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Pat Tillman's Legacy(Nation Magazine)
The Nation magazine ^ | October 20. 2006 | Kevin Tillman

Posted on 10/20/2006 4:15:44 PM PDT by Dane

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To: Dane

"Somehow back at home, support for the soldiers meant.......slapping stickers on cars,"

Those stickers always stuck me as funny, someone/somewhere made a fortune...Barnum was right...


41 posted on 10/21/2006 2:49:38 AM PDT by dakine
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To: Yossarian

Thank you. Shall withdraw.


42 posted on 10/21/2006 2:52:22 AM PDT by planetesimal (All is flux)
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To: dakine

Well I'd rather see those yellow stickers on cars, than those inane Garfield's that were popular a few years back, but go ahead and mock those people who support the troops(ala Kevin Tillman).


43 posted on 10/21/2006 2:52:38 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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To: Dane
Do you have comment about Mr. Tillman's piece or jus ad hominems against me.

I have both!

And for the record, I was just trying to help out planetesimal by pointing out that he was pouring good energy after bad.

Kevin Tillman is a guy who had his brother killed and then was lied to by our government about how that death came about. So part of his anger with the government, and thus the Bush administration, is justifiable and understandable.

But, of course, he then goes off the deep end, and a) totally forgets why we got into the Iraq War: because Saddam wouldn't live up to the critical surrender terms of the Gulf War; and b) forgets that when we process terrorists through the traditional criminal justice system, they use our system against us.

So all I can do is offer him condolences for his loss, relate to his justifiable anger over the lies told about his brother's loss, and point out how the points he makes in this piece are horribly mistaken.

But I sure won't take the Dane approach and totally misconstrue a sentence to make it look like he's beating up on kids. That would undercut our side's arguments, and enhance his. This is exactly what you are doing, what you are constantly doing, and I hope this explains why it ticks smart conservative off when you do it.

44 posted on 10/21/2006 2:56:29 AM PDT by Yossarian (Everyday, somewhere on the globe, somebody is pushing the frontier of stupidity.)
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To: Dane

A sticker on a car is trivial support...makes the owner of that vehicle feel like he/she/it is doin' something...and yes, I wish I'd had thought of the idea, so I guess I'm jealous...


45 posted on 10/21/2006 2:58:34 AM PDT by dakine
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To: Yossarian
But I sure won't take the Dane approach and totally misconstrue a sentence to make it look like he's beating up on kids. That would undercut our side's arguments, and enhance his.

How is it misconstrued? He's the one who IMO, was putting down kindergarterners contributions to support the troops.

He didn't have to put that snide remark in there, but of his own free will did. Here;s the sentnece again.

Somehow back at home, support for the soldiers meant having a five-year-old kindergartener scribble a picture with crayons and send it overseas,

Now does that above sentence sound complimentary or cynical in tone. I would say cynical, cynical in that kindergarteners "are scibbling with crayons" to support the troops.

46 posted on 10/21/2006 3:02:39 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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To: Dane

I shall now follow my own advice given to planetesimal in post #40 above.


47 posted on 10/21/2006 3:05:01 AM PDT by Yossarian (Everyday, somewhere on the globe, somebody is pushing the frontier of stupidity.)
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To: Yossarian
I shall now follow my own advice given to planetesimal in post #40 above.

That's because you know that Mr. Tillman is being condescending to his fellow Americans with snide remarks about kindergarteners scribbling pictures and stickers on the back of cars.

I can understand Mr. Tillman's anguish, but what I can't understand is why it seems he hates his fellow Americans more than the people who actually started this war and killed 3,000 innocent Americans on 9/11, the islamofascists.

48 posted on 10/21/2006 3:09:55 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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To: Dane

If Noam Chomsky were as intelligent as claimed, then he would admit having become a cult figurehead, and agree that most in the cult are cynical opportunists. But then, that's Chomsky description as well.


49 posted on 10/21/2006 3:12:29 AM PDT by Tax Government (Defeat Islamic imperialists, democrats and...)
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To: Dane; feinswinesuksass
I can't blame Kevin for speaking out to what he believes to be truth

So you are saying it is the truth of what Kevim Tillman and noam chomsky portray,that America is the force of evil in this world.


