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Posts by rlmorel

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  • 'Yes means yes' standard for sexual encounters in California schools

    08/30/2014 5:17:35 AM PDT · 59 of 64
    rlmorel to BBell


  • 'Yes means yes' standard for sexual encounters in California schools

    08/30/2014 5:11:10 AM PDT · 58 of 64
    rlmorel to doug from upland

    That is the silhouette of a pencil-neck-geek if I ever saw one!

  • 'Yes means yes' standard for sexual encounters in California schools

    08/30/2014 5:10:00 AM PDT · 57 of 64
    rlmorel to doug from upland

    I forget. Is it:

    Don’t! Stop! Don’t! Stop! Don’t Stop! Don’t Stop!

    or is it:

    Don’t Stop! Don’t Stop! Don’t! Stop! Don’t! Stop!

  • Government publishes detailed instructions on how to safely roast marshmallows

    08/29/2014 7:24:54 PM PDT · 8 of 37
    rlmorel to Robwin

    Every kid worth his salt has at least one scar from a flaming marshmallow, and a story to go along with it.

    My new tagline!

  • Former Quebec teacher gets 20 months in jail for two-year sexual relationship with student

    08/29/2014 7:11:58 PM PDT · 24 of 37
    rlmorel to Pearls Before Swine

    I think many of us are in agreement on this.

  • Ben Carson Hints At 2016 Run But Says: ‘I Won’t Become A Politician’

    08/29/2014 7:01:28 PM PDT · 37 of 44
    rlmorel to Vigilanteman

    I like and respect Dr. Carson. I just don’t want to see him run. I don’t think he would be successful in politics. I simply don’t think he is suited to it temperamentally.

    I could be wrong. God knows I have been before.

  • WHITE HOUSE TO PUTIN: Don't 'Even Think About Messing Around' With The Baltics

    08/29/2014 6:49:42 PM PDT · 54 of 102
    rlmorel to Nachum

    Holy crap.

    This is both incredibly embarrassing and scary at the same time.

    I know that everybody thinks this time that they live in is the most tumultuous and dangerous in history.

    But I think any student of history would have to look at this time and think there looks to be a confluence of large events of the type that are historically significant, and have plenty of historical precedents.

    There is a shift of power going on in the world right now. There are many people around the globe who wish for a world without American influence. They may get their wish, and they may find out (to their liberal chagrin) that there are things out there that are a lot worse than America.

    There is a big money issue. We’re broke. And there isn’t anybody interested in fixing it. So, in our lifetimes, we may well see the wealthiest nation in history have a financial implosion.

    Never mind what’s going on over the Middle East.

    So, yeah. I do think these are historic times we are living in. I think they are significant, and I feel pretty strongly that history will see it the same way.

    And in the middle of all this, we have an incompetent fraud who, by the way, is also malevolent.

    “We don’t have a plan.”

    “They aren’t our enemies.”

    “...don’t even think about messing around in...”

    That last line. In dangerous, frightening, and significant times, our government issues ghetto-speak.

    It isn’t even amusing. I find it alarming.

  • What to do at Niagara Falls?(Vanity)

    08/29/2014 5:45:03 PM PDT · 61 of 80
    rlmorel to CGASMIA68

    Funny...I used to have a Golden Retriever, and the dog could be laying on her stomach sleeping, and my mother could be on the other side of the room facing in the opposite direction...and she would say in a low voice “Slowly I turned...”

    The dog’s eyes would instantly open, eyebrows popping up as she would look over, and as soon as my mom would start moving slowly to turn, the dog’s tail would start wagging, and she would begin to growl.

    By the time my mom turned all the way around, the dog was in full play mode!

  • What to do at Niagara Falls?(Vanity)

    08/29/2014 5:41:30 PM PDT · 58 of 80
    rlmorel to Squawk 8888

    She’s not a bad looking vessel...

  • The End of the Cobra Era (Israel)

    08/29/2014 2:03:06 PM PDT · 9 of 9
    rlmorel to elcid1970
    "...They were always welcome..."

    I'll bet they were...thanks for your service, FRiend.

  • Bacon Wars: Why Did the Sneakers Bistro Incident Go Viral?

    08/29/2014 7:16:53 AM PDT · 21 of 34
    rlmorel to raccoonradio
    "...She's hurting," said Decarreau, who has been in touch with the woman. "She didn't realize this is what would happen. If there's a lesson, it's that [online forums] are not the way to deliver a message to an individual or agency. You need to reach out directly to people..."

    She, and people like her, aren't hurting enough, as is the dipstick who took the sign down.

    When the idiot woman complained, the owner should have just said, "Hey,it's bacon, breakfast food, we serve it here and we're just having fun with it."

    But instead, in that liberal fever-swamp (which I used to love before it turned into this) the dummy tripped all over himself to comply.

    They both share equally in this stupidity.

  • Winchester woman finds 3ft wasp nest on bed

    08/29/2014 2:57:07 AM PDT · 24 of 24
    rlmorel to bjc

    I’ll see if I can find it...thanks for the tip!

