Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

REMEMBERING MR. LINCOLN
Powerline ^ | 12 Feb 2024 | Scott Johnson

Posted on 02/12/2024 11:09:57 AM PST by Rummyfan

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 61-8081-100101-120 ... 301-305 next last
To: DiogenesLamp; fortheDeclaration

You never heard of the “Spirit of 1776”? People hadn’t heard phrases like “all Men are created equal ... endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, ... among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.” When they did, they were inspired to act upon that ideal.

Nobody is saying that the founders freed the slaves with the Declaration or that they intended to do so at the time. Rather, the Delaration set a standard that they tried to live up to later.

People argue about interpreting the Constitution because one argument can impose very different real world conditions. We’re not talking about that here. We’re talking about the inspiration that people got from the document.


81 posted on 02/13/2024 9:08:48 AM PST by x
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 80 | View Replies]

To: DiogenesLamp; BroJoeK; jmacusa; x; PeterPrinciple
"Not in 1776 they didn't."

Yes, they did. Prior to 1776 as well. It was internationally known.

New audiobook release: Reflections on the rise, progress, and probable consequences of the present contentions with the colonies

In answer to this objection, it may be asked, where did this infamous commerce originate? Where is it still carried on with all the eagerness which avarice can inspire? Where, but in England? By what means can it be abolished? Surely by that power alone, which America acknowledges the parent state, may justly exercise over all her dominions, viz. the power of regulating their trade. The legislatures of some of the colonies have done what they could to put a stop to the importation of African slaves, by loading it with the heaviest duties: And others have attempted the total abolition of it, by acts of assembly which their governors refused to pass.

You can read it, or you can listen to it. But its time for you to drop the act. No more theatrics. Give the Founding Fathers what the Founding Fathers are due.

82 posted on 02/13/2024 9:12:38 AM PST by ProgressingAmerica (The historians must be stopped. They're destroying everything.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 80 | View Replies]

To: ProgressingAmerica
There were forces at work trying to curtail slavery before 1776, but this is a very different thing from saying the governments of the colonies were concerned about slavery in their affirmation of the Declaration of Independence.

They were absolutely *NOT* concerned about slavery when their representatives signed the Declaration of Independence.

They were *ONLY* concerned about the right to leave the Union and form their own government. (A Confederacy.)

Again, I will say linking slavery to the Declaration of Independence in 1776 is dishonest.

It wasn't about slavery, it was about *INDEPENDENCE*.

83 posted on 02/13/2024 9:23:47 AM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 82 | View Replies]

To: DiogenesLamp

That’s not how it was. The only two colonies who refused were South Carolina and Georgia. All of the rest were on board.

That’s 11 to 2, in case you needed numbers.

Why is this so important to you that you’ll go to such great lengths as to ignore the 11?


84 posted on 02/13/2024 10:22:33 AM PST by ProgressingAmerica (The historians must be stopped. They're destroying everything.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 83 | View Replies]

To: ProgressingAmerica
That’s not how it was. The only two colonies who refused were South Carolina and Georgia. All of the rest were on board.

I am pretty sure you are mixing up the US Constitution (1787) with the Declaration of Independence. (1776.)

If you have evidence that 11 states were more concerned about slavery when they signed the Declaration of Independence (1776) than they were about their own freedom from England, I will be fascinated to look at it.

Now let's remember that Lincoln was referring to 1776 (Declaration of Independence) and not 1787. (Constitutional Convention.)

85 posted on 02/13/2024 10:30:10 AM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 84 | View Replies]

To: cowboyusa
He most certainly was.

He most certainly wasn't.

86 posted on 02/13/2024 11:06:37 AM PST by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 78 | View Replies]

To: jmacusa
Jefferson Davis was a vain man who held public grudges against anyone who opposed him. His own wife called him a ‘’nervous dyspeptic by habit'' and he sought to impose his will on anyone, including Southerners who opposed him, John Minor Botts chief among them. Fulminate all you want Reb. The balance sheet still comes up as your side having lost the war it started. Making you and your ilk losers by extension.

Nobody said he was a perfect person. I freely acknowledge he had his faults just like everybody else. That said, he was far less oppressive than Lincoln who started the war thinking it would be easy. Deal with it Yank.

87 posted on 02/13/2024 11:08:20 AM PST by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 76 | View Replies]

To: DiogenesLamp
Q: "Why is this so important to you that you’ll go to such great lengths as to ignore the 11?"

A: (No Response)

This likely means that whatever motivation you have, it would sound terribly silly and ridiculous if you actually let people know what it was.

88 posted on 02/13/2024 11:13:21 AM PST by ProgressingAmerica (The historians must be stopped. They're destroying everything.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 85 | View Replies]

To: FLT-bird

From Freeper Ls’s book: The Confederate Government: 1. Raised Taxes to a 20th Century Degree. 2. Caused massive hyperinflatuon. 3. Nationalized Railroads,mills, clothing,salt and Telegraph lines. 4. Government buricrats confiscated food and other items. 5. By 1863, the Confedracy was employing 70000 civilian buricrats!