Read before you rant, Dane. Feinie's comment was quite clear.

50 posted on 10/21/2006 5:47:50 AM PDT by AnnaZ (I think so, Brain, but if we give peas a chance, won't the lima beans feel left out?)
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To: feinswinesuksass
While what his brother feels is heartrending -- and, in fact, tho' seeing two posts on this yesterday I couldn't bring myself to comment -- it will never tarnish what the sacrifice of Pat Tillman, and what he stood for, has meant to my family. Yes, he is a true American hero. (And, yes, a total and complete babe.)

My heart breaks for his family. I am sad to see the anger his brother feels. I'm saddened when anyone diminishes the heroism and robs themselves of the peace that comes with pride.

51 posted on 10/21/2006 5:53:47 AM PDT by AnnaZ (I think so, Brain, but if we give peas a chance, won't the lima beans feel left out?)
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To: EveningStar
The whole thing is horrible, and shameful. A tragedy.

But I don't think it mars the whole war effort.

52 posted on 10/21/2006 5:57:20 AM PDT by AnnaZ (I think so, Brain, but if we give peas a chance, won't the lima beans feel left out?)
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To: AnnaZ; feinswinesuksass
Read before you rant, Dane. Feinie's comment was quite clear.

Yep it was quite clear. It seems the feinswine is more influenced by who lubes up her loins(Pat Tillman was so hot) than who actually lubes up her brain.

BTW, don't get mad at me, it was feinswine who stated that {Pat Tillman was "hot").

53 posted on 10/21/2006 6:13:37 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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To: Dane; feinswinesuksass
You're really reaching here. Pat Tillman may have been a babe, but that's not why my son loves him. Feinie may acknowledge his attractiveness, but that has nothing to do with the words that come out of his brother's mouth.

Again, Feinie said, quite clearly, that it was what Tillman's brother believed to be truth, and you projected it back onto her. Cheap, and immature. And so was this post that I'm responding to.

54 posted on 10/21/2006 6:54:21 AM PDT by AnnaZ (I think so, Brain, but if we give peas a chance, won't the lima beans feel left out?)
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To: AnnaZ; feinswinesuksass
You're really reaching here. Pat Tillman may have been a babe, but that's not why my son loves him. Feinie may acknowledge his attractiveness, but that has nothing to do with the words that come out of his brother's mouth.

Please Anna, I am not a fool, Feiny made it quite clear that she is in favor of those who lube her loins(Tillman's) than those who would lube her brain.

BTW, this thread is actually quite fun, since for all of my life I've heard women complain that men think with their crotch, but when a woman is blatantly caught doing the same thing, it's no big deal.

55 posted on 10/21/2006 6:59:08 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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To: Dane
Look the guy is obviously allowing his pain to blur his judgement. I think he should be left alone to recover as best as possible at this point.

If he starts to appear as a commentator and political advocate then it will be time to debunk the myths contained in his letter.

56 posted on 10/21/2006 7:10:10 AM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Dane

Is this the same brother who went on a rant against the government at the funeral of Pat Tillman?


57 posted on 10/21/2006 7:22:48 AM PDT by daybreakcoming
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To: jwalsh07
Look the guy is obviously allowing his pain to blur his judgement. I think he should be left alone to recover as best as possible at this point.

If he starts to appear as a commentator and political advocate then it will be time to debunk the myths contained in his letter.

According to KVOA in Tuscon and the AP, it seems that Kevin Tillman was paid for this rant.

"Somehow, the more soldiers that die, the more legitimate the illegal invasion becomes," Kevin wrote on Truthdig.com, which purchased his work.
Link

Can anybody say, Soros money.

58 posted on 10/21/2006 7:43:39 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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To: Dane

I don't agree with K Tillman's opinion. I have never met the man. It sounds like he hasn't been able to deal with his borther's death.

But he did tours of duty in Afganistan and Iraq.He has earned a right to his opinion.


59 posted on 10/21/2006 7:48:08 AM PDT by Leto
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To: Leto
But he did tours of duty in Afganistan and Iraq.He has earned a right to his opinion.

As have I, being an American.

60 posted on 10/21/2006 7:49:43 AM PDT by Dane ("Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" Ronald Reagan, 1987)
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