  • Fort Hood shooter says he wants to become ‘citizen’ of Islamic State caliphate

    08/28/2014 8:05:53 PM PDT · 29 of 57
    rlmorel to castlegreyskull

    Because we don’t give people like that firing squads in a just world.

    Either a hangman’s noose or a short kick out of a high helicopter.

    Why this guy still draws air says as much about the degradation of America as anything I can think of.

  • Winchester woman finds 3ft wasp nest on bed

    08/28/2014 8:00:21 PM PDT · 14 of 24
    rlmorel to doorgunner69

    Just got a new car last week. On Sunday, my wife and I were driving up to the beach, taking on its first long trip, a beautiful day. All windows down.

    Driving north on Route 1, a hornet flies into the car and lands on my thigh.

    Normally, this isn’t cause to wreck a new car, but I don’t like having the damn thing sitting there, so I swipe at it.

    I miss, and to my horror, the damned thing flies up the leg of my shorts.

    I am now butt-off-the-seat, swiping at my shorts with one hand as my butt gyrates in the seat at high speed, and “F**K! F**K! F**K!” coming out of my mouth.

    The damn thing stung me three times on the back of my thigh where it meets the buttock. Felt like having a lit cigarette touched to your leg.

    I like honeybees and even bumblebees (though I have a story about them) but wasps and hornets, I eradicate them with prejudice and without mercy any time I see them.

  • Guy Saves Hundreds By Displaying Homemade “Ginger Discount” Card At Local Businesses

    08/28/2014 2:18:11 PM PDT · 21 of 33
    rlmorel to SpinnerWebb

    Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha! That made me involuntarily snort!

  • (Hillary) Clinton breaks Ferguson silence

    08/28/2014 2:12:17 PM PDT · 3 of 17
    rlmorel to Zakeet

    I have been waiting with worms on my tongue just to see what the Pant Suit had to say about this.

  • Neighbors urge Japan to stick to history

    08/28/2014 3:28:21 AM PDT · 19 of 20
    rlmorel to Netz

    There are people who think if you are an anti-communist, then you are some kind of ideologically based, right-wing, paranoid, nut-job.

    There is far more innocent blood on the hands of the communists throughout history than any other single entity with the single possible exceptions of certain religions.

  • Whatever you think of Rogers Waters’ music, his anti-Israeli propaganda is offensive

    08/28/2014 3:16:30 AM PDT · 60 of 76
    rlmorel to Squawk 8888

    I hate that liberal rat SOB.

    I used to really enjoy the music of Pink Floyd. I listened to their work all the time.

    Back in 2004, I went to a Roger Waters concert. I was in a large group of 10-15 people, all good friends.

    In retrospect, I should have seen what was coming, but...I didn’t.

    It turned into a 3 hour political audiovisual tirade against Bush, neocons, conservatives and Israel, with some music mixed in. It looked like Code Pink put together the slide and video shows they had going on.

    I didn’t want to ruin the evening for the people I went with, but I was steaming mad. I grit my teeth and sat there. At the end of the “concert”, they released a 40 foot high ballon of a pig with “F*ck Bush” on one side and “Vote Democrat” on the other.

    I have been unable to listen to any Pink Floyd music since then. It STILL pisses me off.

  • Neighbors urge Japan to stick to history

    08/28/2014 3:06:49 AM PDT · 17 of 20
    rlmorel to Netz

    Japan was, without a doubt, pretty evil from 1936 to 1945.

    But, for bloodthirsty evil, they are pikers when it comes to murder when compared to China.

    Until China “sticks to history” and acknowledges the deaths of 30-60 million of their own citizens by their own hands, I don’t want to hear anything issue from their pie-holes about the evil that others have done.

  • Mayor: Adult Illegal Aliens With 'Graying' Hair Enrolled in Public Schools

    08/27/2014 2:06:23 PM PDT · 7 of 54
    rlmorel to Hojczyk
    "...She added that the federal government will not allow school officials to verify their ages..."

    Because that just might be considered age discrimination.

    Insanity. Complete insanity.

  • Dealing Honestly with ‘White Privilege’: What do people mean when they evoke the term?

    08/27/2014 10:28:11 AM PDT · 64 of 73
    rlmorel to dfwgator

    That is true as well.

    When people blame issues on “white flight” inferring that white people leave an area simply because they are racist and don’t want to live in proximity to blacks, and that is the root of the problem, it blames the symptom, not the cause.

    It is really a sore spot with me.

  • Dealing Honestly with ‘White Privilege’: What do people mean when they evoke the term?

    08/27/2014 9:39:22 AM PDT · 53 of 73
    rlmorel to Gumdrop

    Right...see my post at #51.

    Good post, by the way.

  • Dealing Honestly with ‘White Privilege’: What do people mean when they evoke the term?

    08/27/2014 9:38:19 AM PDT · 51 of 73
    rlmorel to SoFloFreeper

    Excellent post. I agree 100% with the entirety, especially that she needs to read Thomas Sowell.

