current ability to speak English or felonious proclivities.
The patriot protest movement was pretty quiet when all this occurred.
Best regards,
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