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How You Can Be Prosecuted For Unknowingly Breaking the Law
Michigan Capitol Confidential ^ | 9/24/2015 | Jack Spencer

Posted on 09/25/2015 6:45:12 AM PDT by MichCapCon

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1 posted on 09/25/2015 6:45:12 AM PDT by MichCapCon
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To: MichCapCon

“Ignorance of the law is no excuse”. Without that rule, ANYONE who commits a crime can just say, “I didn’t know...” And get off scott-free.


2 posted on 09/25/2015 6:50:11 AM PDT by FrankR
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Crimes should be obvious and not obscure.


3 posted on 09/25/2015 6:50:39 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.)
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To: MichCapCon

“I forgot armed robbery was illegal”

Steve Martin


4 posted on 09/25/2015 6:52:37 AM PDT by headstamp 2
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To: MichCapCon

I think a major problem is that there are so many darn laws... chances are we break one/more each day. I agree with Cripplecreek... laws should be obvious.


5 posted on 09/25/2015 6:52:59 AM PDT by momtothree
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To: momtothree

Correction: crimes should be obvious. (oops, my bad)


6 posted on 09/25/2015 6:53:37 AM PDT by momtothree
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To: MichCapCon

This law strikes at the heart of the proliferating “self-funded” government entities. They get their operating capital by creating mountains of conflicting regulations, some of which you can go to prison for violating. They send out an army of inspectors who can issue fines and even arrest you.

My county and city both established their own self-funded EPAs. They created regulations so inclusive that the ordinary person is often unknowingly in violation and potentially subject to fine. Once you get arrested the entire bloated bureaucracy starts feeding off your body, or, you rot in jail.


7 posted on 09/25/2015 6:53:46 AM PDT by Gen.Blather
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To: MichCapCon

Do it right, once. Place a sunset clause of 20 years over all existing laws. If law is not reenacted within that time, it’s history. And with it, all regulations and incarcerations based on that law.

The 20 years is the approximate term of a generation. This lets each generation determine the laws they want applied to them.


8 posted on 09/25/2015 6:55:30 AM PDT by RideForever (OldMainframer)
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To: FrankR

No.

This is applied to administrative rules that have been criminalized, not to the penal code.

In the example from the final paragraph, a man turns old tires into a facility (I assume with their knowledge, given the report as written). The facility is not licensed to receive tires for disposal. The man who turned the tires in is fined, despite the fact that the facility managers are responsible for the actual breach of the administrative rule.

In other words - he was fined for what someone else did.

If he surreptitiously abandoned the tires at the facility, he would still be charged - at least for littering or dumping.


9 posted on 09/25/2015 6:56:22 AM PDT by MortMan (The rule of law is now the law of rulings - Judicial, IRS, EPA...)
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To: momtothree

Yeah, this is largely about regulatory law like selling the wrong colored bunny or laying a foundation in a technical wetland. Its not something that can be used by a murder or rape defendant.


10 posted on 09/25/2015 6:58:33 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.)
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To: FrankR

And cops do get off scot free as long as they operated”in good faith” Try that for your defense next time you get a ticket.


11 posted on 09/25/2015 7:00:25 AM PDT by eastforker (Cruz for steam in 2016)
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To: Springman; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; madison10; ...
Worthy of a Michigan ping.

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Michigan legislative action thread
12 posted on 09/25/2015 7:00:39 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.)
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To: FrankR

““Ignorance of the law is no excuse”. Without that rule, ANYONE who commits a crime can just say, “I didn’t know...” And get off scott-free.”

The federal register of laws exceeds 80,000 pages - and growing.

Do you know them all?
Do you know how many you’ve violated?

Yet you think you should be found guilty?

I disagree.


13 posted on 09/25/2015 7:06:28 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "Forward lies the crown, and onward is the goal.")
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
The federal register of laws exceeds 80,000 pages - and growing.

“There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.” ― Ayn Rand

14 posted on 09/25/2015 7:11:37 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed & water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: MichCapCon

There are 2 solutions to this problem of thousands of laws being on the books, most of which NO ONE could be aware of:

1) Put automatic sunset clauses in ALL laws (yes, even for murder, rape, etc.). Require that each one be voted on SEPARATELY to be renewed. The sensible ones will be, the other ones - not so much.

2) Start arresting judges and state legislators for violations of these ridiculous laws...you’ll see action so fast that it’ll make your head spin.

Yeah, like I said, I don’t expect either solution to be implemented...but in my fantasy world, both would be and it would vastly simplify our system of laws and provide for more efficient and effective justice.


15 posted on 09/25/2015 7:12:39 AM PDT by Ancesthntr ("The right to buy weapons is the right to be free." A. E. van Vogt)
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To: JimRed

That quote popped into my head as soon as I read the headline.


16 posted on 09/25/2015 7:15:35 AM PDT by Skooz (Gabba Gabba we accept you we accept you one of us Gabba Gabba we accept you we accept you one of us)
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To: FrankR

When current Federal Law and enforced Regulations are entire libraries’ worth of books, and every one of us commits 3 or more technical felony violations of the law daily, it certainly IS a valid argument to ask “How was I to know “x” was a crime ??


17 posted on 09/25/2015 7:17:55 AM PDT by Salgak (Peace Through Superior Firepower. . . .)
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To: MichCapCon

I don’t believe this will happen.

Too large of a revenue stream to just let it go, they have a taste of that sugar and won’t give it up without a fight.

Just like traffic cameras, once the money starts rolling in no amount of fuss will get them removed.


18 posted on 09/25/2015 7:18:40 AM PDT by Abathar (Proudly posting without reading the article carefully since 2004)
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To: JimRed

So true and no longer a fiction book


19 posted on 09/25/2015 7:20:09 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "Forward lies the crown, and onward is the goal.")
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

I once asked a garage to put tubes in tubeless tires for me but the guy running the garage wouldn’t do it unless I told him that the truck was only used as a farm vehicle.

I found some brand new tires that someone had stuck an ice pick in the sidewalls and tubes were the most effective fix but its apparently illegal for a garage to do.


20 posted on 09/25/2015 7:21:22 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.)
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