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Churches urged to back evolution
British Broadcasting Corporation ^ | 20 February 2006 | Paul Rincon

Posted on 02/20/2006 5:33:50 AM PST by ToryHeartland

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To: Junior
All of these problems can be chalked up to the writers not knowing any better,...

They can be, but there is also another explanation.

Consider the time this was written. Consider the technology the world possessed at that time. Consider the vocabulary of that time. Much of what exists today not only didn't exist 2000 years ago, but they had no words for it. If John actually saw (in his Revelation) helicopters flying and shooting people, how do you think he would describe it?
Note: I'm not saying he did--this is just an example

If you saw creatures you had never seen before, non one had ever seen before, and there were no words for them, how would you describe them?

If you saw bats from a distance, and were not an expert on wildlife, how would you describe them?

Keep in mind that the book of Revelation (and many other prophetic books) were inspired by visions, not by God dictating words.

1,481 posted on 02/22/2006 8:02:40 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: Junior; ShadowAce

Don't forget all the stars falling to earth on judgement day (that'll be c. 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 of them. And apparently 1/3 of them already fell, swished by Lucifer's tail.


1,482 posted on 02/22/2006 8:03:16 AM PST by Thatcherite (More abrasive blackguard than SeaLion or ModernMan)
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To: Junior; Elsie; PresbyRev
You're making the unfounded assumption that what was written down is what Jesus actually said and did, and that the writers did not take any liberties in order to make specific points.

Yes, we are.

Well.... at least some of us are.

1,483 posted on 02/22/2006 8:04:02 AM PST by P-Marlowe
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To: ShadowAce
If you saw bats from a distance, and were not an expert on wildlife, how would you describe them?

One would think the Almighty wouldn't have any problem in this regard...

1,484 posted on 02/22/2006 8:05:47 AM PST by Junior (Identical fecal matter, alternate diurnal period)
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To: Thatcherite

...See how they fly like pigs from a sty, see how they run...


1,485 posted on 02/22/2006 8:08:09 AM PST by Junior (Identical fecal matter, alternate diurnal period)
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To: Junior
One would think the Almighty wouldn't have any problem in this regard...

As I said--visions, not words.

What did you think of the rest of my post? Is it reasonable?

1,486 posted on 02/22/2006 8:08:55 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ShadowAce
If you saw creatures you had never seen before, non one had ever seen before, and there were no words for them, how would you describe them? If you saw bats from a distance, and were not an expert on wildlife, how would you describe them? Keep in mind that the book of Revelation (and many other prophetic books) were inspired by visions, not by God dictating words.

By the same token couldn't it be said that the creation story of Genesis is a story that made sense to people with the level of knowledge that they had at the time? You correctly appear to be surmising that the Bible is not a modern textbook on biology, atronomy, or physics. Yet people who reject the laws and morality of the OT on the grounds that God meant those laws for one tribe at that time (I don't see a lot of stubborn & rebellious youths being stoned, or people being stoned for working on Sundays, or slavekeeping) seem to want to treat the biology and physics in it as if it were a textbook.

1,487 posted on 02/22/2006 8:09:59 AM PST by Thatcherite (More abrasive blackguard than SeaLion or ModernMan)
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To: Junior

"Not quite accurate. I actually do believe in God. However, I will not ask others to believe what I believe without verifiable, objective evidence. And, I absolutely will not take anyone else's word on the subject without that same evidence."

Will a belief in parachutes save you from a 20,000 foot jump, or do you actually have to put on the parachute?

"Every one of those denominations bases their beliefs on the same set of Scriptures and "revelation through the Holy Spirit" -- and yet they cannot agree! The only conclusion one can then draw is that such revelation is highly subjective and colored by an individuals own desires."

You've got that right. It's called apostasy. And It is rampant in Christianity. Just as the Bible tells us it would be.

As long as you rely on your own understanding, there is nothing that I or more importantly, God, can do for you. And that saddens me.


1,488 posted on 02/22/2006 8:10:40 AM PST by Search4Truth (The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.)
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To: Junior

I am the eggman.