    That comment by Megyn Kelly about “white flight” being the problem is irritating and disturbing.

    In his books, Sowell covers the issue of businesses that leave black urban areas because...surprise surprise, they can’t do business there.

    They have to pay for extra physical infrastructure based security, they have to pay for extra human-based security, they have to deal with increased levels of crime, theft, etc. and all of that does not happen for free.

    They won’t have good inventory or sales environment.

    Someone has to pay for it, and if you pass it on to the customer, it means they are going to shop in a non-crime area for things with lower prices. Granted, they have to drive or take a bus to get there, but they will. Your business will go into a death spiral until you go out of business or move somewhere else.

    Or, there will be a BS event like what has taken place in Ferguson, and you will lose your business through vandalism and tribal warfare, and will be lucky to escape penniless with your life and health intact.

    At that point you will be branded a racist because you don’t want to support the black community.

    When I hear someone talk about “white flight” in the context that is is the fault of the people fleeing and not the culture/mindset/business environment that makes them flee, it really pisses me off.

  • Elephants dance to violin music

    08/27/2014 9:21:22 AM PDT · 14 of 21
    rlmorel to John S Mosby

    Very cool.

  • Attorney and Cop Scuffle after Traffic Stop (video)

    08/26/2014 9:52:44 AM PDT · 19 of 40
    rlmorel to DariusBane

    What you say is true. And there is something to be said for civil disobedience when it is called for.

    However, I did not think it was called for in this case, and I thought the driver was simply being a jerk.

    I believe in treating people with courtesy and respect by default, unless they have demonstrated in some way they are not going to reciprocate, as this person clearly did.

    Also, I believe that when you are carrying a weapon, you have a higher responsibility to avoid escalating situations, even if it means you have to go against your natural inclinations in a given situation to do so.

    I am not pro or anti-police. I believe that most of them are trying to do their job the best that they can, and on each end of the curve, there are people who shouldn’t be in law enforcement. In this case, I thought the officer was being courteous.

    And I say this as someone who swore at a Connecticut State Trooper and threatened to lay down in front of my car to prevent it from being towed. (I think I was fully justified in my behavior and anger, and it was quite different than the one in the video. And I wasn’t carrying a weapon.)

  • Nicki Minaj Is Worse for Young Girls’ Morals Than Madonna Ever Was

    08/26/2014 3:51:53 AM PDT · 27 of 34
    rlmorel to Morgana

    I always thought she was beautiful.


  • WH Snubbed US General and Margaret Thatcher’s Funerals, Sending 3 Officials to Michael Brown’s

    08/24/2014 2:21:43 PM PDT · 30 of 33
    rlmorel to EBH

    This is a thug who robbed a store and assaulted a police officer.

    What on earth is our government doing sending “representatives” the the funeral of the thug?

    Never mind. No need to ask that.

  • WH Snubbed US General and Margaret Thatcher’s Funerals, Sending 3 Officials to Michael Brown’s

    08/24/2014 2:19:47 PM PDT · 29 of 33
    rlmorel to jazusamo

    Completely unsurprising and totally expected.

    I have got to the point I cannot even generate an eye-roll anymore.

    If it hurts this country, they will do it. That is the only predictive metric one needs to consider to see what is coming in any situation.

  • Why I Take the Death of Michael Brown Personally.

    08/24/2014 6:29:13 AM PDT · 48 of 68
    rlmorel to Smokin' Joe

    I think Bill Whittle is the most eloquent and direct conservative voice today.

    He is not afraid to call it as it is.

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/24/2014 6:06:31 AM PDT · 91 of 109
    rlmorel to octex

    Funny how you can have your own name for your ship, but other people generally know better than to use it. I was on the Kennedy, and everyone, even outsiders, called her “The Big John”.

    We used it as a toilet-based reference, but outsiders and the brass who used it clearly didn’t mean it an epithet the way we did!

    Some of the nicknames of ships were funny (even if some were tragic in their origin, like “ForrestFire”)

    I recall “Sinkin’ Sara” and others...

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/24/2014 6:02:14 AM PDT · 90 of 109
    rlmorel to Chode

    Thanks! This is interesting...and irritating too.

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/24/2014 6:01:15 AM PDT · 89 of 109
    rlmorel to octex

    V-2, eh?

    The first time I walked all the way forward during flight operations on that deck, I happened to be right by one of the bow cats when it shot, and I nearly crapped my pants. I had no idea that was what it sounded like right next to it without ear protection!

    (I was doing that thing on the ship when you are new, where you just start walking around to see where you can go...and happened to walk right up there)

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/24/2014 5:57:29 AM PDT · 88 of 109
    rlmorel to octex

    And, thanks for serving!

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/24/2014 5:56:49 AM PDT · 87 of 109
    rlmorel to octex

    OMG...I spent a week on the Rosie back in the mid-seventies on exercises down in the Carribean, and it was pretty bad. She was very advanced in years at that point.

    LOL...I always wondered why someone thought they could put sleeping quarters below the flight deck right there, but...they were wiser than I. They knew that people would simply get used to it...and we did, didn’t we?

