Posted on 01/21/2005 6:34:28 AM PST by P-Marlowe
The ít'is not referring to the faith, but to the grace.
It is not faith, but the grace plan of salvation that is the gift.
Below is from Calvin's Commentaries,
. For by grace are ye saved. This is an inference from the former statements. Having treated of election and of effectual calling, he arrives at this general conclusion, that they had obtained salvation by faith alone. First, he asserts, that the salvation of the Ephesians was entirely the work, the gracious work of God. But then they had obtained this grace by faith. On one side, we must look at God; and, on the other, at man. God declares, that he owes us nothing; so that salvation is not a reward or recompense, but unmixed grace. The next question is, in what way do men receive that salvation which is offered to them by the hand of God? The answer is, by faith; and hence he concludes that nothing connected with it is our own. If, on the part of God, it is grace alone, and if we bring nothing but faith, which strips us of all commendation, it follows that salvation does not come from us.
As Calvin notes, we bring the faith, which adds nothing to the grace, but only accepts it.
Faith! (Heb.11:17)
they had obtained salvation by faith alone
salvation is not a reward or recompense, but unmixed grace
in what way do men receive that salvation which is offered to them by the hand of God? The answer is, by faith
it is grace alone, and if we bring nothing but faith, which strips us of all commendation, it follows that salvation does not come from us.
That is what we say about you guys and the name it claim it salvation offered by Arminians.
Do Calvinists give the gospel? With out us you would still be going to mass Dec.. It was Calvinists that brought the gospel to Europe 1st and then the rest of the world .
By the way we send our kids into the suburbs and the inner city bible tracks... and your church does what??
No believer would hestitate in giving the gospel when asked.
So what do the tracks say?
Do they say that Christ died for the sinner or do they say maybe Christ died for you, lets step back and see if God saves you'?
I think you are the only Calvinist on these threads who has given a correct Gospel and that is because you came out of an Arminian church!
Whoever wrote that was a smart fellow!
Exactly. And as pointed out before, our differences then must come down to what kind of men/women we all are.
The Arminian simply doesn't believe that Original Sin made man incapable of choosing wisely or righteously.
But that's the point of God ordaining all of creation in the first place.
If "man" hadn't sinned, if man's nature wasn't corruptible, if man was like God, then Adam would have not sinned. He would have been an obedient, enlightened, happy and saved creature.
But God shows us that He did not create that kind of creature in the first place. He created an "imperfect" creature who was incapable of obeying God and incapable of saving himself.
This concept gets diluted into meaninglessness (and eventual heresy) if fallen man can then in any way save himself by something within himself. He can't.
Ultimately and forever, only God can save man. That's the POINT of the entire Old and New Testaments. It's the plot-line that holds all the words and characters and actions together, culminating is the magnificent climax on Calvary where God actually SHOWS us that we cannot save ourselves; HE must do it for us.
so why would God damn one and not another?
That's an eternal mystery to man. I'm content to read Scripture and know that I am not entitled to that understanding.
"For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory" -- Romans 9:15-23.
How much clearer does it have to be?
No one is prevented from believing. But all who believe do so because it is the will of God, and not the will of man.
It's just not in man to be God.
Paul didn't rise from the cross on Calvary. Abraham didn't rise from the cross on Calvary. God rose from the cross on Calvary. Only God, by His will alone, ordained by Him according to His good and Holy pleasure from before the foundation of the world.
Look at the first line of this essay -- "Jesus Christ is calling you."
Thank you, God, never. Jesus Christ is not whistling in the dark, nor pleading to strangers. He summons His sheep and they come because they know His voice. Christ did a whole lot more than "call." He suffered and died and was resurrected for all those whom the Father had given Him to gather together from before creation.
And He looses not one.
Eternal Security.
Calvin noted nothing of the sort, and you know it (because I'm assuming you read the entire paragraph you posted.)
Calvin clearly states faith is the vessel that God employs to bestow grace upon the elect.
"...in what way do men receive that salvation which is offered to them by the hand of God? The answer is, by faith; and hence he concludes that nothing connected with it is our own."
God could have said He'd draw a Valentine on our foreheads in red ink or write our names under every third rock or turn all the saved sheep day-glow green so that we'd know we were saved.
But He didn't. We know we are saved because we have faith, given to us by God alone.
Adam was created perfect.
Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
Whats that I see-Romans 9:20!
The entire Calvinistic system in a nutshell!
Evidently, getting to call people unsaved is Kosher for FR. I must remember this for future reference.
Since fortheDelcaration has declared that there are at least 4 gospels, I'm trying to figure out which one is the gospel which applies to us today. Obviously, giving great reverence to the admonition of Galatians myself, I believe in only one gospel, not many.
Perhaps he might decide to play nice and tell us which gospel is the right gospel for today.
In the service of the Lord,
Christian.
Two posts and still no Gospel.
Mysteries are shown throughout the Bible.
Are you sure we haven't missed it?
***Your view of God is no different than any Muslim.***
Actually, Arminianism is much closer to Islam than anything Reformed. Just look at what the Arminians did when they got control of England. Now, there was a pretty picture.
The Dutch Calvinists actually let the Arminians worship in their churches as they wanted to worship.
Christian.
Thanks for your research, Lex.
It perfectly explains the verse, doesn't it?
Calvin says 'if we bring nothing but the faith' and that 'we must look at God and at man'
Calvin is saying in this commentary that faith is from man, not from God.
You might not like what he is saying, but he is saying it.
That ok, you can ignore it like you ignore his comments on 2Pet.3:9 and Spurgeons comments on 1Tim.2:4.
In terms of your view of God, your view is essentially that of Islam, God is sovereign and mysterical God that acts based on subjective whim.
Still no Gospel?
God does not show partiality...and does not show favoritism. That means He acts with reason and purpose.
Already, even you have said that the choice was according to His own purpose, which means that it wasn't random, in the sense of a number generator.
***Only when they refuse to give the Gospel.***
Oh, I see. Calling me unsaved, yet again. Like I said, I didn't know that getting to call other people unsaved was Kosher. I see now that it is.
BTW, I'm still waiting for you to tell me which one of the many gospels you believe in is the correct one today. Seeing that I didn't know there were lots of them and you do, it might be nice to actually reveal which gospel is the right gospel today.
Now, I certainly don't believe in the lots of gospels that you do. I regard Galatians far too much and really do believe that any other gospel than the one the Apostles preached is really a false gospel. So, I would like to know which one of these many gospels is the correct one for today.
Since you have delcared me unsaved and you refuse to preach this gospel you think will save me, I can only conclude that you actually hate me and are actively working for my damnation. God Christian witness that would be.
In the service of the Lord,
Christian.
It seems that some are never answering questions but always full of them.
Mark 16:16 is referring to spiritual baptism, and that is the baptism that places the believer in union with Christ (1Cor.12)
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