Why America lost the "Civil War"

http://calltodecision.com/Civil%20War.html ^ | October 30, 2002 | Nat G. Rudulph

[Bigun]

The War Between the States was the second battle of the American Revolution... the Republic of America lost. Empire won and what you refer to as "the Leviathan" was born. Our Federal Government became the Central Government and so it goes.

Absolutely! Well stated!

[Aric2000]

My daughter will learn the TRUTH about the civil war.

It was a case of the federal government going beyond it's constitutionals limits,and then attacking those that dared bring it to their attention and do something about it, namely secceed from the United States and create their OWN constitutional government with more safeguards built in.

Slavery was an issue, but only after Lincoln decided that he did not have a moral reason to continue the war,and so used the slavery issue as his moral hammer to continue it.

Lincoln was a traitor to the constitution on which he took an oath. If the South had not Lost, we would NOT have the behemoth federal government we have today, slavery would have ended without allthe bloodshed, and we would be one country with the government that our founding fathers actually tried to give us.

As Benjamin Franklin said after the contitutional convention, when asked what kind of government they had decided upon. " a REPUBLIC, if you can keep it" well, we LOST it when Lincoln was voted into office and ignored the constitution in order to save it. He should have been hung as a traitor, just as Benedict Arnold was.

[stainlessbanner]

“It may be that the South won't need to rise again. It may be that all we'll have to do is remain standing while the rest of America falls.”

--Connie Ward

[stainlessbanner]

The South voted to suspend the hapeas corpus twice. The third time, President Davis' request was denied. He did not proceed, unlawfully against Congress (and the People) as his adversary chose to do.

[SandfleaCSC]

One of the more disreputable aspects of both confederate campaigns in the North were the habit of taking Northern blacks that they came across and sending them back south.

In the North??? Since the slaves in the border states weren't free (Lincoln accidentally slipped up with that Emancipation Proclamation, uh-yeah, that's the ticket) and very few major battles took place in free territory, just how do you rationalize your statement?

[agrandis]

I am not one who says that the atomic bomb was unneccesary, or a "war crime," because I think it's easy for us young whipper-snappers who didn't have to island hop, and didn't have to face Japanese children with hand grenades to say that we shouldn't have dropped the bomb. However, I do often WONDER if other, more military targets could have been selected. I am usually against conventional bombing of civilian targets, because I think it has never been proven to achieve any positive ends. Hell, even bombing military positions has been of questionable value, in my view.

All that is to say that I don't automatically condemn the decisions to drop the bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima, but I think generally speaking, it is wrong to drop bombs on civilian targets.

[pepsionice]

We can go back to 1860 and the election...and if the idiot Democrats had their meeting at some neutral point other Charleston, then they would not have splintered. The party met and a week later ended....with no presidential candidate. Douglas was the preveiling candidate and should have won easily but the Alabama delegation wanted an extreme view-platform on the new states and their being open to slavery. Douglas didn't want that...he wanted the northern state vote and could not afford to take major chances. So the Bama delegation walked out, and the next five days were total chaos....and they left. They met six weeks later in Baltimore and Douglas had all his men ready to step in...and the meeting was short...he became the Democrat candidat. However, the southern members of the party were unhappy...met at some bar down the street after this whole episode and decided to start their own Democratic party....and put Breckingridge as their man. Thus the split.

Douglas came in third place...getting almost no southern state. Breckingridge came in second...with strictly southern votes. And Lincoln won all of the north, which had grown greatly since the 1840s and they had the electorial vote advantage. Had Douglas won the initial convention and campaigned heavily in the north....he likely would won at least 3 northern states and the south...and Lincoln probably would have lost.

One must remember that the Democrats had the presidency from the early 1800s on....it was the party to be in...and certainly was the major player in southern politics. Lincoln winning the election, put the Republicans on the map and ensured their status for the next 20 years as the big player.

[wardaddy]

Political correctness was just as vile then as it is today

Man you do prefer the broadstroke don't you? I don't know where you went to school but that is pure hogwash. There was no political correctness in the public schools I attended in the 60s. "Zero" as you say.

[wardaddy]

. Besides, a lot of southern blacks had illegitimate fathers and white half brothers in the Confederate Army.

Do you have a number on that Dutch?....lol

[wardaddy]

It may be that all we'll have to do is remain standing while the rest of America falls

We don't need to wait. The rest of the country sans parts of the Mountain states and the Midwest have already fallen. We ARE what's left standing. Ever hear a FReeper in the Northeast, Kali, the Rust Belt, or the Pacific Northwest claim they are in friendly territory region-wise?

[WhiskeyPapa]

More pitiful crap from the neo-reb rant brigade.

Walt

[Aurelius]

"Your version fails in the accuracy department."

It isn't my version, it is McPherson's, whom you guys usually seem to regard as reporting directly from dictation from the Holy Ghost. You are now saying he is wrong?

[WhiskeyPapa]

Immediately, Lincoln moved to secure Maryland. Habeus corpus was suspended and Southern sympathizers arrested in Baltimore.

And all released unharmed, unlike dozens of loyal Union men in the south who were hanged simply for being loyal to Old Glory.

Walt

[Aurelius]

"More pitiful crap from the neo-reb rant brigade."

Thank you for your opinion, I assure you that I will give it the weight it deserves.

[WhiskeyPapa]

This article goes to show that might is right.

What the American Civil War shows is that, among free men, there is no appeal from the ballot to the bullet.

Walt

[WhiskeyPapa]

There were (and still are) more differences between Yankees and Southerners than between Yankees and English-speaking Canadians.

That says it all.

That's not how George Washington saw it:

"Citizens, by birth or choice, of a common country, that country has a right to concentrate your affections. The name of american, which belongs to you, in your national capacity, must always exalt the just pride of Patriotism, more than any appellation derived from local discriminations. With slight shades of difference, you have the same religion, manners, habits, and political principles. You have in a common cause fought and triumphed together; the Independence and Liberty you possess are the work of joint counsels, and joint efforts, of common dangers, sufferings, and successes."

George Washington, 9/17/96

That's more true now that it was in 1796.

Gee whiz.

It's just like someone said on FR after 9/11. "They may be Yankees, but they're OUR Yankees."

Walt

[WhiskeyPapa]

Thank you for your opinion, I assure you that I will give it the weight it deserves.

Ain't it great?

Walt

[Aurelius]

"Even the most toptalitarian government will fall if enough people stand up. You cannot hold the Germand or Russians free of guilt or responsibility for what their governments did."

This places almost impossible demands on people. They must achieve unity, they must in large numbers be willing to place their own lives on the line to achieve what they can not expect to have more than near zero probability of success. If human nature were such as to make such mass uprisings more than the very remotest possibility, authoritarian governments (including our own) such as we know today could never have arisen in the first place.