  • Why I Take the Death of Michael Brown Personally.

    08/24/2014 5:52:20 AM PDT · 41 of 68
    rlmorel to PGalt; real saxophonist; jocon307; F15Eagle; Organic Panic; ImNotLying; Cowboy Bob; Kozak; ...

    Check out the link at #40 I posted. Pass it on (if you think it is worthy)

  • Why I Take the Death of Michael Brown Personally.

    08/24/2014 5:41:31 AM PDT · 40 of 68
    rlmorel to 2ndDivisionVet
    Bill Whittle in his recent opinion piece highlighted why I find the entire Ferguson "incident" so offensive. It perfectly frames the reality of the situation. (this is the transcript below, the video may be watched at (at Ben Shapiro's Truth Revolt)

    I must admit that, after reading this, I do have the urge to insert this into every single thread about the Ferguson "incident" that I come across. I won't, but I sure want to.


    Hi everybody. I’m Bill Whittle and this is the Firewall.

    Before we get into the bigger picture – of which the ongoing rioting in Furguson, Missouri is merely a symptom – let’s just be crystal clear about something.

    IF it turns out that a police officer shot Michael Brown as he was standing still, his hands in the air, as his defenders claim, then that police officer needs to be charged with murder, and he needs to go to jail for the rest of his life.

    But that doesn’t seem like what happened at all. This story is still unfolding and new details are being revealed every day. I’m not going to speculate on how Michael Brown’s life actually came to an end. But I am going to talk about what happened before and after.

    Michael Brown has been repeatedly referred to in the media as a “gentle giant,” and an “unarmed black teen.”

    Here’s surveillance video of the gentle giant, taken a short time before the shooting, stealing a handful of cigars and then gently strong arming the store owner out of his way.

    So why is it that the Attorney General, appointed by the President of the United States of America, put intense political pressure on the Ferguson Police Department to suppress this standard, ordinary surveillance video - a video, by the way, that caused the destruction of this man’s store and left him fearing for his life. Well, we’ll get to that in a moment.

    Defenders of Michael Brown say that this is an attempt to criminalize him and therefore deflect attention from the police shooting. Really? That kind of casual violence, that sense of entitlement, that utter disrespect for the law or another human being – don’t take my word for it; the evidence is right there in front of your eyes – that attitude has nothing to do with the police claim that he was charging the officer when he was shot? This doesn’t shed some doubt on the story of a gentle, innocent, “unarmed black teen” assassinated by the police while his hands were in the air for the crime of being black?

    Let’s cut to the chase here. Spokesmen for the protestors rioting in Ferguson and St. Louis – and, in fact, a large percentage of the general population -- claim that there is an epidemic of white on black crime, of white cops shooting unarmed black teens. Is that, in fact, happening?

    According to the FBI, there were 408,217 robberies in 2009. That’s about 1100 a day, or in round numbers, about once a minute, 24 hours a day. That means a thousand times a day the police are called, a thousand times a day arrests are made and in general terms the events leading up to the shots being fired in Ferguson Missouri happen about one thousand times PER DAY.

    So if there’s this epidemic of white policemen executing innocent black males, why do we only hear about a case like this every few years? And why do most of those cases – like this one – seem to end up with extenuating circumstances? And why do the few cases that don’t have extenuating circumstances end up with the offending officers in jail? If this is an epidemic – where’s the epidemic? 30,000 commercial flights land safely each day in America. They don’t make the news either.

    So. Is there an epidemic of racial violence loose in America today?

    There is.

    According to the National Crime Victimization Survey, in 2010, 62,593 blacks were the victims of white violence. During that same year, 320,082 whites were the victims of black violence. That’s five times as many violent attacks, but that number is misleading, since the black and white populations are not the same size. When 38 million black Americans commit five times as many violent crimes on 197 million whites as they receive, what you discover is that black perpetrators violently assault White victims TWENTY-FIVE times more frequently. When it comes to a specific kind of violent crime -- aggravated assault -- the number of black on white crimes is TWO HUNDRED TIMES HIGHER than white on black crimes . Oh, there’s an epidemic of racial violence in America, all right.

    Reporter and author Colin Flaherty has taken a cold, clear-eyed view of the statistics that don’t make the news because they are suppressed by the news. He reports, for example -- again in 2010 -- the National Crime Victimization Survey reported approximately 13,000 black-on-white rapes and 39,000 black-on-white robberies – both violent crimes. The statistics show that the number of white on black rapes and violent robberies were so small that they had to be rounded to the nearest whole number, and that whole number was ZERO.

    Critics will say that I am using these statistics to justify the murder of Michael Brown. But I said at the beginning – if Michael Brown were shot in cold blood then the police officer needs to pay the price for murder. This has nothing to do with Michael Brown. This has EVERYTHING to do with the narrative that the President, the Attorney General, and all of these race hustlers are trying to create using Michael Brown.