89 posted on 02/13/2024 11:14:43 AM PST by cowboyusa (YESHUA IS KING OF AMERICA! DEATH TO MARXISM AND GFLOBALISM ! AMERICA, COWBOY UP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: DiogenesLamp

See post 89.


90 posted on 02/13/2024 11:16:04 AM PST by cowboyusa (YESHUA IS KING OF AMERICA! DEATH TO MARXISM AND GFLOBALISM ! AMERICA, COWBOY UP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 71 | View Replies]

To: FLT-bird

The Confederacy was the world’s 1st Socalist State.


91 posted on 02/13/2024 11:16:42 AM PST by cowboyusa (YESHUA IS KING OF AMERICA! DEATH TO MARXISM AND GFLOBALISM ! AMERICA, COWBOY UP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: FLT-bird

See also, “War Socalism, and the Confederate defeat.”


92 posted on 02/13/2024 11:19:32 AM PST by cowboyusa (YESHUA IS KING OF AMERICA! DEATH TO MARXISM AND GFLOBALISM ! AMERICA, COWBOY UP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 86 | View Replies]

To: cowboyusa
The Confederacy was the world’s 1st Socalist State.

Absolutely laughable BS.

93 posted on 02/13/2024 11:22:15 AM PST by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 91 | View Replies]

To: FLT-bird

Take it up with freeper LS, and with the Libertrian Miles Inatitute. “Facts are stubborn things.” John Adams.


94 posted on 02/13/2024 11:39:49 AM PST by cowboyusa (YESHUA IS KING OF AMERICA! DEATH TO MARXISM AND GFLOBALISM ! AMERICA, COWBOY UP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 93 | View Replies]

To: cowboyusa
Take it up with freeper LS, and with the Libertrian Miles Inatitute. “Facts are stubborn things.” John Adams.

The Ludwig von Mises Institute has repeatedly outlined how tyrannical Lincoln was. You might want to check who the current head of the Von Mises institute is.

95 posted on 02/13/2024 12:02:59 PM PST by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 94 | View Replies]

To: FLT-bird

All that may be true, but they point out that the Conf3deracy was Socalist, and tyrannical.


96 posted on 02/13/2024 12:08:39 PM PST by cowboyusa (YESHUA IS KING OF AMERICA! DEATH TO MARXISM AND GFLOBALISM ! AMERICA, COWBOY UP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 95 | View Replies]

To: cowboyusa
All that may be true, but they point out that the Conf3deracy was Socalist, and tyrannical.

And they point out Lincoln was worse.

97 posted on 02/13/2024 12:49:21 PM PST by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies]

To: ProgressingAmerica
A: (No Response)

This likely means that whatever motivation you have, it would sound terribly silly and ridiculous if you actually let people know what it was.

Don't be dishonest. I asked you a question as to whether this "11" you refer to is in the context of 1776, or 1787.

You are the one that has given (No Response).

Let me ask again.

At what time did these "11" states object to slavery? Was it 1776, or 1787?

98 posted on 02/13/2024 1:26:23 PM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 88 | View Replies]

To: x
You never heard of the “Spirit of 1776”?

Yes. It's associated with American Independence. What I have *NEVER* heard is that the "Spirit of 76" has anything to do with slavery.

People hadn’t heard phrases like “all Men are created equal ... endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, ... among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.”

Well I agree with this, but that inspiration did not manifest into action until *AFTER* 1776, at least not for most of the people in the states. I think there were some that gave up their slaves shortly after the Declaration was issued, but the vast majority did not.

When they did, they were inspired to act upon that ideal.

Yes they were, and I have long said that Thomas Jefferson should be credited with planting the seed that led to the abolition of slavery. He had the most profound impact on the issue of anyone in history.

Nobody is saying that the founders freed the slaves with the Declaration or that they intended to do so at the time. Rather, the Delaration set a standard that they tried to live up to later.

There's the operative word. "Later."

This illustrates my point. Lincoln was referring to 1776, and he was doing so in the context of freeing the slaves. Nobody was trying to do that in 1776. They were trying to gain their independence from the British Union.

To try to make a document totally devoted to the right of people to have independence from their existing government, into a document glorifying the government forces for stopping independence, is dishonest. It's flim flamery.

We’re talking about the inspiration that people got from the document.

Yes, they were inspired LATER. They took action later.

In 1776 they simply wanted out of the Union.

Massachusetts didn't even abolish slavery until *AFTER* 1780. So at least four years LATER.

99 posted on 02/13/2024 1:36:42 PM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies]

To: cowboyusa
From Freeper Ls’s book: The Confederate Government: 1. Raised Taxes to a 20th Century Degree. 2. Caused massive hyperinflatuon. 3. Nationalized Railroads,mills, clothing,salt and Telegraph lines. 4. Government buricrats confiscated food and other items. 5. By 1863, the Confedracy was employing 70000 civilian buricrats!

Nothing exceptional for a nation on a wartime footing. Governments at war often do things that they would not do in peace. Look at what the US did during WWI and WWII.

100 posted on 02/13/2024 1:38:43 PM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 61-8081-100101-120 ... 301-305 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson