Thanks for the memories, but it's time for Christians to unite not fight

self | 3/2/2015 | two134711

[Alex Murphy]

Just curious though: if the race came down to Hill vs Mitt Romney, for whom, do you think, would our non-Catholic brethren vote? Quite a conundrum, ain't it?

During the 2012 election cycle, an uber-liberal friend of mine asked me how I felt about "having to vote for Romney to get rid of Obama". I responded by saying "who says I'm voting for Romney? I'm a political conservative first, not a Republican."

As I told that friend, I don't vote against candidates. I vote for candidates who will represent and advance my political views (which include pro-life, pro-self-government, reduction of income taxes, permanent reduction of the size of federal government, pro-military, school choice, border protection, and pro-Christian religious freedom). Up until 2012, there were still some Republicans who represented my own interests. In 2012, not so much. I challenged my friend by asking "Why should anyone vote for a candidate who does not, or will not represent their interests?"

That's the whole point of representative government - the candidate that you vote for represents your interests. By voting for him or her, those interests become your interests. If your vote is "against" the liberal candidate, then you've signed your name to a blank check politically. Any policy can be enacted, any growth in government can occur, but you don't care so long as the other guy didn't win. You've thrown away your conscience, in order not to throw away your vote.

So in 2016, I'll be asking people these three questions:

• Do you know who/what you're voting into office?
  
• Do you support what your chosen candidate stands for?
  
• Are you willing to go on record, four years from now, as having supported what he did to this country?

I may not vote "Republican", but I will vote for someone. And in the end, my name and vote will be associated with something more than "anyone and anything but Hillary". There may be cases where I may be throwing my vote away, but I will not throw my conscience away.

[roamer_1]

It made a big impression on me [...]

Me too - It was asked of me to read it in the context of a larger argument, and I had to order the book through a library-sharing program (heh... back in the day, before e-bay and amazon)... When it arrived, it was a '50's hard-back, weathered and worn, and in such fragile condition that I literally wrapped it tightly in brown paper for the return, hand-delivered, as I was not sure it could even survive the bottom of the drop-box...

In some way, the fragile condition of the pages heightened the story, and the fragile condition of the people - each page turned with loving care, lest it should break. There is more than one of my tears staining that book - plainly laid over the tears of many others...

What impressed me the most was when he spoke of waking up in the morning and the person next to him was dead- he, like so many others would go back to sleep. He said that after awhile, that became life around the camp- it was part of daily life, they were beyond mourning and survival was the goal. What is it inside a person that could make them still want to live , despite the fact of being in hell on earth? That amazed me.

For me, it was the fact that in spite of being far beyond dire need, men of good measure were giving of their meager rations to those worse than themselves, when the act was so useless as to be pointless - And they grew more feeble that another might live, maybe just for another hour... That, more than any other way available to Man, is laying down one's life for another... While I don't want to lessen the act of stepping in front of a speeding train to save a child, to me, it can't compare to day by day, month after bitter month, sacrificing of yourself so that others can live, in an environment so torturous as to be beyond imagination. Consciously. Intentionally. That is love of a kind so pure that it makes the heart keen.

I later wound up in a wheelchair/bedridden for seven years, in terrible pain - I lost everything, my body, my honor, my business, eventually my marriage, and nearly even my mind... I owe Viktor Frankl much for my ability to hang onto sanity during that time, and I thank God that he prepared me for it with Frankl's words, written large.

God bless you too!

[Resettozero]

Quite a conundrum, ain't it?

Not for me, the theoretical election matchup you imagined.

But I repeat, if a Democrat is elected President, it will be with the necessary help of liberal RCs who have voted Dem in the past elections. You overestimate the number of conservative Catholics such as yourself and your friends.

[WVKayaker]

When those "beliefs" are erroneous, they need to be addressed. Correcting the sinner is not “Being judgmental.” It is an essential work of charity. And when that individual, after being corrected, continues to post the same falsehoods, then these must be considered an attack.

I have been patiently correcting the falsity and bloviation of our Roman Catholic Friends.

You will know when attacked, but posting Scriptural refutation to the various manmade heresies of Roman Catholicism, along with a few comments of my own, is hardly a personal attack. If you take it personally, it may be a sign that the target has been acquired. Maybe a reflection on the Scriptures posted, and ignoring my taunts, may get a clearer reflection of the Truth of God's Plan of Salvation.

We Christians are not infallible, and neither is the Roman Catholic hierarchy. But, those of us, who believe the promises of God, have the indwelling Holy Spirit to guide us into all Truth.

Truth doesn't come because a group is large, nor that has been around for a long time. Truth comes only from the Throne of God and is revealed through the ministry of His Holy Spirit ... and that Throne is nowhere near Rome!

[BlueDragon]

When those "beliefs" are erroneous, they need to be addressed. Correcting the sinner is not “Being judgmental.” It is an essential work of charity. And when that individual, after being corrected, continues to post the same falsehoods, then these must be considered an attack.