1,489 posted on 02/22/2006 8:11:19 AM PST by Thatcherite (More abrasive blackguard than SeaLion or ModernMan)
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To: Search4Truth
As long as you rely on your own understanding, there is nothing that I or more importantly, God, can do for you. And that saddens me.p>It would much better, I presume, fo everyone to rely on your understanding.
1,490 posted on 02/22/2006 8:12:29 AM PST by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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To: ShadowAce
As I said--visions, not words. What did you think of the rest of my post? Is it reasonable?

I thought it was the inerrant word of God. Now you seem to be reducing it, when convenient, to being men's imperfect memories of their visions, filtered through their understanding at their level of knowledge. Didn't God make sure that they wrote the right thing in His Holy Book?

1,491 posted on 02/22/2006 8:15:36 AM PST by Thatcherite (More abrasive blackguard than SeaLion or ModernMan)
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To: js1138

Not my understanding my friend, God's. As given to us in the Holy Bible.

I am merely a man. But I am prepared to substantiate every point that I have put worth, with the Word of God. If I thought it would make any difference.


1,492 posted on 02/22/2006 8:17:28 AM PST by Search4Truth (The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.)
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To: Search4Truth
Will a belief in parachutes save you from a 20,000 foot jump, or do you actually have to put on the parachute?

Irrelevant. I can touch, see and experience a parachute -- as can any other objective observer. The same cannot be said of mystical experience.

As long as you rely on your own understanding, there is nothing that I or more importantly, God, can do for you. And that saddens me.

So sorry. However, my relying on anyone else's understanding of God without some sort of objective standard with which to match it should also sadden you. After all, that other's understanding could also be apostasy, as you put it.

My understanding of God has to match up with reality. If it does not, then my understanding is wrong. That is why I have rejected Scripture as being the inerrant Word of God -- because it does not match up with reality.

1,493 posted on 02/22/2006 8:17:49 AM PST by Junior (Identical fecal matter, alternate diurnal period)
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To: ShadowAce

I've also had visions and waking dreams. My recall of them later was spotty at best. Do you honestly think God would rely on such a poor method to convey such important information to mankind?


1,494 posted on 02/22/2006 8:19:30 AM PST by Junior (Identical fecal matter, alternate diurnal period)
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To: Junior
Do you honestly think God would rely on such a poor method to convey such important information to mankind?

Do you honestly believe that God's visions would be "spotty"? I would think that if God wanted a vision to be taken seriously, the person having the vision would remember it well.

1,495 posted on 02/22/2006 8:22:48 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: Search4Truth
You can find anything you want to find in Scripture, but the interpretation will be yours. Are you so ego-maniacal that you think all the disagreements over scripture for thousands of years were just waiting for you to clear it all up.
1,496 posted on 02/22/2006 8:28:12 AM PST by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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To: Thatcherite
I thought it was the inerrant word of God.

It is.

Now you seem to be reducing it, when convenient, to being men's imperfect memories of their visions, filtered through their understanding at their level of knowledge.

No. Not imperfect memories, but descriptions that people would understand. The bible is God's communication to His creation--us. In order for us to understand God, He makes things fairly simple (in relative terms). Thus He showed John what will happen. John wrote what he saw. Just because he experienced a revelation, does not mean he also experienced a magical increase in his vocabulary.

Didn't God make sure that they wrote the right thing in His Holy Book?

Yup. When Genesis says "day", it means "day." Not some metaphorical eriod of time.

1,497 posted on 02/22/2006 8:28:56 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: Junior
...pi equals three,...

I'm curious. I've not heard this one before. Can you point me to the passage about pi?

Thanks!

1,498 posted on 02/22/2006 8:30:10 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: Junior
"My understanding of God has to match up with reality. If it does not, then my understanding is wrong. That is why I have rejected Scripture as being the inerrant Word of God -- because it does not match up with reality."

Then you have made yourself a god. Which is probably mankind's favorite sin. Can you not see the arrogance of that?

You already have a god - your own understanding of reality. When the day comes when that feeble god fails and abandons you, I hope you will turn, not to religion, but to the God of all creation. All the answers you seek, you can find in the Bible, if you will only forsake the limits and arrogance of your own understanding. He will be the only One who can save you then.

Are you a good person?
1,499 posted on 02/22/2006 8:30:11 AM PST by Search4Truth (The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.)
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1500?


1,500 posted on 02/22/2006 8:37:40 AM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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