    There is, in fact, a racial war of violence and hatred in America. Open racism is simply not tolerated in white America today, but black racism is the toxic glue that holds the progressive coalition together. Tolerance of – in fact, as we see from the events in Ferguson, open encouragement of black rage at a narrative that not only does not exist but reverses the daily outrages that do exist, is what defines modern progressivism. It is the politics of envy, anger, entitlement, lawlessness, violence and bald-faced lies.

    And of all the promises broken by this man, surely none is more heartbreaking than the one promise that got him elected in the first place: the promise of a post-racial future. He and his racist progressive cohorts can never surrender the weapon that has gotten them everything, not the least of which is personal political power and trillions of dollars of redistributed wealth. And this latest outrage in Furguson is yet another example – as if another was needed among the economic wreckage, creeping totalitarianism, and foreign-policy disasters -- that he and his leftist cohorts would rather rule over ruins than disappear into the dustbin of a healthy and healed nation.

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/23/2014 8:08:41 PM PDT · 61 of 109
    rlmorel to cva66snipe

    Hahaha some poor bastards with little hammers would do the trick!


  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/23/2014 8:06:36 PM PDT · 60 of 109
    rlmorel to USNBandit

    LOL...I had three cruises right underneath the wires...I still remember hearing the planes as they approached, then...WHAM!

    The sound of the cables running out, then hearing them retracted back into place finally going “” as they cam to rest on to top of the metal thingies that pushed them a few inches off the deck!

    Over, and over, and over again!

  • Bonhomme Richard flight deck unfit for flight operations, could delay next deployment

    08/23/2014 8:03:48 PM PDT · 58 of 109
    rlmorel to Kickass Conservative

    ""One gen-u-ine Hari Kari knife. Maybe some of you have a use for it. Feel free to pass it around."

  • Tribute to my WWII vet uncle who died yesterday

    08/23/2014 2:02:04 PM PDT · 12 of 48
    rlmorel to bkopto
    Good men. We will likely not see their kind again, may your Uncle rest in peace.

    My favorite quote about that era is from James Michener: "They will live a long time, these men of the South Pacific. They had an American quality. They, like their victories, will be remembered as long as our generatioin lives. After that, like the men of the Confederacy, they will become strangers. Longer and longer shadows will obscure them, until their Guadalcanal sounds distant on the ear like Shiloh and Valley Forge."

    And so it goes. Your uncle was one of those men.

  • Pentagon: No evidence of ISIS at border

    08/22/2014 5:28:41 PM PDT · 81 of 82
    rlmorel to jazusamo

    Well. I feel better, then.

  • 'I have to show the world there is a Briton fighting against the Islamic State'

    08/22/2014 4:48:50 PM PDT · 12 of 15
    rlmorel to cripplecreek
    "... He said most of them simply died as nazis and were given no further thought..."

    As it should have been.

  • Harry Reid apologizes to Asians over ‘Wong’ comment (Where is the media over this????)

    08/22/2014 4:35:38 PM PDT · 30 of 41
    rlmorel to Ben Mugged

    I work at a hospital, and we recently sent something to a Dr. Wong. He called us up and explained it belonged to another Dr. Wong.

    Dead seriously, he said “I’m the wrong Wong.”

    Then I broke into a big grin. And yes, he was Asian.

    Instant like and respect.

  • 'I have to show the world there is a Briton fighting against the Islamic State'

    08/22/2014 4:31:49 PM PDT · 10 of 15
    rlmorel to cripplecreek

    I have felt this way from day one. No questions asked. I find it appalling that this is not the policy.

    Nothing strikes quite so much of a symptom of how we have lost our way as this aspect of our approach to what it means to be a citizen of this country.

  • Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

    08/21/2014 7:41:09 PM PDT · 797 of 807
    rlmorel to Red Badger

    The point I was trying to make is that there is no entity or police force out there that trains people to shoot to wound (with the possible exception of Special Forces who might have specific needs to do just that for intelligence ends, and even then I am only guessing at that)

    In this case, I have to believe the officer was not shooting to kill, he was most likely just shooting to hit any part of the man advancing on him and it didn’t even enter his mind what part, be it arm, foot, or face that he might hit.

    If he could make choices like that in that compressed time frame, he is a far more capable person mentally than I could hope to be.

    That said, I did have a situation once where I was doing about 50 mph in an MG Midget in the left hand lane, and came over the crest of a hill to see a car stopped there about a few yards in front of me.

    Everything kind of stopped in my head, and I was thinking slowly, deliberately and clearly “I am going to hit this car. I can’t stop. I can’t go into the left lane as there are cars there. I can only go up over this six inch curb onto a narrow concrete apron. It’s my only choice.”

    So in the blink of an eye, I cut the wheel, smashed over the curb and came to a screeching stop with the guard rail a few inches from my door on my side, and the cars stopped in the left lane a few inches off my right door. Not a scratch on the car.

    But the thing I remember most was seeing out the corner of my eye, the posts holding up the guard rail, painted white, in slow motion going by...whiff...whiff...whiff...whiff. There was no noise of course, but when I look back on it, it was as if my mind was making its own sound effects. All this took place in the span of about three seconds.

