Not Such a Bright Idea: Atheists Try a New Name

http://www.crosswalk.com/news/weblogs/mohler/ ^ | September 29, 2003 | Dr. R. Albert Mohler, Jr.

[NutCrackerBoy]

Your dictionary is inadequate. A = without, theism = belief in a god or gods --> atheism = without belief in a god or gods. Otherwise, what would you call "lack of belief in a god or gods"?

skepticism

I think your definition is not far wrong, but why not agree there is a connotation in atheism as an adherent of some sort. We have the words rational and rationalist. The latter is much more gung ho than neutral about rationality whereas just about everybody does have rational faculties. (You are excluded, tpaine).

[OWK]

"If there is no God, then everything is permitted" -- Fyodor Dostoyevsky

What does not follow from this is that everyone would choose to do evil.

Or that if there is a God, that it is not equally so that everything is still permitted (restrained only by the actions of man.... whether he believes in God, or not).

Unless of course Dostoyevsky's argument is against free will.

[OWK]

For what it is worth... both Webster and New American dictionaries, support your definition... not the one posted earlier.

[L,TOWM]

I was'nt attacking you. I was trying to correct your sweeping generalization of the universal immorality of atheists by referring you to apostolic teaching.

I then extended the passages in Romans to support from a direct quote from the Gospel.

I did not quote ONE verse, but gave a verse (in context) to answer your (erroneous) assertion that Christ never said any such thing (Post 87).

"For all Scripture is God-Breathed, and is useful for teaching, correcting, rebuking, and training in righteousness". Commentary? I have several. Attacking a brother, and siding with "heathens"? I used to be a "heathen". By God's choice, and not my own, he saved me. I don't see "heathens" on this thread. I see brothers. Some brothers that may not know it yet and may not know until their next to last breath, but brothers that Christ calls to, nonetheless.

[The Man Upstairs]

Thank you.

I was considering a lighnting strike.

You saved me the trouble.

[L,TOWM]

Hey, we made it into the Smokey Backroom--no new incendiary devices needed, it appears!

[NutCrackerBoy]

For what it is worth... both Webster and New American dictionaries, support your definition... not the one posted earlier.

Wrong. Merriam-Webster Online fails to resolve the disagreement.

M-WO defines atheist as "one who denies the existence of God" (DrC's exact words which you dispute as being an authorititive definition) and atheism as a) a disbelief in the existence of deity or b) the doctrine that there is no deity. In OWK's and Dimensio's favor, the a) definition takes precedence when the word is "atheism."

[Revolting cat!]

What does not follow from this is that everyone would choose to do evil.

True, except whose evil? 'Evil' by Woody Allen's atheistic definition? Why not his? Why not mine?

[exmarine]

I was'nt attacking you. I was trying to correct your sweeping generalization of the universal immorality of atheists by referring you to apostolic teaching.

I think you would be better served to privately e-mail me on this if you have something important to tell me. Let me tell you a FACT - if one doesn't believe in God, then the ONLY refuge (logically and practically) is moral relativism. So, an atheist must be a moral relavistist if he/she want to be consistent. However, if an atheist believes in absolute, universal, objective right and wrong, then such an atheist has some "splainin'" to do since without God, there can be no source of absolute morality.

By the way, my post was not intended for benign or indifferent atheists, only for those who are actively working against God. In that case, what I said was true and right, and the evil must be exposed for what it is. Do you know what "salt and light" means? If you don't want to stand up for Christian moral principles and defend the faith, then get out of the way. I intend to be salty.

[OWK]

a·the·ist ( P ) Pronunciation Key (th-st)
n.
One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company

_________________________________________________

atheist \A"the*ist\,

n.

1. One who disbelieves or denies the existence of a God, or supreme intelligent Being.

: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.

[exmarine]

If you want to say the bible has contradictions, you first need to define what a contradiction is. If you won't do that, then I don't have time for you.

[OWK]

Let me tell you a FACT - if one doesn't believe in God, then the ONLY refuge (logically and practically) is moral relativism.

False.

[exmarine]

My belief system does not require others to believe as I do.

Tell that to the militant secular humanists are stealing my religious freedom! How many court rulings should I cite to prove it is happening? I am one Christian who will FIGHT TO THE DEATH to keep my religious freedom. TO THE DEATH. Our founders were Christians, and stated over and over that our Constitution and our Repbulic is dependent upon self-governance (personal morality). Washington, Adams, Hopkinson, Jay, Madison and many others said there can be no morality apart from religion. Alexis de Toqueville observed that the notions of Christianity and liberty were "intimately united" in America. Without Christianity, there is no liberty, becuase atheism fosters slavery and oppression - the pages of history prove it. Hence, we have a moral cesspool today in America. If you need a reference, I suggest you read Patrick Henry's give me liberty or give me death speech, or Washington's farewell address. In the meantime, the atheists in our judiciary and government have no moral compass other than the ACLU and the liberal paper-mill law schools of Harvard and Yale and Princeton.

If you would like to talk facts and history, then let's go. Otherwise, spare me your personal judgments. I don't care what you think of my methods. If I said something is untrue, then refute it.

[L,TOWM]

Do you know what "salt and light" means?

Yes.

Do you know what ambassador means?

[Ronaldus Magnus]

There is no need to capitalize the first letter of Atheist

I offer that same courtesy to all religions. There is no reason to single out Atheism for less respectful treatment.

"Heathen" is not an adequate descriptor, as it can refer to anyone who isn't a follow of your chosen mythology, not just atheists.

The specific meaning you are referencing would apply to Atheists, as would all of the word's other accepted meanings:

hea·then  (hthn) n.
1. 1. One who does not acknowledge the God of Judaism, Christianity, or Islam.
   2. Such persons considered as a group; the unconverted.
2. 1. One who is regarded as irreligious, uncivilized, or unenlightened.
   2. Such persons considered as a group.

[exmarine]

False.

Okay OWK, the only "logical" refuge then...or you can name a source other than God for absolute moral principles.

[AndrewC]

False

I see you have been thoroughly trounced by a convincing logical argument. You had better slink away and admit that relative and absolute mean the same thing.

[OWK]

or you can name a source other than God for absolute moral principles.

Mine is sourced in reality.

[OWK]

Ahh... the guy who starts obfuscating when the truth approaches.

I see a huge waste of time on the horizon.

[exmarine]

Mine is sourced in reality.

Hahaha. That's not an answer. If they are real, then you won't mind telling me where they come from. You need to name the specific source for moral absolutes if not God...is it aliens? Do moral principles have extension in space perhaps?