You don't say? This shows my own reaction to words said -- like that. Can you hear yourself talk?

Grab a hanky, wipe those precious (and pious, don't forget pious!) tears,

see "Stations of the White Hanky", #'s

2., 3., 9., 10., 11., 14., 15., 16., 17., & 19

calculate costs of votive candles deserving be lit at each station
and possibly any others as those be best fitting when need arises
then, whenever small (but heartfelt, don't forget 'heartfelt'!) prayer said towards those Stations
(and sniffled at, dabbing out tears)

---- never mind the candles just send cash, and FreeRepublic will take care of the rest.

remit payment to, well you know where.

Further, if I may, in spirit of Deuteronomy 25:4, 1 Corinthians 9:9, 1 Timothy 5:18;

"Muzzle not the ox whom treadeth out the corn"

would ask that donations not be sent to myself, but to FreeRepublic --- in my honor, as humble servant to all.

Your FRiend,
Always

---

---

It is the springtime of my loving
the second season I am to know

You are the sunlight in my growing
so little warmth I've felt before.

It isn't hard to feel me glowing
I watched the fire that grew so low.

It is the summer of my smiles
flee from me Keepers of the Gloom.

Speak to me only with your eyes.
It is to you I give this tune.

Ain't so hard to recognize
These things are clear to all from
time to time.

I've felt the coldness of my winter
I never thought it would ever go.

I cursed the gloom that set upon us...
But I know that I love you so

These are the seasons of emotion and like the winds they rise and fall...

This is the wonder of devotion
I seek the torch we all must hold.

This is the mystery of the quotient (quotient)
Upon us (upon us) all a little rain must fall...It's just a little rain...

The Rain Song
Led Zeppelin, from Houses of the Holy

[daniel1212]

I was surprised to see this thread still going for 2 months, and looked to see if someone revived, and lo, it was you, the same one who got involved in a exchange i had with someone else, and would have died sooner otherwise.

Yes, I believe the Religion Moderator encourages battles as well, and it IS discouraging.

You mean that you want him to change the rules to exempt Catholicism from being impugned, since that is your only complaint, while RCs can say such things as,

that Protestantism is belief in one’s self, and
absolutely alien to Christianity, and that,
Protestants are mostly biblically illiterate,
intellectually dishonest,
evil fruit, who
don’t have the Holy Spirit, and
are not part of the Body of Christ, and
who have no foundation for their understanding of Christianity, and
will not be saved unless they becomes a member of the Catholic Church, and
are by inclination vandals who should be purged from the face of the earth,

But that Catholics never put down or challenge beliefs from protestants, and that,
there never has been a bit of anti-protestant bigotry on FR,
and that they have never seen a Catholic teaching proven false.

I think the comment onyx mentioned from CynicalBear, regarding more Catholics being in hell than Muslims, should be removed,

So CB is censured while the very church you defend damned all of us former RCs, and which many RCs here concur with:

Pope Eugene IV, Cantate Domino (1441): "The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the "eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels" (Matthew 25:41), unless before death they are joined with Her;

just like I thought a photograph of a prominent Catholic, marked up to look like Satan,

So that must be nuked along with Dante's inferno i supopose, while everything from derogatory pictures of Luther to the YOPIS cereal box is allowed.

I didn't realize so many others were similarly discouraged, and will back off again soon myself even though I

You seem to want to turn this into Catholic Answers. Did you ever see how many banned users that has, due to being so touchy and one sided?

[mlizzy]

Thank you for speaking of “Man’s Search for Meaning.” I’ve been reading the reviews on Amazon, of which there are almost 2,000 5-star reviews. I hadn’t heard of this book until now. God’s love to you both (for your discussion on it). Thanks again.

http://www.amazon.com/Mans-Search-Meaning-Viktor-Frankl/dp/0671023373/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1430353746&sr=8-3&keywords=man%27s+search+for+meaning

[daniel1212]

The number of posts in each makes it obvious which gets the most attention and active participation. I for one welcome the opportunity offered here to openly debate what scripture teaches. All in all I think the moderators do an excellent job and I commend them. Jesus Himself said there would be divisions.

Indeed, moreover, the idea that RCs should be able to incessantly post articles about their church, while it claims to be the one true church, and relegates all outside her to being deficient in grace, and all Prot churches as not even being worthy of the proper name "church," and not be challenged, is itself arrogance. And some of the self-righteous complaining borders on insolence.

[mlizzy]

There’s problems on both ends. That’s why a [devout, patient] Catholic moderator helping out would be very beneficial. Would you keep [happily] attending your son’s soccer games if both referees were opposing team fathers [and you didn’t always agree with their calls]?

[daniel1212]

Many of the best FR posters are gone because of the vile stuff that's permitted to be posted here. And you better believe the fundraising is down because of it. Who in their right mind is going to continue to contribute to a forum that permits this kind of nonsense?

That is so much bombast. For years RCs have denigrated Prots - as even your very own popes have done - and incessantly advertized their elitist one true church, but as her own propaganda has been exposed as fallacious, and recently a stream of articles has appeared, then now we see a people us regulars rarely see calling to ban Prot posts amidst talk of wanting peace.