    I have always wondered if that is what it is like for great athletes like Larry Bird or Ted Williams, where things slow down like that.

    Or what it may be like for someone like this cop who had to make the choice and pull the trigger on a huge man rushing at him. So you may be right. But my commonsense tells me it probably happened so quickly that it might be huge pieces of what was going on that he didn’t see at all. He might remember the grease stains on the front of the fat guy’s shirt, but never even saw the faces of people watching directly behind the guy rushing at him or cars whizzing by on the street just inches away.

    Strange how the human mind works.

  • Pamela Anderson, Carey Hart Slam ALS Ice Bucket Challenge in Online Rants

    08/21/2014 4:06:27 PM PDT · 21 of 32
    rlmorel to real saxophonist
    New England Patriots Ice Bucket Challenge

    And probably the last person you want holding the ice to dump is Gronk...

    He can hold a large bucket, and there might be some empties...and fulls left in that ice...:)

  • Obama's 'Post Foley' Golf Game Less About The Optics Of Leadership And More About A Disturbing

    08/21/2014 9:49:10 AM PDT · 21 of 37
    rlmorel to musicman


  • Over-Covering Ferguson

    08/21/2014 6:15:42 AM PDT · 12 of 21
    rlmorel to Jeff Head

    Very good summary, JH! Hope all is we’ll with you...

  • Over-Covering Ferguson

    08/21/2014 6:12:08 AM PDT · 9 of 21
    rlmorel to sportutegrl

    Check out Bill Whittle’s latest piece on Ferguson. It provides the appropriate context. I’ll try to provide a link later.

  • Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

    08/21/2014 2:38:20 AM PDT · 782 of 807
    rlmorel to Guenevere; Red Badger

    I found this article at The Police Firearms Officers Association webpage, and it makes a lot of sense:
    Shooting to wound
    Why shooting to wound doesn’t make sense scientifically, legally or tactically

    Force Science re-states its case in light of recent “no-kill bill” proposal

    A special report from the Force Science Institute

    Do police officers really have to kill people when they shoot them? Couldn’t they be more humane and just aim for arms or legs?

    As reported in Force Science News, New York state Senator David Paterson [D.-Harlem] pondered those questions in 2006 and concluded that officers were needlessly killing suspects. In response, he introduced legislation that would require officers to try to shoot offenders’ limbs instead of targeting locations that would more likely stop the threat but could also result in death. Paterson proposed that any officer who employed more than the minimum force necessary to stop a life-threatening suspect be charged with felony manslaughter. Law enforcement exploded in protest and Paterson withdrew the bill.

    But the battle isn’t over.

    The New York Post has just reported that Brooklyn Assembly Members Annette Robinson [D.-Bedford Stuyvesant] and Darryl Towns [D.-East New York] have introduced a “minimum force” bill that would require officers to “shoot a suspect in the arm or the leg” and to use firearms “with the intent to stop, rather than kill.”

    “When I encounter civilian response to officer-involved shootings, it’s very often ‘Why didn’t they just shoot him in the leg?’” Dr. Bill Lewinski, executive director of the Force Science Institute, told Force Science News in a 2006 interview centered on Paterson’s proposed legislation. “When civilians judge police shooting deaths-on juries, on review boards, in the media, in the community-this same argument is often brought forward. Shooting to wound is naively regarded as a reasonable means of stopping dangerous behavior.

    “In reality, this thinking is a result of ‘training by Hollywood,’ in which movie and TV cops are able to do anything to control the outcomes of events that serve the director’s dramatic interests. It reflects a misconception of real-life dynamics and ends up imposing unrealistic expectations of skill on real-life officers.”

    Vice President Joe Biden agrees. When Michael Paladino, president of New York’s Detectives Endowment Association, showed him the bill he reportedly scoffed and suggested that it be called the “John Wayne Bill” because of the unrealistic, movie-like sharpshooting skills it demands of officers.

    In light of this resurfacing of misguided “shoot-to-wound” thinking, Force Science News is reissuing a “position paper,” originally introduced following Paterson’s ‘06 proposed legislation, that discusses why shooting to wound versus shooting to stop is neither practical nor desirable as a performance standard. We hope this information proves useful to you in addressing any shoot-to-wound advocacy that may arise in your jurisdiction.


    Robinson and Towns’ bill was drafted in the wake of the controversial shooting of Sean Bell who died after New York officers fired a total of 50 rounds at him and two other men. Sen. Paterson said his proposed legislation in ‘06 was motivated by the fatal shooting in New York City of Amadou Diallo, who was struck by 19 bullets when officers mistakenly thought he was reaching for a weapon as they approached him for questioning. Paterson believed that shooting an arm or leg would tend to stop a suspect’s threatening actions, precluding the need to shoot to the head or chest, where death is more probable. By requiring only the least amount of force needed to control a suspect he apparently hoped to reduce the likelihood of “excessive” shots being fired.

