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Attack On Europe: Documenting Russian Equipment Losses During The 2022 Russian Invasion Of Ukraine
ORYX ^ | Since February 24, 2022 and daily | ORYX

Posted on 08/21/2023 6:01:55 AM PDT by SpeedyInTexas

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To: PIF

According to Wiki “The WCMD-ER program was cancelled in August 2006 due to poor test results and budgetary pressures.”

Obviously, Wiki isn’t the gold standard in current info. If it was indeed scrapped, I wouldn’t be surprised if the program is restarted based on lessons learned from Ukraine.


41 posted on 08/21/2023 2:56:54 PM PDT by ETCM (“There is no security, no safety, in the appeasement of evil.” — Ronald Reagan)
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To: PIF

Additionally except for France no major military has banned them, they do t have them or the systems to use them so of course if I only have a knife I want guns banned


42 posted on 08/21/2023 2:57:02 PM PDT by blitz128
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To: PIF

Agreed no circular pattern just complete coverage


43 posted on 08/21/2023 2:58:51 PM PDT by blitz128
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To: PIF

I’ll do some research and report back.


44 posted on 08/21/2023 2:59:17 PM PDT by FtrPilot
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To: PIF

Was wondering about that, makes sense. More range so aircraft have a much better chance of surviving


45 posted on 08/21/2023 3:00:30 PM PDT by blitz128
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To: blitz128
More range so aircraft have a much better chance of surviving

At this range, artillery rockets make a lot more sense. South Korea has cluster munitions. Probably a huge stockpile of them. Europe was quick to jump on the CM treaty, thinking any war with Russia would be fought on European soil. IMHO, anyone facing war with Russia, China or DPRK is crazy to surrender any military capability or advantage. Neither Russia nor China will have a moment's pause in using these, even against civilians, but they must enjoy watching their adversaries disarm themselves.

46 posted on 08/21/2023 3:39:57 PM PDT by ETCM (“There is no security, no safety, in the appeasement of evil.” — Ronald Reagan)
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To: ETCM; blitz128
IMHO, anyone facing war with Russia, China or DPRK is crazy to surrender any military capability or advantage.

I should add that Trump clearly understood this logic, and he reversed Obama's order to destroy our existing CM stockpile until suitable alternatives were developed and produced. Millions of artillery shells, hundreds of thousands of rockets and bombs. With the stroke of a pen, he saved far more rockets, bombs and artillery shells than the total we have given to Ukraine.

47 posted on 08/21/2023 4:52:47 PM PDT by ETCM (“There is no security, no safety, in the appeasement of evil.” — Ronald Reagan)
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To: SpeedyInTexas

US Embassy Minsk/US State Department earlier today:

Alert for U.S. citizens: The Lithuanian government on August 18 closed border crossings with Belarus at Tverecius/Vidzy and Sumskas/Losha. Other border crossings remain open. Do not travel to Belarus. U.S. citizens in Belarus should depart immediately.

https://twitter.com/USEmbBy/status/1693622862777618663

Probably nothing, but who knows. Maybe some additional border closures coming that would make evacuation more difficult.


48 posted on 08/21/2023 6:15:31 PM PDT by ETCM (“There is no security, no safety, in the appeasement of evil.” — Ronald Reagan)
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To: SpeedyInTexas

Quiet night for the ruble, staying under 94.


49 posted on 08/22/2023 4:32:08 AM PDT by BeauBo (Penny Ruble - soon to be remembered by Russians as the good old days. is a Master Strategist.)
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To: FtrPilot

[The problem with CBUs off of aircraft is they are not a stand-off weapon. The aircraft has to overfly the target, exposing the aircraft to all of the short range, surface to air threats, including MANPADs.]


As someone who drove fast movers for a living, what have you heard about the difference in vulnerability against MANPADS between a helo and a jet on a low level CAS mission, like the Russians are having to do, because they’re short on guided munitions? The Ukrainians lacking either combat air patrols or AWACS coverage implies they don’t really have much early warning against low level Russian sorties apart from what they can get from friendly civilians or Spec Ops people watching Russian airfields.


50 posted on 08/22/2023 8:34:28 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (My dad had a Delta 88. That was a car. It was like driving your living room)
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To: Zhang Fei; PIF; SpeedyInTexas; marcusmaximus; BeauBo; blitz128; ETCM
...what have you heard about the difference in vulnerability against MANPADS between a helo and a jet on a low level CAS mission...

That is an excellent question.

I have seen a video where a UKR MANPAD operator described what he had to do to launch a MANPAD.

He got no target information from outside sources.

He would visually acquire a target (helo or fast mover), track the target using the MANPAD optics, acquire the heat source, then launch the missile.

Process could take 10 to 20 seconds.

Helicopters would be easier due to lower airspeed.

Self protection flares could interfere with acquiring the heat source. However, if the missile is launched while tracking the target, the missile has a flare reject capability and should still hit the target.

The MANPAD operator did not discuss how they identified Friend or Foe (IFF) (Electronic vs Visual) as both sides fly MiGs and SUs.

F-16 with Aim-120s should improve the shoot down capability against the low flyers & the cruise missiles.

51 posted on 08/23/2023 5:45:51 AM PDT by FtrPilot
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