But as long as Rome maintains both her arrogance and false teaching then she invites challenge and rebuke.

And as "better believe the fundraising is down," no, we do not have to believe you, and the fact is that the RF is where you see the longest threads, and which often come up on Google searches, thus providing more readership and opportunity to see appeals to donate, in contrast to devo threads, which hardly see more than a dozen posts except by one poster.

Meanwhile, many conservatives have complained over the years about the RF due to the number of articles, which RCs by far are most responsible for.

[daniel1212]

Such nonsense. No one is buying it. Shut down the cesspool instead of making excuses for it.

Rather, the RF will do quite well without such scorners.

[daniel1212]

The above has been stated on open religion forum threads on Free Republic so frequently to those who feel the threads [when disrespectful] are out of place on a "conservative" site, hateful toward Christ and His Mother,

It's time for a list of examples of the manner of your alleged hate l toward Christ and His Mother. You mean that of reproving the unBiblical demigoddess of the fictitious Mary of Catholicism , in contrast to the holy, virtuous blessed Mary of Scripture?

[daniel1212]

Protestants have put up with these kinds of insults in the Religion Forum for at least a decade. The least that Catholics could do is be as thick-skinned as the Protestants have been IMO.

Like liberals, having been so often defeated in debate, by the grace of God, the recourse of many is to pathos over ethos, except to post the same old refuted Staples etc. polemics.

[mlizzy]

It's time for a list of examples of the manner of your alleged hate l toward Christ and His Mother. You mean that of reproving the unBiblical demigoddess of the fictitious Mary of Catholicism , in contrast to the holy, virtuous blessed Mary of Scripture?

I'm not going to fetch examples. They'll come up in the future. In fact you seem to have espoused one just now. :)

[Grateful2God]

Great! How anyone could survive that and come out a whole person and be able to speak of it besides, is pretty amazing,.. Thanks for the feedback!

[mlizzy]

I was surprised to see this thread still going for 2 months, and looked to see if someone revived, and lo, it was you, the same one who got involved in a exchange i had with someone else, and would have died sooner otherwise.

I didn't come upon this thread until the first day I commented. I never go to the SBR, so I'm still not sure how I found it, but I very much agreed with the sentiments of the OP, so I kept reading and reading.

It's a good thread, imo, in that there are many more who agree with her. As far as mentioning the other thread I appeared on, I think one of the things about the Free Republic Religion Forum that bugs me the most is that men trounce on women the same way they would do so on men, and chivalry is important to keep a relationship, marriage, the whole darn country, alive, and when I see a man "bugging" a woman, and no one comes to her rescue, I might interject [however I have not hit the abuse button in almost two years]. That's just how I was raised; my father and brother always respected women just because they were women.

It doesn't bother me as much if men want to rip each other's faces off. It's a guy thing; ya know? But when women enter the conversation, there should be at least a modicum of special respect.

[boatbums]

There's a principle at stake here. It goes something like this:

But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand. (Ezekiel 33:6)

Son of man, I have made thee a watchman unto the house of Israel: therefore hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me.

When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked [man] shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.

Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul. (Ezekiel 3:17-19)

[Grateful2God]

You know, I read your reply several times: that was one really beautiful post.

men of good measure were giving of their meager rations to those worse than themselves, when the act was so useless as to be pointless - And they grew more feeble that another might live, maybe just for another hour...

Exactly. They lived for each moment, and for any kind of humanity they could show to one another. They never knew who would be next...

It was wonderful that you shared your story. Thank you! I'm so sorry. My Mom was a cancer survivor who said that the toughest things in life can either make you bitter or better. It sure sounds like you've become better, and I believe as you do: God worked through Frankl's experience, to turn the evil of the Nazis into a greater good.

Thank you! May God bless you, and His Peace continue to grow within you!

[WVKayaker]

But when women enter the conversation, there should be at least a modicum of special respect.

Hahahahahaaaaaa...

What a crock! Roman Catholics are incensed because they are challenged in their belief in absurdity, when their beliefs are compared to Scripture (the one they claim to have authored, but which we all know was given to us by the Holy Spirit's inspiration!).

Here is an egregious example of Roman Catholic idolatry. Note the bejeweled corpse is kept on display for them to seek! Just search the net for "dead catholic relics" to see so much abomination that Jesus spoke against!

Mattheew 6: 19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

[boatbums]

Speaking as a woman, I DON’T expect nor want “special” treatment from male Freepers on threads and have received my share of unchivalrous comments from FRoman Catholic men in my time here and it doesn’t bother me. Besides, seeing as most Freeper screen names are non-gender specific, how is anyone supposed to know who is or isn’t a woman? If someone wants to engage on OPEN Religion Forum threads, they had better have their spiritual armor on (see Ephesians 6) including the Shield of Faith and the Sword of the Spirit. There’s only a one-size-fits-all version of that gear!