    Studies by the Force Science Research Center reveal some of the practical problems with these positions. Lewinski explains some of the basics of human dynamics and anatomy and the relative risks of misses and hits:

    “Hands and arms can be the fastest-moving body parts. For example, an average suspect can move his hand and forearm across his body to a 90-degree angle in 12/100 of a second. He can move his hand from his hip to shoulder height in 18/100 of a second.

    “The average officer pulling the trigger as fast as he can on a Glock, one of the fastest- cycling semi-autos, requires 1/4 second to discharge each round.

    “There is no way an officer can react, track, shoot and reliably hit a threatening suspect’s forearm or a weapon in a suspect’s hand in the time spans involved.

    “Even if the suspect held his weapon arm steady for half a second or more, an accurate hit would be highly unlikely, and in police shootings the suspect and his weapon are seldom stationary. Plus, the officer himself may be moving as he shoots.

    “The upper arms move more slowly than the lower arms and hands. But shooting at the upper arms, there’s a greater chance you’re going to hit the suspect’s brachial artery or center mass, areas with a high probability of fatality. So where does shooting only to wound come in when even areas considered by some to ‘safe’ from fatality risk could in fact carry the same level of risk as targeting center mass?

    “Legs tend initially to move slower than arms and to maintain more static positions. However, areas of the lower trunk and upper thigh are rich with vascularity. A suspect who’s hit there can bleed out in seconds if one of the major arteries is severed, so again shooting just to wound may not result in just wounding.

    “On the other hand, if an officer manages to take a suspect’s legs out non-fatally, that still leaves the offender’s hands free to shoot. His ability to threaten lives hasn’t necessarily been stopped.”

    As to preventing so-called “overkill” from shots that are fired after a threat is neutralized, Lewinski offers these observations:

    “Twenty years ago officers were trained to ‘shoot then assess.’ They fired 1 or 2 rounds, then stopped to see the effect. This required 1/4 to 1/2 second, during which time the suspect could keep firing, if he hadn’t been incapacitated.

    “Now they’re taught to ‘shoot and assess,’ to judge the effect of their shots as they continue to fire, an on-going process. This allows the officer to continually defend himself, but because the brain is trying to do 2 things at once-shoot and assess-a very significant change in the offender’s behavior needs to take place in order for the officer to recognize the change of circumstances.

    “A suspect falling to the ground from being shot would be a significant change. But by analyzing the way people fall, we’ve determined that it takes 2/3 of a second to a full second or more for a person to fall to the ground from a standing position. And that is when they’ve been hit in a motor center that produces instant loss of muscle tension.

    “While an officer is noticing this change, he is going to continue firing if he is shooting as fast as he can under the stress of trying to save his life. On average, from the time an officer perceives a change in stimulus to the time he is able to process that and actually stop firing, 2 to 3 additional rounds will be expended.

    “Shooting beyond the moment a threat is neutralized is not a willful, malicious action in most cases. It’s an involuntary factor of human dynamics.

    “Given what science tells us about armed encounters, this most recent proposal is a fantasy, just like Paterson’s legislation before it. They would hold officers to super-human performance and punish them criminally for being unable to achieve it.”


    A shoot-to-wound mandate would “not be valid legally” because it sets a standard far beyond that established by Graham v. Connor, the benchmark U.S. Supreme Court decision on police use of force, says former prosecutor Jeff Chudwin, now chief of the Olympia Fields (IL) PD and president of the Illinois Tactical Officers Assn.

    Recognizing that violent encounters are “tense, uncertain and rapidly evolving,” the Court “does not require officers to use the least intrusive method” of forcefully controlling a threatening suspect, but “only what’s reasonable,” Chudwin explains. When an officer’s life or that of a third party appears in jeopardy, shooting can be justified as reasonable.

    By legal definition, the possible consequences of deadly force include both death and great bodily harm. “The law has never broken these two apart,” Chudwin says, which is what these proposals have tried to do. “The politicians who propose this kind of legislation are saying that police should only shoot someone just a little bit. Deadly force is not about ‘just a little bit.’ Any time you fire a firearm, there’s a substantial risk of great bodily harm or death. The law doesn’t even so much as suggest that deadly force should be just enough to wound but with no probability of death. That’s plain wrong legally and tactically, and sends the wrong message.”

    Attorney Bill Everett, a former risk-management executive, use-of-force instructor, former LEO, and Force Science National Advisory Board member, agrees. As he explains it, use of force from a legal standpoint is a matter of “proportionality,” and there are two ways to measure it: what’s necessary and what’s reasonable.

    He draws the analogy of a house being on fire. “Firefighters can pour what seems at the time to be about the right amount of water on it to stop the fire versus not using one drop more of water than necessary, even in hindsight, to put the fire out.” The former fits the “reasonable” approach, the latter is the “necessary” perspective and is the essence of the shoot-to-wound/minimal force bill.

    “When you impose a standard of strict necessity, you require officers to do a whole lot of thinking in a situation where the Supreme Court recognizes there’s not a whole lot of time to think in,” Everett declares. Under a shoot-to-wound directive, “an officer faced with a suspect running at him with a jagged bottle is expected to think about getting target acquisition on an arm or a leg, while his own life is at risk.” The hesitation it is likely to create will only heighten his risk.

    The critical issue of officer survival aside, Everett predicts that the kind of legislation proposed would “substantially expand the civil and criminal liability of police officers.” He asks, “What if an officer tries to wing a suspect and ends up hitting an innocent bystander? What about the liability there? What if an officer tries to shoot an offender’s limb but shoots him in the chest instead? How does his true intent get judged?

    “Right now under the Supreme Court’s prevailing standard lawyers and judges in a large percentage of police shootings can look at the facts and conclude that there is no basis for allowing a civil suit to go to trial. But if you change the standard, there’ll be a lot more cases going to juries to evaluate: 1) did the officer intend to wound or did he intend to kill the suspect and 2) was the suspect’s death absolutely necessary. A trial will become the rule rather than the exception.

    “Who in their right mind would become a police officer in a jurisdiction where shoot-to- wound and standards of strict necessity became the law? Those ideas may have some humanitarian appeal, but once you go beyond the Disneyish attraction and face the reality, support for this thinking has to evaporate.”


    Modern training teaches that when an officer uses deadly force the intent should be to stop the suspect’s threatening behavior as fast as possible.

    In the words of firearms trainer Ron Avery, himself a championship shooter, head of the Practical Shooting Academy and a member of the Force Science Technical Advisory Board, shooting for an assailant’s center mass is usually considered the most effective first option because the upper torso combines a concentration of vital areas and major blood vessels within the body’s largest target. “When the risk of failure is death, an officer needs the highest percentage chance of success he can get,” Everett notes.

    Shooting instead for a smaller, faster-moving arm or a leg with the intent to wound rather than to incapacitate invites a myriad of tactical dilemmas.

    For instance:

    • An officer’s survival instinct may exert an overpowering influence on target selection. “I don’t care how good a shot you are,” says Avery, “if your life is threatened you’re going to go for the surer thing first and worry about your assailant’s life being saved second. If a guy is running at me with a blade, the last thing I’m going to be thinking is ‘I’m going to shoot him in the arm.’” Hence, shooting for center mass may become a psychological default.

    • Poor shot placement is bound to increase. Even when officers are trying to shoot center mass, they often miss. Lewinski recalls a case he was involved in where an officer firing under high stress just 5 feet from an offender failed to hit him at all with the first 5 rounds and connected with the next four only because the suspect moved into his line of fire. “Hitting an arm or a leg on a moving suspect with surgical precision will be virtually impossible,” Avery asserts. “I could probably count on one hand the individuals who can make that kind of shot under the pressure of their life on the line. Expecting that level of performance by police officers on an agency-wide basis is ludicrous.” Misses may well go on to injure or kill someone else.

    • Use of certain weapons might be discouraged. “Because of the spread pattern, an officer might be precluded from grabbing a shotgun, for fear of hitting more vital areas when he tries to shoot to wound,” Everett speculates. “If the offender has a fully automatic weapon, say, should an officer be prevented from using the best defensive weapon he may have because it might have sweep or rise?”

    • “Successful” shots could be dangerous to people besides the suspect because of through-and-through penetration. “Virtually every police round today is designed to penetrate heavy clothing and 10 to 12 inches of ballistic gel,” explains Chudwin. “Rounds with that capability will penetrate even the biggest arms” and could, like misses, then travel on to hit unintended targets in the background.

    • “Successful” shots that don’t persuade an offender to quit leave the officer still in peril. When we know from street experience that even multiple center-mass hits don’t always stop determined, deranged or drugged attackers, “how many officers would be murdered by offenders who get shot in a limb and are still fully capable of shooting back?” Chudwin asks. Indeed, Avery believes that shooting an offender without incapacitating him “may just infuriate him, so he doubles his effort to kill you. There is no dependable correlation between wounding someone and making them stop.”

    • “Shooting to wound reflects a misapplication of police equipment. “Less-lethal options should be attempted only with tools designed for that purpose,” Avery says. “If you deliberately use deadly force to bring people into custody without incapacitating them, you’re using the wrong tool for that job. Also if you shoot them in the arm or leg and you destroy muscle tissue, shatter bone or destroy nerve function you have maimed that person for life. Now attorneys can play the argument of ‘cruel and unusual punishment’ and pursue punitive damages for destroying the capacity of your ‘victim’ to earn wages and so on. You don’t try to just wound people with a gun. Period.”

    The experts we consulted agreed that advocates who push a shoot-to-wound agenda appear to understand little about human dynamics, ballistics, tactics, force legalities or the challenges officers face on the street. Chudwin has found that these critics of police practices can often be enlightened if they are invited to experience force decision-making scenarios on a firearms simulator.

    Avery has a more dramatic, if fanciful, idea. “Put them in a cage with a lion,” he suggests. “Then let’s see if they shoot to wound.”

    Special thanks to Ron Barber at In the Line of Duty whose e-newsletter alerted Force Science to this recent Assembly bill.